Vanguard website frustration

[albundyz]

I'm a lurker, I rarely post here, but I'm really frustrated with Vanguard and I guess I just want to vent. Some of you might find it interesting.

I have a mixture of stocks and funds in my IRA, handled by Vanguard. 6-7 weeks ago, Vanguard made some upgrades (??) to their website. Since then, I have had many problems, usually with missing money or inaccurate data. Don't get me wrong, the values seem to correct themselves the very next day. For example, if the stock market goes up and my account balance at Vanguard goes down, it kinda piques my interest, silly me. Again, my account would be accurate the next day. I have sent numerous e-mails during the past 6 weeks. At first, the responses were "sorry, we just upgraded our website and we're still working out some problems". Sometimes my e-mails were just ignored. Well, in the past 5 days I've had two significant problems for which I am frustrated.

1. Sunday night, I log in and my account is about $50K short. I investigate and find that I own 5 stocks with no value. On Monday, the 5 stocks are back at full and accurate value. I send an e-mail......

2. Last night, (thurs nite) exceeded all my expectations. I was expecting my Wellesley fund to receive its quarterly dividend. Now, I cannot control "when" they give it to me, but I figure, at the end of the day, there's only two possible outcomes. They give me the dividend (and my balance goes up) or they don't give it to me (and my balance stays the same). I'm ok with either of these possibilities cuz I know I'll get it sometime soon. OK, apparently, Vanguard thought of a new and exciting possible outcome that I had not imagined in my wildest dreams. The third possiblility is that they could REDUCE my Wellesley fund balance by the amount of the dividend. Yes, last night, when I logged on at 9pm California time, my Wellesley fund total value was lowered by the amount of the dividend. So, I send a nasty e-mail. Friday morning, I check in at 9am Cal time and, presto, the Wellesley account is accurate. Today, I called and suggested that their IT department was either lazy or incompetent because apparently they have no idea "how" to handle timing differences and they think it's ok to display innacurate data. (in their defense, the analyst I spoke to agreed with me).

Basically, the end-of-day account balance is often different than my next morning start-of-day balance. As a result, I have a difficult time reconciling my account. I have no evidence that Vanguard has mismanaged (lost) any of my money, but it just frustrates me that I can't reconcile my account. ugh......I'm done venting, thanks, I feel better.

 

[Texas Proud]

I think the problem is the current price.... IOW, your dividend example.... the fund price went down by the amount of dividends they paid... but, the file that they need to run to REINVEST dividends had not yet run.... so, your old holding shares with the new updated price..


I do not see this as a major problem.... but you do...

 

[W2R]

Gee - - now, I'm glad that I only log into Vanguard once every month or two. Your experience with balances sounds so annoying. I have never noticed that type of inaccuracies or problems.

I haven't checked yet for my Wellesley dividend. Maybe I'll go do that, just to make sure they didn't forget to give it to me.

Edited to add: All is well, my balance is correct, and it sure looks nice with that dividend added in.

Although I check my portfolio balance every day, I usually do not actually log in unless I want to see recent dividends. Most days I just check the share price for each of my funds and from that derive my balance.

 

[foxfirev5]

I aways wait until the next day to check my account, usually around 6am. I've never had a problem. Of course I date back to the days when you had to wait until you got a quarterly statement in the mail - even before telephone account services.

 

[73ss454]

Relax and don't look at it so often. If this is the worst problem in your life, it's all good.
I'm sure Vanguard is not trying to steal any of your money.

 

[Onward]

It's good to hear these reports of problems, though. If it happens to me, I won't be completely shocked.

 

[pb4uski]

No problems here that I am aware of. Lucky I guess.

 

[Donzo]

I'm a lurker, I rarely post here, but I'm really frustrated with Vanguard and I guess I just want to vent. Some of you might find it interesting.

I have a mixture of stocks and funds in my IRA, handled by Vanguard. 6-7 weeks ago, Vanguard made some upgrades (??) to their website. Since then, I have had many problems, usually with missing money or inaccurate data. Don't get me wrong, the values seem to correct themselves the very next day. For example, if the stock market goes up and my account balance at Vanguard goes down, it kinda piques my interest, silly me. Again, my account would be accurate the next day. I have sent numerous e-mails during the past 6 weeks. At first, the responses were "sorry, we just upgraded our website and we're still working out some problems". Sometimes my e-mails were just ignored. Well, in the past 5 days I've had two significant problems for which I am frustrated.

1. Sunday night, I log in and my account is about $50K short. I investigate and find that I own 5 stocks with no value. On Monday, the 5 stocks are back at full and accurate value. I send an e-mail......

