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Old 12-13-2020, 02:53 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gumby View Post
CORRECTED TO POST #14 IN THIS THREAD


Similar to what I did last year, here is a list of important “trigger” income levels for 2021.

Thanks for posting all of this information. It will be very useful for planning purposes.

Quote:
$39,501 – Savers Credit drops from 50% to 20%

$43,001 – Savers Credit drops from 20% to 10%
I still find it amazing that a $3,501 change in income can make a $1,600 difference in a couple's tax refund. If a couple, after maxing out all their retirement contributions and savings ends up with an AGI of $39,500 or lower they get a $2,000 (50% of the $4,000) saver's credit. If they end up with an AGI over $43,001 (up to $66,000) they only get a $400 saver's credit.
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Old 12-13-2020, 03:15 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmchairMillionaire23 View Post
Thanks for posting all of this information. It will be very useful for planning purposes.



I still find it amazing that a $3,501 change in income can make a $3,600 difference in a couple's tax refund. If a couple, after maxing out all their retirement contributions and savings ends up with an AGI of $39,500 or lower they get the $4,000 saver's credit. If they end up with an AGI over $43,001 (up to $66,000) they only get a $400 saver's credit.
Wrong! The maximum contribution that can go towards the credit is $4000 for a couple. So the $39,500 couple gets a $2000 credit($4000X50%) and the $43,001 couple gets $400 credit($4000X10%). Also, it is not refundable so the lowest income people can't even get the full credit. I have had a AGI of around $15K and saved $2000+ which should be a $1000 credit but my total federal tax liability was only around $300 so that is what I got for a credit.
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Old 12-13-2020, 03:27 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmchairMillionaire23 View Post
Thanks for posting all of this information. It will be very useful for planning purposes.



I still find it amazing that a $3,501 change in income can make a $3,600 difference in a couple's tax refund. If a couple, after maxing out all their retirement contributions and savings ends up with an AGI of $39,500 or lower they get the $4,000 saver's credit. If they end up with an AGI over $43,001 (up to $66,000) they only get a $400 saver's credit.
That's not exactly how the savers credit works. It is a credit for a percentage of only the first $2000 that an individual contributes to a retirement savings account in a year.

So, for example, suppose a couple together contributed $6000 to their IRAs ($3k each). And suppose that after that IRA contribution, they had an AGI of $39,500 exactly. They are still in the 50% credit territory, but recall that the credit only applies for the first $2000 of the amount contributed to the IRA per person, not to the whole $3000. So the max credit they can claim is $2000 = $2000 per person contribution limit x 50% credit x 2 people. Now suppose that they had an AGI of $43,001. Then they are in 10% territory. So now their credit is $400 = $2000 per person contribution limit x 10% x 2 people. That's only a $1600 reduction in credit for a $3501 increase in AGI. Still ouch, but not quite as bad.

More importantly, the credit is non-refundable. So while it can reduce the tax you otherwise would owe, it does not increase your refund one penny.

There are a number of government programs that have similar "cliffs", like ACA subsidies and IRMAA surcharges. The best you can do is be aware of them.

If it gives you any comfort, you could look at the converse and say that if they had each contributed just another $1751 to their IRA that year, they would have lowered their combined AGI to $39,499 and gained $1600 in tax credit. Indeed, even if they immediately withdrew that $3502 the next year and paid the tax (they'd be in the 12% bracket) and 10% penalty, for a total cost of 22% of $3502, they would still be money ahead (to the tune of $830).
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Old 12-13-2020, 03:31 PM   #24
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Wrong!
I updated the post. I read the IRS form incorrectly, sorry. I'm not sure how that happened as the IRS makes their forms so easy for the average person to understand.
We maxed out my 401(k) and both of our IRA account contribution limits in 2019. Our tax liability was enough where the $400 (10%) went straight to our refund. Had the credit been $2,000 we might not have gotten all of the credit based on what we paid in taxes but it would have been pretty close.
For 2021 I'm planning on maxing out my 401(k) at $26,000 (I'm 50!) and maxing out my Roth IRA and the wife's traditional IRA as well as both of our HSA accounts. If I can keep my overtime worked down hopefully we can at least reach the 20% if not the 50% level next year.
Now if we can only figure out how to contribute to the wife's 403(b) account next year. The school system's retirement plans and pay stubs are the most confusing I've ever seen. Even more so than IRS documents.

Thanks again, Gumby for the post. Very valuable information!
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Old 01-12-2021, 01:04 AM   #25
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Due to the December Consolidated Appropriations Act (famous for the additional EIP2 of $600 per person), the phaseouts for the Lifetime Learning Credit are now the same as for the AOTC.

