Selling an inherited house with "houseguests"

[CardsFan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by silvor The wheels of justice are slowly turning. At $250/hr.

Ouch! But probably worth it. Also worthwhile to remind brother he is paying 1/2 (out of any inheritance).

[Gill]

I don’t see where an evection proceeding is called for. He is not a renter but is rather a trespasser. I would call the sheriff and have him arrested.
Gill

[RobbieB]

Yeah, I can see how this goes.

1) Who is this guy? My brother.
2) Whose house is it? Our father.
3) Does he have a key? Yes.
4) Was he welcome in his father's house by the owner? Yes.

I don't see the sheriff in any big hurry to toss the guy.

[Gill]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobbieB Yeah, I can see how this goes. 1) Who is this guy? My brother. 2) Whose house is it? Our father. 3) Does he have a key? Yes. 4) Was he welcome in his father's house by the owner? Yes. I don't see the sheriff in any big hurry to toss the guy.

It’s not the fathers house. It’s an asset of a trust of which the OP is trustee.
Gill

[RobbieB]

Yes, all is true.

[Hershey102]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gill I don’t see where an evection proceeding is called for. He is not a renter but is rather a trespasser. I would call the sheriff and have him arrested. Gill

The sheriff will explain that it is a civil matter and to obtain a court order which he will then serve.

[OldShooter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hershey102 The sheriff will explain that it is a civil matter and to obtain a court order which he will then serve.

And neither the court hearing nor the sheriff's services are free. Filing fee, wait for the hearing, get the judgment, pay the sheriff to serve, then pay the sheriff big bucks if he actually has to evict and store the tenant's furniture. In my experience the tenants leave a day or two before the scheduled eviction, but 45 days is a good estimate of how long this takes. YMMV

I'm a broken record: Distribute the house to the brother + boot and avoid all this.

[pacergal]

Quote:

Originally Posted by silvor The wheels of justice are slowly turning. At $250/hr.

OP--this is probably your best bet, given the circumstances.

[BubbaChris]

Quote:

Originally Posted by silvor The wheels of justice are slowly turning. At $250/hr.

That sounds like the paralegal's rate, which feels reasonable for where you are at in the process.

Have patience and I hope you find a way to get your brother onboard with something relatively painless.

Best regards,
Chris

[CountryGal]

Silvor,
I feel for you. I had a somewhat similar situation with being executrix with a non cooperating brother. He wanted to clean the house out and get it on the market within 2 months after my moms passing (before winter). He had me order a dumpster and said he would plan to help empty the house during his visit from out of state. He did come, but was too "grief stricken" to see me or help with the house. During his "stay" (at a motel), he took things from the house, some of which were mine.

I should have known it would be rocky. I initally took my brother along to interview the lawyer I would use for the estate. He questioned the lawyer on his "interests". ...meaning, he was trying to see how much he could get away with or get the lawyer on his side.

Real Estate agents I dealt with assured me that strained relations are very common with this situation. The lawyer cost bites big time and is the same rate I had. I tried to do as much as I could myself. My huge regret is hiring a lawyer with NO STAFF. The lawyer did everything himself and charged me for it. He took a beautiful spreadsheet I put together and put it into WORD, it took him hours to reformat it so it was some what presentable. There were a few other examples that ate up our money.

It took about 10 months to get the house cleaned out and readied for sale. It was a ton of work for me, my husband and daughter.

I have only spoken to my brother once in the last 10 years, when we happened to be at a family member's house at the same time. During the closing of the estate, the only time we talked was when he needed money and I had to arrange advances for his part of the inheritance. That was all we discussed and all he wanted me for. I can now see the mental health issues he has.

Wishing you all the best and looking forward to your updates.
C.

[pb4uski]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hershey102 The sheriff will explain that it is a civil matter and to obtain a court order which he will then serve.

Nah.

Quote:

Criminal trespass involves being on someone else's property without permission. But the crime isn't as simple as just being where you're not supposed to. Someone caught trespassing on another person's property can face trouble, even possibly a civil lawsuit. But trespass is first and foremost a criminal offense. Source: https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclope...ssing-law.html

[silvor]

Update and a question...

Brothers kids are still in the house and won't allow access to property for anyone.

A "heads up" letter went out from my lawyer to him saying I, as the trustee, intend to distribute the house to him once an appraisal is complete. If he refuses, eviction proceedings will start. No word from him, which I thought was odd. More on that later.

The appraisal was completed, so now the lawyer sent me a "proposal" letter telling my brother he gets the house and I get the investments on whatever date. If he does not agree with this, eviction proceedings will start. The letter clearly said "proposal". I rewrote the letter with any "proposal" language removed by simply saying on this date, the house will be distributed to you, and it is up to you what you want to do with it. I haven't heard back from the lawyer as it was late on Friday.

Previously, the lawyer agreed the trust says I can distribute like and unlike assets. Any reason why the lawyer keeps wanting this as a "proposal"? Of course I will ask the lawyer and insist the house is simply distributed and that's that. Can my brother come back at me for doing what the trust says?

