The Hidden Cost of Retiring Early

[Mulligan]

And keep in mind that most vets are not even able to enroll in VA system to begin waiting for care. Enrollment is based on a strict Priority system (e.g. service-connected disability, ex-POW's, low-income/low net worth, etc.).
VA Health Care Eligibility | Military.com

Interesting link as I never knew how the system worked or eligibility requirements. My brother served a couple tours and never has used it and I just assumed it was because he didn't put enough time in and because he was not injured. I was listening to a round table talking head discussion over the VA medical problems and one person made a comment that went unchallenged by the others and I certainly do not know it's accuracy. He said one part of the problem was too many veterans accessing the medical care system with health issues unrelated to their service time. In essence he was saying certain people using the system should not be even accessing it. I wish more had been said as I assumed it was available for all veterans of a certain length of time, and maybe somebody challenge his comment, but nothing was mentioned in support or against it either way.


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[Al in Ohio]

It's CNN - what do you expect?

I'd expect to hear that slant from Foxy News quite frankly. "Work till you die to make the rich richer"

 

[Al in Ohio]

This is a hidden cost? There was nothing secretive about health insurance when I was putting together my ER budget. The cost of having to pay for my HI premiums was roughly the same as those hidden savings in my ER budget. You know, those deeply hidden savings such as no more commutation expenses and no more FICA taxes. And this was before the ACA reduced my premiums versus what I wa paying for when I first ERed and began paying for my own HI (non-COBRA) back in 2009.

Somehow, I don't expect to see an article from that writer (if you can call him that) about all those hidden expense reductions!

Right on. Great counter comparison.

 

[nun]

I get free VA healthcare, all I have to do is wait for it... If I was on welfare, I would get it faster, and still free.

It's amazing we treat people that have never contributed a dime to society, to better health care than a veteran.

It's always interesting to compare this outlook on life with the foundations of the National Health Service in the UK which was set up to provide healthcare to everyone in the UK funded from general taxation and free at the point of service. The size or nature of a persons contribution to the country was not a criterion for the delivery of healthcare. So a penniless hobo would get the same care on the NHS as anyone else. That's something I can support. Here is the pamphlet that introduced the system to the public in England and Wales (Scotland got its own version later on). Seems a lot simpler than Obamacare.

Chatango!

 

[nun]

The VA system is under a lot of pressure. US healthcare cost inflation has gone down in the last 5 years, but the costs are still far higher than in any other nation. With so many veterans from recent wars with significant health issues and an aging population the strains on the VA will only get worse. With so many employers reducing or eliminating benefits for retirees surely the VA system should be reformed too, just as it has been for many other government and private employees and retirees. Of course the same could be said for Medicare

 

[aja8888]

Interesting link as I never knew how the system worked or eligibility requirements.

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Mulligan, as an example:

Last year I applied for VA medical benefis since I am a Vietnam era veteran who was rated as combat status. I served four years. I have an Honorable Discharge. Guess what? I didn't qualify based on the income amount and I have a legitimate medical claim, even though it was a long time ago. If I was doused with Agent Orange, I would have been considered, I suppose.

Actually, just using our SS income put me out. My BIL, who served the same time I did, but is jobless, ended up with medical benefits, free prescriptions, and a pair of $5,000 hearing aids. Good for him, he needs all they can give him for help.

I'm not crying sour grapes here, just showing how the system is unfair to veterans in some cases. I really don't care that much about not qualifying for VA benefits as I can handle my own costs and have Medicare and other insurance.

 

[nun]

I'm not crying sour grapes here, just showing how the system is unfair to veterans in some cases. I really don't care that much about not qualifying for VA benefits as I can handle my own costs and have Medicare and other insurance.

Means testing for benefits would be seen as totally fair and appropriate by many.

 

[aja8888]

Means testing for benefits would be seen as totally fair and appropriate by many.

And for those who served and put their life on the line with a promise of the availability of future VA benefits, it may not be seen as "fair".

 

[Walt34]

And for those who served and put their life on the line with a promise of the availability of future VA benefits, it may not be seen as "fair".

My thought too.

 

[Chuckanut]

I'd expect to hear that slant from Foxy News quite frankly. "Work till you die to make the rich richer"

Remember the slogan at the entrance to the death camps - Work Will Make You Free.


Sent from somewhere in the world with whatever device I can get my hands on.

 

[nun]

And for those who served and put their life on the line with a promise of the availability of future VA benefits, it may not be seen as "fair".

I agree.....but many people have had their promises of healthcare broken and given the trend towards less government spending things like VA benefits are going to be pressured. The same will likely be true for Medicare and SS. We should fight for these benefits, but many in Congress want to see them reduced.