"The CAA adopts a single phaseout for both the AOTC and the LLC, effective for tax years beginning after December 31, 2020. The credits will phase out beginning at $80,000 for single filers and ending at $90,000. For joint filers, they will begin to phase at $160,000 and disappear at $180,000."

- https://www.elliottdavis.com/consoli...f-individuals/

OP needs to be updated.
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Old 01-12-2021, 07:17 AM   #26
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Due to the December Consolidated Appropriations Act (famous for the additional EIP2 of $600 per person), the phaseouts for the Lifetime Learning Credit are now the same as for the AOTC....

OP needs to be updated.
Done
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Old 01-12-2021, 01:55 PM   #27
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Gumby, thank you for the posting.
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Old 02-20-2021, 09:51 AM   #28
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Late to this, but wanted to thank you for this post, Gumby.
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Old 03-11-2021, 05:50 PM   #29
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The income limits to traditional and Roth IRA contributions are based on MAGI not taxable income. This should be corrected.
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Old 03-11-2021, 06:11 PM   #30
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The income limits to traditional and Roth IRA contributions are based on MAGI not taxable income. This should be corrected.
Good catch. I have made the change. Thanks.
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Old 03-12-2021, 01:52 PM   #31
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ACA cliff has been removed for two years, now the subsidy is based on 8.5% of income after 400% FPL.
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Old 03-12-2021, 03:53 PM   #32
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ACA cliff has been removed for two years, now the subsidy is based on 8.5% of income after 400% FPL.
I'll try to fit that in there in an understandable way.

Edit to add: Done
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Old 03-21-2021, 10:46 AM   #33
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Thanks for compiling/posting this.
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Old 03-21-2021, 10:55 AM   #34
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Could someone clarify this for me. It says $66,001+ I can not make deductible contributions to IRA. Is that total gross income or after the standard deduction meaning I could make up to around $78,500 and still contribute. What if I put $19,500 into a 401K taking my gross income down to those numbers does that count or is it before those contributions are taken out. I'm confused.
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Old 03-21-2021, 11:13 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by aaronc879 View Post
Could someone clarify this for me. It says $66,001+ I can not make deductible contributions to IRA. Is that total gross income or after the standard deduction meaning I could make up to around $78,500 and still contribute. What if I put $19,500 into a 401K taking my gross income down to those numbers does that count or is it before those contributions are taken out. I'm confused.
Per the IRS website:

If Your Filing Status Is... single or
head of household

And Your Modified AGI Is... $66,000 or less:
Then You Can Take...

a full deduction up to the amount of your contribution limit.

If Your Modified AGI Is...
more than $66,000 but less than $76,000:
Then You Can Take...

a partial deduction.

And if Your Modified AGI Is...

$76,000 or more:

no deduction.

Don't worry, pretty much everything involving the IRS needs some type of clarification.
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Old 03-21-2021, 09:52 PM   #36
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There are different MAGI's for different code sections. You need to use the MAGI for IRA contributions.

Here's what one website says - https://www.thebalance.com/how-to-ca...income-4047216 - you use for the calculation:


Start with your adjusted gross income from your 1040. Then find yourself a calculator and add back:

Any deductions you took for IRA contributions
Any deductions you took for student loan interest or tuition
Half of your self-employment tax
Passive income or loss
Excluded foreign income
Rental losses
Interest from EE savings bonds used to pay higher education expenses
Employer-paid adoption expenses
Losses from a publicly traded partnership


The standard or itemized deductions are what reduces an AGI to Taxable income, so Schedule A or the standard deduction are not relevant.
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Old 03-21-2021, 09:54 PM   #37
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Could someone clarify this for me. It says $66,001+ I can not make deductible contributions to IRA. Is that total gross income or after the standard deduction meaning I could make up to around $78,500 and still contribute. What if I put $19,500 into a 401K taking my gross income down to those numbers does that count or is it before those contributions are taken out. I'm confused.
Your 401(k) reduces your wages and creates a lower taxable wage on your tax return. So if your gross income is $78,500 and you put $19,500 in a traditional 401(k), you would have $59,000 taxable wages on your tax return. Any health insurance premiums taken out of your pay check would also likely decrease your taxable wages.
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Old 03-22-2021, 03:43 PM   #38
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What about AMT? That one is a bit confusing. How much can a single person make before hitting AMT? I never paid much attention to it before because I was never near that high of income but I may be next year.
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Old 03-22-2021, 04:03 PM   #39
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What about AMT? That one is a bit confusing. How much can a single person make before hitting AMT? I never paid much attention to it before because I was never near that high of income but I may be next year.
From the IRS document https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f6251.pdf :
This should clear things up for you... (lines 5 through 40)

