USA Today Article: retire before 40? some people say you can

[obgyn65]

Exactly. What can this guy do on 15k a year ? Watch TV all day and walk to the free library? Sorry, but I need my retirement to be more exciting. I hope this post does not sound too presumptuous for those ER folk who live on a small budget.

Spends $15k a year. Living large.

Not for me.

 

[UserRequested]

My retirement plan:

1.) Move back home and live with momma
2.) Try to get 5% return on my investment, that would net me $25k a year

Anyone else retirement plan includes moving back in with momma?

Wish my momma was still alive. I'd move back in or she'd be staying with me.

 

[Ronnieboy]

I have to admit that I wouldn't and or couldn't live on $15k a year and live the lifestyle I/we would want, but the principle is the same.

Invest in dividend growth companies until the dividends through off enough income to pay for the yearly expenses, similar to YMOYL but with stocks instead of bonds, like ejman wrote.

Now I just have to be debt free and have a portfolio throwing off more like $80k/year

 

[arebelspy]

Almost everyone interviewed is a blogger. I am starting to think these "early retirement articles" are really just a way of getting ad revenue from blogging, in the hopes of gaining followers, actual "retirement" seems quite a bit lower and cross polination of the same groups.

When Mr Money Mustache is running a " you can meet me in an Ecuador resort", these posts of you can retire early all seems more like a gimmick to make money by myself 'cause I can't really stand other people rather than a true early retirement plan. Not much different to me than the you too can make millions in real estate just take my course, and I'll be in your city soon and see how I have retired to the good life.

Nords left posting here to sell USAA and VISA products on his blog in the hopes his blogging will earn a minimum $125 an hour. Rather than being true advice it is a marketing campaign in the hopes of fame and fortune, a nice American goal, but not retirement and lots of clicks on the VISA credit card website.

The make a valid comment on other blogs in order to promote your website is a nice way to make bologna out of SPAM.

It seems disingenuous to me to claim that those bloggers do it for the money when the two examples given are donating all profits to charity (Nords with military charities and all profits from MMM's meetup going to an Ecuador charity as well as him refusing to take even a basic speaking fee so even more can go to that charity).

Your cynical outlook must give you a very depressing life. I'm sorry.

I find an article like this in the mainstream news as nothing but positive. Even if every person in there was paid for their interview, I wouldn't care. If it puts the idea of ER in a few reader's heads and encourages them to look at their spending and become LBYM, it's a success in my mind.

YMMV. Obviously.

 

[brewer12345]

It seems disingenuous to me to claim that those bloggers do it for the money when the two examples given are donating all profits to charity (Nords with military charities and all profits from MMM's meetup going to an Ecuador charity as well as him refusing to take even a basic speaking fee so even more can go to that charity).

Your cynical outlook must give you a very depressing life. I'm sorry.

I find an article like this in the mainstream news as nothing but positive. Even if every person in there was paid for their interview, I wouldn't care. If it puts the idea of ER in a few reader's heads and encourages them to look at their spending and become LBYM, it's a success in my mind.

YMMV. Obviously.

I want to retire early so I don't end up bitter like running man.

 

[FUEGO]

This makes my plan to retire at 35 with 1.4 million seem like overkill...

Now I just need to start a blog.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

This makes my plan to retire at 35 with 1.4 million seem like overkill...

Now I just need to start a blog.

The problem with making a reality based blog is that the numbers of what it really takes are tough to achieve for most households. Any reality based ER blog would sound depressing compared to many of the popular ones out there now with their overly optimistic market return, safe withdrawal rates and potential medical cost projections.

But if you made a blog I'd read it.

 

[FUEGO]

The problem with making a reality based blog is that the numbers of what it really takes are tough to achieve for most households. Any reality based ER blog would sound depressing compared to many of the popular ones out there now with their overly optimistic market return, safe withdrawal rates and potential medical cost projections.

But if you made a blog I'd read it.

I have thought about starting a blog, since I like to write, have an overinflated sense of my own importance, and an uncanny ability to poke fun at myself.

Then there is the fact that maintaining a blog would be a little too much like work.

 

[eridanus]

I think you'll find that it's more about FI than about ER, which the article states. In other words, if you know that you can live on $15k/yr and get that from investments, it provides opportunities that you wouldn't normally have or even see.

Edit: The "compounding" argument is bunk for an ERE. Having 15 years to compound is the same regardless of whether it's 20 to 35 or 50 to 65. It's the savings rate that matters (and the subsequent spending rate that results from a high savings rate).

 

[timo2]

I want to retire early so I don't end up bitter like running man.

Me too. My DW already says work is making me crabby(er), and that I should ER sooner.