 

[Fermion]

I am a bit with nun (or at least what I think nun is getting at). We need healthcare for everyone, not just healthcare for those who we think deserve it. Yes the people who served in the military are quite deserving of healthcare, but so are the firemen who fight the wildfires that keep those veteran's homes safe and the police who keep the neighborhood safe. The teachers are pretty important too, because without them we wouldn't have the training needed to do the other jobs. The engineers who design the body armor and vehicles are fairly important, as are the workers who assemble those.

Maybe we can just agree to deny healthcare to lawyers.

 

[robnplunder]

Maybe we can just agree to deny healthcare to lawyers.

I agree. Throw in congressmen and senators and that's a deal.

 

[nun]

I am a bit with nun (or at least what I think nun is getting at). We need healthcare for everyone, not just healthcare for those who we think deserve it. Yes the people who served in the military are quite deserving of healthcare, but so are the firemen who fight the wildfires that keep those veteran's homes safe and the police who keep the neighborhood safe. The teachers are pretty important too, because without them we wouldn't have the training needed to do the other jobs. The engineers who design the body armor and vehicles are fairly important, as are the workers who assemble those.

Maybe we can just agree to deny healthcare to lawyers.

You almost get my point. I believe a hobo is as deserving of healthcare as a firefighter or a soldier. I reject any scale of worthiness. If you are ill you should have access to healthcare irrespective of your ability to pay or what you've done in your life.

So I think the VA is good and all military retirees should have access to it. My fear is that escalating costs and the mood of Congress will start to cut into the existing VA benefits.

 

[marko]

We figured out (roughly) that between commute, lunches, clothes, "soft expense"(paying someone for minor repairs you could do yourself...if you were home), that DW and I saved about $10K each when we RE'd. Makes HI costs a wash.

 

[nun]

We figured out (roughly) that between commute, lunches, clothes, "soft expense"(paying someone for minor repairs you could do yourself...if you were home), that DW and I saved about $10K each when we RE'd. Makes HI costs a wash.

I was an MA state worker and as I retired before 55 I had the option to continue my state health insurance at the full premium. My monthly costs went from $100 to $450, but that is for excellent coverage, I pay the first $250 of tests and have no other deductible if I stay in network. I'm 80% covered out of network and have an out of pocket annual max of $5k.

My monthly premium should go back to $100 when I get to 55, but Gov. Patrick is proposing new legislation that will remove my retiree healthcare. Luckily it looks like it won't pass the MA House or Senate. So many people in the military, state workers, and private employees are having retirement benefit contracts broken by employers.

Should the type of work those people do affect whether employers are required to fulfill employment and retiree benefit contracts? Why should we be outraged at VA benefit cuts, but not a reductions to the contractual benefits of teachers or IBM retiree. Retroactive changing of any contract by one party seems un-American to me.

 

[photoguy]

Should the type of work those people do affect whether employers are required to fulfill employment and retiree benefit contracts? Why should we be outraged at VA benefit cuts, but not a reductions to the contractual benefits of teachers or IBM retiree. Retroactive changing of any contract by one party seems un-American to me.

As a side question, are the benefits explicitly spelled-out in your employment contract? All of the places I've worked had some kind of retirement benefits but I don't recall this being stated directly in my contract (only salary, equity, bonus eligibility). Usually my contract would cover things like prior IP, solicitation of employees, etc. I would also receive HR documents (at the time of job offer) stating available benefits that would include healthcare, retirement plans but this document was clearly not part of the contract (I would assume these benefits to be expected but not guaranteed).

In general the contract also had explicit penalties for breaking various terms.

However, I've never worked at a government or union employer -- I can see in these cases the individual contract might be constrained by other legal agreements.

 

[nun]

As a side question, are the benefits explicitly spelled-out in your employment contract? All of the places I've worked had some kind of retirement benefits but I don't recall this being stated directly in my contract (only salary, equity, bonus eligibility). Usually my contract would cover things like prior IP, solicitation of employees, etc. I would also receive HR documents (at the time of job offer) stating available benefits that would include healthcare, retirement plans but this document was clearly not part of the contract (I would assume these benefits to be expected but not guaranteed).

In general the contract also had explicit penalties for breaking various terms.

However, I've never worked at a government or union employer -- I can see in these cases the individual contract might be constrained by other legal agreements.