Oddly, I think my brother wants the fight. He wants the eviction proceedings. That's why he just ignored the first letter. This is very typical of how he operates. Then he can sit on a barstool for the next 20 years and tell everyone how wronged we was.

[Brat]

Your brother can come back at you for anything but he needs to hire an attorney first. Work with the trust attorney to assure that the appraisal is rock solid and follow the attorney's advice to transfer title and notify your brother.

[OldShooter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by silvor Update ...

Good job and good luck.

Quote:

Originally Posted by silvor Can my brother come back at me for doing what the trust says? ...

Sure. Anyone can sue anyone for any reason. IANAL but I'm pretty sure that unless brother's attorney can prove you are somehow acting outside your duties as trustee, the trust pays all your legal bills but not his. Half-price deal for you, since half the trust's money is yours.

When DW was in the trusts and estates business, it was sometimes necessary for her to go to court and get a determination regarding ambiguous situations or language. This is fairly routine.* If there is such a question in your case, your attorney may recommend this route. Again the trust pays, or at least it always did when DW went to court as megabank trustee. She never lost a case.

*and why home-made estate plans and plans written by non-specialists are risky.

[plex]

I would not assume the worst. Basically the notice says he should refuse if he doesn't want the house, remaining silent until the end also counts as acceptance, especially since he essentially moved in.

It is unfortunate that you have to take the most official route regardless because he is acting outside of the intentions of the trust, and clearly does not understand he is paying for a substantial part of it (especially if he contests it, he will pay essentially much more than half at that point, it could even be all depending on what the judge ruled), but some people treat inheritances as something not real until they experience the conclusion of the settlement, and sometimes even past that.

[pb4uski]

Quote:

Originally Posted by silvor Update and a question... Brothers kids are still in the house and won't allow access to property for anyone. A "heads up" letter went out from my lawyer to him saying I, as the trustee, intend to distribute the house to him once an appraisal is complete. If he refuses, eviction proceedings will start. No word from him, which I thought was odd. More on that later. The appraisal was completed, so now the lawyer sent me a "proposal" letter telling my brother he gets the house and I get the investments on whatever date. If he does not agree with this, eviction proceedings will start. The letter clearly said "proposal". I rewrote the letter with any "proposal" language removed by simply saying on this date, the house will be distributed to you, and it is up to you what you want to do with it. I haven't heard back from the lawyer as it was late on Friday. Previously, the lawyer agreed the trust says I can distribute like and unlike assets. Any reason why the lawyer keeps wanting this as a "proposal"? Of course I will ask the lawyer and insist the house is simply distributed and that's that. Can my brother come back at me for doing what the trust says? Oddly, I think my brother wants the fight. He wants the eviction proceedings. That's why he just ignored the first letter. This is very typical of how he operates. Then he can sit on a barstool for the next 20 years and tell everyone how wronged we was.

I think that you are being very gracious... I would have showed up with the sheriff, kicked him out and changed the locks long ago... he has no lease, he pays no rent, he isn't a trustee... he has NO legal right to be there.

I agree with your not framing what you, as trustee, have decided as a proposal. I presume that he will at some time, just prior to transfer, sign some document that what he is receiving is in full satisfaction as a beneficiary of the trust or something along those lines... IOW, you sign that and you get the title to the house and $x in cash.

As others have said, anybody can sue anybody for anything.

BTW, it's not eviction since he has no right to be there... you have a squatter trespassing on trust property.

[silvor]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pb4uski BTW, it's not eviction since he has no right to be there... you have a squatter trespassing on trust property.

It actually is eviction in this state.

Messed up right?

[OldShooter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by plex I would not assume the worst. Basically the notice says he should refuse if he doesn't want the house, remaining silent until the end also counts as acceptance, especially since he essentially moved in.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pb4uski I think that you are being very gracious... I would have showed up with the sheriff, kicked him out and changed the locks long ago... he has no lease, he pays no rent, he isn't a trustee... he has NO legal right to be there. ...

Well, it's a little messier than that. If I understand correctly it is the brother's son who is in possession. So any eviction or trespass action would be against the son and whomever else is in possession. And I'm 99% sure that the sheriff would not take any action re a trespass complaint except pursuant to some kind of court action. IOW the sheriff department is not going to review and interpret the trust document to assess whether OP has standing or not. They'll just tell him to go get a court order.

All of this mess is ample reason for the OP to just distribute the house to the brother and let brother deal with the tenants he has illegally permitted into the house and with whatever damage they may have done.

[pb4uski]

Quote:

Originally Posted by silvor It actually is eviction in this state. Messed up right?

Yes... messed up. No lease. No rental agreement. Staying there against the owner's wishes.

Tempting to evict him and his son with a 12 gauge shotgun, but do the right thing and go through the courts.

[creekstone]

As I understand it, the assets to be distributed are:
$330k House
$380k Cash & Mutual Funds
$1m IRA

You stated the IRA had a specified beneficiary split. What is it exactly?

The cash and mutual funds don't have beneficiary designations?

And lastly, who is currently paying for the house utilities and/or ordinary repairs?