 

[timo2]

This article seemed to be the opposite of the USA Today one

Maybe We Should Retire The Word 'Retire' : NPR

 

[Alex in Virginia]

When Mr Money Mustache is running a " you can meet me in an Ecuador resort", these posts of you can retire early all seems more like a gimmick to make money by myself 'cause I can't really stand other people rather than a true early retirement plan. Not much different to me than the you too can make millions in real estate just take my course, and I'll be in your city soon and see how I have retired to the good life.

Running Man,

There's no polite way of saying this, but I'll at least keep it clean. [Mod edit] Period. (And you are WAY off base on the Ecuador thing.)

I've gone through the entire MrMoneyMustache blog, from the first post through to the present. And what's there to learn from and apply to one's own life is, to put it mildly, priceless.

As for anyone else reading this post, don't rely on Running Man's dizzing... or my endorsement either. Spend some time in the MrMoneyMustache blog and then see what you think. And I mean spend some time and pay attention to what you are reading.

And that's all I'm going to say about this.

Alex in Virginia

 

[haha]

Running Man has been on this site for many years, and he knows a lot about a lot of things. His posts are information rich, and come from his experience in markets, which not everyone has. You are way off base.

Trust the other members to make up their own minds about these more commercial blogs.

For the record, it is my opinion that they are mostly on about the same level as travel flak writing, and many wil disappear with the first lasting bear that comes along. It is wonderful however, that you seem to get so much from MMM.



Ha

 

[photoguy]

Exactly. What can this guy do on 15k a year ? Watch TV all day and walk to the free library?

I don't think it will necessarily be that bad/spartan. Most of my fun activities require some initial outlay but are free / near free otherwise. Just think about all the things that have minimal ongoing costs like camping, hiking, reading, surfing, fishing, programming, writing, volunteering, photography, gardening, cooking, origami, running, bird watching, posting on ER.org, etc.

Besides dining out, most of the expensive entertainment options that I would consider are passive activities like going to shows, sports events, museums, cable tv, etc (that are not high on my list).

I do agree though that even budget travel would be hard to do on 15k a year but I guess it's possible if you have a lot of friends / stay at campsites / like to couch surf.

 

[rbmrtn]

I don't spend much more than 15K so it certainly doable. But I don't have a travel bug like many seem to have.

 

[Bestwifeever]

Running Man has been on this site for many years, and he knows a lot about a lot of things. His posts are information rich, and come from his experience in markets, which not everyone has. You are way off base.

Trust the other members to make up their own minds about these more commercial blogs.

For the record, it is my opinion that they are mostly on about the same level as travel flak writing, and many wil disappear with the first lasting bear that comes along. It is wonderful however, that you seem to get so much from MMM.

Ha

It's been fun watching blog evolution. There are so many little blogiverses now that make up the blogosphere, not just the so-called "retirement" ones, where they morphed with the technology from being little passionate stand alone essayish sites to full-service ad-supported destinations with their own moderators, etc., and in many of them, the comments and "guest blogs" do seem to be mostly from folks with their own blogs. I guess that's the business model now. It will be fun to see what happens next.

I agree about Running Man--hi, Running Man !

 

[MichaelB]

Nice thing about the blogosphere, there's enough variety for all of us to find some that we like and others we don't.

Nice thing about our forum is the civility among forum members. Let's keep it that way.

 

[MooreBonds]

The make a valid comment on other blogs in order to promote your website is a nice way to make bologna out of SPAM.

While I haven't kept up to date on Nord's activities, I would view his angle to be a little different than the 'typical' blogger, given their household pension and other decent investments that aren't built on a [-]house of cards[/-] hope and a dream of getting 8% annual returns and are in ruins at the first hiccup along the way.

However, I do take issue (and try to always point it out when other people start threads on the subject) with MMM's assertion that the 4% is an iron-clad retirement plan for someone retiring in their early 30s, and you don't have any thing to worry about. Even when other people point it out, him and his wife seem to just ignore it, or call such realists "complainypants" without addressing the fact that a 4% SWR isn't (historically) as safe after 30 years, or the fact that it only applies to the US and Canada over the past 120 years, with other countries having (sometimes much) lower SWR.

In one thread where his wife joined in, she tried to claim that the 4% doesn't even require spending down any principal of your portfolio...but when the truth of the 4% SWR research was pointed out to her, she doesn't bother responding or following up.

The fact that the MMM types seem to diss (in his blog posts and comments) whoever brings up realistic concerns strikes me as someone who isn't trying to put forth ideas for discussion and learning, but rather is someone who puts forth a somewhat 'radical' idea to try to stand out (to gain attention), and then rejects any theories or alternative views that might jeopardize that claim, rather than taking an honest, open discussion and academic view towards it.