My retirement benefits are dictated by state legislation. When I was hired, and currently, the legislation requires the state to provide health insurance to retirees at the same premium as current employees. Of course the law can be rewritten......the question is should it be for current employees. I can see an argument for changing the rules for new employees...or recruits...but retrospective changing of retiree benefits is hard to justify in my mind. This is where I think anyone who wants to protect VA benefits for current military should fight equally hard for the pensions and healthcare of state workers and Megacorp retirees.

 

[travelover]

My retirement benefits are dictated by state legislation. ........

Public pensions are guaranteed by the Michigan state constitution. Tell that to the City of Detroit pensioners that lost their COLA, lost their health care and will soon take a cut in their pensions.

 

[Chuckanut]

My view has been that if the state can retroactively change its contract with its former employees, it should be able to also do that for other contracts, for example, road repair.

Dear Acme Road Repair Company, 10 years ago we paid you 5 million dollars to fix the state highway near Plainville. We now realize we paid you to much. We really could not afford to pay that amount. Please refund us one million dollars by the end of the year, or we will be forced to take legal action to seize your property and sell it. Yours truly, the State of Confusion.

Now that will never happen. What we really need is for retirement payments to be made to an individual's personally owned retirement account, controlled completely by the individual, and hopefully tax deferred or tax free. Otherwise, retirment money will always tempt politicians to be irresponsible in some way.

 

[Mulligan]

Mulligan, as an example:

Last year I applied for VA medical benefis since I am a Vietnam era veteran who was rated as combat status. I served four years. I have an Honorable Discharge. Guess what? I didn't qualify based on the income amount and I have a legitimate medical claim, even though it was a long time ago. If I was doused with Agent Orange, I would have been considered, I suppose.

Actually, just using our SS income put me out. My BIL, who served the same time I did, but is jobless, ended up with medical benefits, free prescriptions, and a pair of $5,000 hearing aids. Good for him, he needs all they can give him for help.

I'm not crying sour grapes here, just showing how the system is unfair to veterans in some cases. I really don't care that much about not qualifying for VA benefits as I can handle my own costs and have Medicare and other insurance.

I'm with you, Aja. I would have never guessed means testing was used. Back to your Bum comment concerning access to healthcare. I kind of feel bad that I think this way, and a national healthcare system would eliminate my present thinking on this, but....If your truly a bum, not working and don't feel the need to be responsible to have insurance, I don't have a problem with a hospital throwing them out on their butt. As an elderly alcoholic man who used to buy me my beer before I was 21 would always say..."You live that life, you pay that price...And I'm paying that price".


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[photoguy]

My retirement benefits are dictated by state legislation. When I was hired, and currently, the legislation requires the state to provide health insurance to retirees at the same premium as current employees. Of course the law can be rewritten......the question is should it be for current employees. I can see an argument for changing the rules for new employees...or recruits...but retrospective changing of retiree benefits is hard to justify in my mind.

Thanks for clarifying. I think ideally the rules shouldn't change but it seems like some pension systems are so poorly funded that it is like a kobayashi maru situation.

 

[nun]

Back to your Bum comment concerning access to healthcare. I kind of feel bad that I think this way, and a national healthcare system would eliminate my present thinking on this, but....If your truly a bum, not working and don't feel the need to be responsible to have insurance, I don't have a problem with a hospital throwing them out on their butt. As an elderly alcoholic man who used to buy me my beer before I was 21 would always say..."You live that life, you pay that price...And I'm paying that price".

I can't agree with this approach and belief. It goes against the Hypocratic oath and the way I believe we should treat our fellow man.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

If your truly a bum, not working and don't feel the need to be responsible to have insurance, I don't have a problem with a hospital throwing them out on their butt. As an elderly alcoholic man who used to buy me my beer before I was 21 would always say..."You live that life, you pay that price...And I'm paying that price".

Don't many "bums" have treatable mental health issues? Isn't alcoholism defined as a mental illness?

Do they also not deserve police or fire protection or be allowed to use the library, or other public services? You don't see the homeless and think there but for the grace of God go I?

 

[Mulligan]

Don't many "bums" have treatable mental health issues? Isn't alcoholism defined as a mental illness?

Do they also not deserve police or fire protection or be allowed to use the library, or other public services? You don't see the homeless and think there but for the grace of God go I?

There are no "public hospitals" around here so I can't compare them to actual public services. I never said I was right or even championing my viewpoint as I said I do in a way feel bad my thoughts are in that direction. I guess I was raised with too much Hammurabi in me and not enough Hippocrates. I would certainly support national health insurance through a VAT that hit everything. I am sure this would cost me way more than I am presently paying. And I definitely don't want to say what I think about should happen to people who drive vehicles without car insurance and cause a wreck!


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