Enter the amount from Form 1040 or 1040-SR, line 15, if more than zero. If Form 1040 or 1040-SR, line 15,
is zero, subtract lines 12 and 13 of Form 1040 or 1040-SR from line 11 of Form 1040 or 1040-SR and enter
the result here. (If less than zero, enter as a negative amount.) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1
2a If filing Schedule A (Form 1040), enter the taxes from Schedule A, line 7; otherwise, enter the amount from
Form 1040 or 1040-SR, line 12 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2a
b Tax refund from Schedule 1 (Form 1040), line 1 or line 8 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2b ( )
c Investment interest expense (difference between regular tax and AMT) . . . . . . . . . . . . 2c
d Depletion (difference between regular tax and AMT) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2d
e Net operating loss deduction from Schedule 1 (Form 1040), line 8. Enter as a positive amount . . . . . 2e
f Alternative tax net operating loss deduction . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2f ( )
g Interest from specified private activity bonds exempt from the regular tax . . . . . . . . . . . 2g
h Qualified small business stock, see instructions . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2h
i Exercise of incentive stock options (excess of AMT income over regular tax income) . . . . . . . . 2i
j Estates and trusts (amount from Schedule K-1 (Form 1041), box 12, code A) . . . . . . . . . . 2j
k Disposition of property (difference between AMT and regular tax gain or loss) . . . . . . . . . . 2k
l Depreciation on assets placed in service after 1986 (difference between regular tax and AMT) . . . . . 2l
m Passive activities (difference between AMT and regular tax income or loss) . . . . . . . . . . 2m
n Loss limitations (difference between AMT and regular tax income or loss) . . . . . . . . . . . 2n
o Circulation costs (difference between regular tax and AMT). . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2o
p Long-term contracts (difference between AMT and regular tax income) . . . . . . . . . . . . 2p
q Mining costs (difference between regular tax and AMT) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2q
r Research and experimental costs (difference between regular tax and AMT) . . . . . . . . . . 2r
s Income from certain installment sales before January 1, 1987 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2s ( )
t Intangible drilling costs preference . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2t
3 Other adjustments, including income-based related adjustments . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3
4 Alternative minimum taxable income. Combine lines 1 through 3. (If married filing separately and line 4 is
more than $745,200, see instructions.) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
5 Exemption.
IF your filing status is . . . . . . . . . AND line 4 is not over . . . THEN enter on line 5 . . .
Single or head of household . . . . . . . . . . . $ 518,400 . . . . . $ 72,900
Married filing jointly or qualifying widow(er) 1,036,800 . . . . . 113,400
Married filing separately . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 518,400 . . . . . 56,700
If line 4 is over the amount shown above for your filing status, see instructions.
} . . 5
6 Subtract line 5 from line 4. If more than zero, go to line 7. If zero or less, enter -0- here and on lines 7, 9, and
11, and go to line 10 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6
7 • If you are filing Form 2555, see instructions for the amount to enter.
• If you reported capital gain distributions directly on Form 1040 or 1040-SR, line 7; you reported
qualified dividends on Form 1040 or 1040-SR, line 3a; or you had a gain on both lines 15 and
16 of Schedule D (Form 1040) (as refigured for the AMT, if necessary), complete Part III on the
back and enter the amount from line 40 here.
• All others: If line 6 is $197,900 or less ($98,950 or less if married filing separately), multiply line
6 by 26% (0.26). Otherwise, multiply line 6 by 28% (0.28) and subtract $3,958 ($1,979 if
married filing separately) from the result.
} . . 7
8 Alternative minimum tax foreign tax credit (see instructions) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8
9 Tentative minimum tax. Subtract line 8 from line 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9
10 Add Form 1040 or 1040-SR, line 16 (minus any tax from Form 4972), and Schedule 2 (Form 1040), line 2.
Subtract from the result any foreign tax credit from Schedule 3 (Form 1040), line 1. If you used Schedule J
to figure your tax on Form 1040 or 1040-SR, line 16, refigure that tax without using Schedule J before
completing this line (see instructions) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 10
11 AMT. Subtract line 10 from line 9. If zero or less, enter -0-. Enter here and on Schedule 2 (Form 1040), line 1
12 Enter the amount from Form 6251, line 6. If you are filing Form 2555, enter the amount from line 3 of the
worksheet in the instructions for line 7 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 12