I realize that blogs can cost money to host/run/etc.....but I tend to favor truth and honesty, rather than what (at times) appears to be a fast-talker who claims to show interest in your well being and freedom but in reality just appears to want your traffic. Having said that, I do think that MMM does raise some very valid points on not falling for the consumption society, and presents some very interesting points on how to live a simple life with occasional splurges...but the people who say they will retire in their 30s with a $300,000 portfolio and $12k budget need a dose of realism when they find out that life can cost more than they realize when the occasional unforeseen black swan strikes.

 

[gerrym51]

I don't think it will necessarily be that bad/spartan. Most of my fun activities require some initial outlay but are free / near free otherwise. Just think about all the things that have minimal ongoing costs like camping, hiking, reading, surfing, fishing, programming, writing, volunteering, photography, gardening, cooking, origami, running, bird watching, posting on ER.org, etc.

Besides dining out, most of the expensive entertainment options that I would consider are passive activities like going to shows, sports events, museums, cable tv, etc (that are not high on my list).

I do agree though that even budget travel would be hard to do on 15k a year but I guess it's possible if you have a lot of friends / stay at campsites / like to couch surf.

I wonder how much he spends on a date when he takes out the ladies.Oh wait he probably does not date-too expensive-and hookers are not cheap.(well some are)

 

[brewer12345]

However, I do take issue (and try to always point it out when other people start threads on the subject) with MMM's assertion that the 4% is an iron-clad retirement plan for someone retiring in their early 30s, and you don't have any thing to worry about. Even when other people point it out, him and his wife seem to just ignore it, or call such realists "complainypants" without addressing the fact that a 4% SWR isn't (historically) as safe after 30 years, or the fact that it only applies to the US and Canada over the past 120 years, with other countries having (sometimes much) lower SWR.

In one thread where his wife joined in, she tried to claim that the 4% doesn't even require spending down any principal of your portfolio...but when the truth of the 4% SWR research was pointed out to her, she doesn't bother responding or following up.

The fact that the MMM types seem to diss (in his blog posts and comments) whoever brings up realistic concerns strikes me as someone who isn't trying to put forth ideas for discussion and learning, but rather is someone who puts forth a somewhat 'radical' idea to try to stand out (to gain attention), and then rejects any theories or alternative views that might jeopardize that claim, rather than taking an honest, open discussion and academic view towards it.

It is possible that this is just a genuine difference of opinion rather than an attempt at smoke and mirrors. I also think that MMM's schtick envisions people following his pied piping to continue generating income of some kind doing what they feel like doing. It is a different conception of what FI means than straight ER. There is a fair amount of chicanery or glossing over important details in his stuff, but as you say the message of frugality is worthwhile. You will not dissuade many of the younger crowd that follows him that they are not invincible, pretty much no matter what you do.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

The guy in the MMM blog is self employed, not retired. He works restoring houses and is a blogger and at some point his wife was working.

This forum is one of the few places on the Internet with realistic numbers about retiring early. Many of the people here are at least in their forties and fifties, and have a clearer understanding of health insurance and deductible costs, especially in the pre-medicare years, how much teenage kids and college cost, how accidents and chronic illnesses that max out your deductible year after year can and do happen, and we understand long term care and medical issue costs we might face before too long.

The MMM blog sells the dream, not the reality. The dream is more attractive and much easier to achieve. The reality would not have a very wide audience.

However, I do agree with much of the simple living messages. I think we get so accustomed to advertising, that sometimes the things marketers push become the new normal and an accepted way of life. Like why did I use expensive, toxic cleaning products all those years when vinegar, baking soda and essential oils are cheaper and safer? Why do I need so many cable channels? Why was I eating fast foods instead of having some simple meals in the freezer? Why don't I walk or ride my bike to the store more often? Those kind of changes have saved us a lot of money and actually made our lives healthier, not deprived in any way.

 

[REWahoo]

You will not dissuade many of the younger crowd that follows him that they are not invincible, pretty much no matter what you do.

Yep, only time can accomplish that.

 

[hausfrau]

You will not dissuade many of the younger crowd that follows him that they are not invincible, pretty much no matter what you do.

I fondly remember that feeling. Now that I'm in my 40's, my outlook has greatly changed.

 

[Bestwifeever]

....You will not dissuade many of the younger crowd that follows him that they are not invincible, pretty much no matter what you do.

Wait, I'm not? This changes everything!

 

[gerrym51]

I fondly remember that feeling. Now that I'm in my 40's, my outlook has greatly changed.

i was invincible-until i turned 50