13 Enter the amount from line 4 of the Qualified Dividends and Capital Gain Tax Worksheet in the Instructions
for Forms 1040 and 1040-SR or the amount from line 13 of the Schedule D Tax Worksheet in the
Instructions for Schedule D (Form 1040), whichever applies (as refigured for the AMT, if necessary) (see
instructions). If you are filing Form 2555, see instructions for the amount to enter . . . . . . . . . 13
14 Enter the amount from Schedule D (Form 1040), line 19 (as refigured for the AMT, if necessary) (see
instructions). If you are filing Form 2555, see instructions for the amount to enter . . . . . . . . . 14
15 If you did not complete a Schedule D Tax Worksheet for the regular tax or the AMT, enter the amount from
line 13. Otherwise, add lines 13 and 14, and enter the smaller of that result or the amount from line 10 of
the Schedule D Tax Worksheet (as refigured for the AMT, if necessary). If you are filing Form 2555, see
instructions for the amount to enter . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 15
16 Enter the smaller of line 12 or line 15 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 16
17 Subtract line 16 from line 12 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 17
18 If line 17 is $197,900 or less ($98,950 or less if married filing separately), multiply line 17 by 26% (0.26). Otherwise,
multiply line 17 by 28% (0.28) and subtract $3,958 ($1,979 if married filing separately) from the result . . . ▶ 18
19 Enter:
• $80,000 if married filing jointly or qualifying widow(er),
• $40,000 if single or married filing separately, or
• $53,600 if head of household.
} . . 19
20 Enter the amount from line 5 of the Qualified Dividends and Capital Gain Tax Worksheet or the amount from
line 14 of the Schedule D Tax Worksheet, whichever applies (as figured for the regular tax). If you did not
complete either worksheet for the regular tax, enter the amount from Form 1040 or 1040-SR, line 15; if zero
or less, enter -0-. If you are filing Form 2555, see instructions for the amount to enter . . . . . . . 20
21 Subtract line 20 from line 19. If zero or less, enter -0- . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 21
22 Enter the smaller of line 12 or line 13 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 22
23 Enter the smaller of line 21 or line 22. This amount is taxed at 0% . . . . . . . . . . . . . 23
24 Subtract line 23 from line 22 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 24
25 Enter:
• $441,450 if single
• $248,300 if married filing separately
• $496,600 if married filing jointly or qualifying widow(er)
• $469,050 if head of household
} . . 25
26 Enter the amount from line 21 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 26
27 Enter the amount from line 5 of the Qualified Dividends and Capital Gain Tax Worksheet or the amount from
line 21 of the Schedule D Tax Worksheet, whichever applies (as figured for the regular tax). If you did not
complete either worksheet for the regular tax, enter the amount from Form 1040 or 1040-SR, line 15; if zero
or less, enter -0-. If you are filing Form 2555, see instructions for the amount to enter . . . . . . . 27
28 Add line 26 and line 27 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 28
29 Subtract line 28 from line 25. If zero or less, enter -0- . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 29
30 Enter the smaller of line 24 or line 29 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 30
31 Multiply line 30 by 15% (0.15) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ▶ 31
32 Add lines 23 and 30 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 32
If lines 32 and 12 are the same, skip lines 33 through 37 and go to line 38. Otherwise, go to line 33.
33 Subtract line 32 from line 22 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 33
34 Multiply line 33 by 20% (0.20) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ▶ 34
If line 14 is zero or blank, skip lines 35 through 37 and go to line 38. Otherwise, go to line 35.
35 Add lines 17, 32, and 33 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 35
36 Subtract line 35 from line 12 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 36
37 Multiply line 36 by 25% (0.25) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ▶ 37
38 Add lines 18, 31, 34, and 37 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 38
39 If line 12 is $197,900 or less ($98,950 or less if married filing separately), multiply line 12 by 26% (0.26).
Otherwise, multiply line 12 by 28% (0.28) and subtract $3,958 ($1,979 if married filing separately) from the result 39
40 Enter the smaller of line 38 or line 39 here and on line 7. If you are filing Form 2555, do not enter this
amount on line 7. Instead, enter it on line 4 of the worksheet in the instructions for line 7 . . . . . .

Good luck!
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Old 03-22-2021, 06:53 PM   #40
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And now you know why there is not an entry in my list. AMT is highly variable depending on your individual circumstances. The only thing that is standard is the Line 5 exemption.
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