2. Last night, (thurs nite) exceeded all my expectations. I was expecting my Wellesley fund to receive its quarterly dividend. Now, I cannot control "when" they give it to me, but I figure, at the end of the day, there's only two possible outcomes. They give me the dividend (and my balance goes up) or they don't give it to me (and my balance stays the same). I'm ok with either of these possibilities cuz I know I'll get it sometime soon. OK, apparently, Vanguard thought of a new and exciting possible outcome that I had not imagined in my wildest dreams. The third possiblility is that they could REDUCE my Wellesley fund balance by the amount of the dividend. Yes, last night, when I logged on at 9pm California time, my Wellesley fund total value was lowered by the amount of the dividend. So, I send a nasty e-mail. Friday morning, I check in at 9am Cal time and, presto, the Wellesley account is accurate. Today, I called and suggested that their IT department was either lazy or incompetent because apparently they have no idea "how" to handle timing differences and they think it's ok to display innacurate data. (in their defense, the analyst I spoke to agreed with me).

Basically, the end-of-day account balance is often different than my next morning start-of-day balance. As a result, I have a difficult time reconciling my account. I have no evidence that Vanguard has mismanaged (lost) any of my money, but it just frustrates me that I can't reconcile my account. ugh......I'm done venting, thanks, I feel better.

I had the same experience yesterday - it was an up day but Wellesley was down. I went to the website and it did not show any new transaction concerning this decline. I think it's because they have to buy back in after business hours the following day - assuming you are re-investing dividends. So they can't show your new balance until purchase.

 

[Alan]

I think the problem is the current price.... IOW, your dividend example.... the fund price went down by the amount of dividends they paid... but, the file that they need to run to REINVEST dividends had not yet run.... so, your old holding shares with the new updated price..


I do not see this as a major problem.... but you do...

Exactly. I've seen this happen in the past when I used to have the dividends reinvest. No big deal imo.

 

[rescueme]

On the Wellesley front, I/DW reinvest distributions and the balances (e.g. additional shares) were posted overnight. We don't redirect the distributions to cash or reinvest in other funds.

As far as the VG site (which I use every day) I'll admit that it was a bit "quirky", but with constant use I feel comfortable with it.

 

[target2019]

At 9:30PM, my fund prices are updated, but balances appear to be lagging. Considering the market closed at 4PM, it's the end of month, and how many transactions are processed and validated after market close, I'm ok with this. There must be billions of calculations each day at Vanguard. I can wait.

 

[easysurfer]

I've had times when the business month ends on a Friday (such as tonight). When I check my balance on end of Friday, it is different than if I check it on a Sunday. This was the old site as I haven't done the checking yet since they moved over the the "updated" site.

 

[Nords]

Today, I called and suggested that their IT department was either lazy or incompetent because apparently they have no idea "how" to handle timing differences and they think it's ok to display innacurate data. (in their defense, the analyst I spoke to agreed with me).

You're buying the best IT support that your expense ratio can afford...

 

[LOL!]

The OP's issues at Vanguard have been typical ever since I have used Vanguard's web site. They really do not arise from the "upgrade", but are routine at Vanguard.

Vanguard is always one day slow with posting dividends and distributions compared to other brokers. But to be fair, Vanguard Brokerage Services and Vanguard Mutual Fund Company are not really brokers in the sense that Fidelity, Schwab, E-trade, Scottrade, TDAmeritrade and WellsFargo are brokers.

As for your shares being valued at zero, ... Please! You know that Vanguard forgot to pay the bill for getting quotes, so the quote place just returns $0.00. You can always look up the share price on another system.

Probably best is to move your money elsewhere. I can recommend WellsFargo/WellTrade where you can hold all your Vanguard stuff for free. You can buy Vanguard Signal share class funds for no commission, Vanguard Admiral share class actively-managed funds for no commission, Vanguard ETFs for no commission, Fidelity Spartan funds for no commission, stocks for no commission, etc. as long as you have the PMA package and enough assets at WF.

Or if you want a cash rebate, go to a broker that is giving cash rebates such as TDAmeritrade.

 

[Spanky]

I just checked it today, and it's up to date.

 

[sunnysideup]

Probably best is to move your money elsewhere. .

+1

I moved my money out of Vanguard after years of frustration--I feel Vanguard is set up for people who only invest in their funds. No flexibility and the phone agents were not well trained IMHO.

If you want to have stocks and other company funds, your best bet is to at least have a second brokerage acct.

 

[nwsteve]

+1

I moved my money out of Vanguard after years of frustration--I feel Vanguard is set up for people who only invest in their funds. No flexibility and the phone agents were not well trained IMHO.

If you want to have stocks and other company funds, your best bet is to at least have a second brokerage acct.

Came to the same conclusion after Fido offered a nice cash incentive to move funds. Vanguard still comfirmed its performance by failing to send Fido the basis--funds were inherited prior to the 2011 cutoff so they technically did not have to. If there is anything I have learned about Vanguard, is that they do very very little they do not have to! Guess that is the path to low expense ratios--customer be damn
Nwsteve

 

[rescueme]

If there is anything I have learned about Vanguard, is that they do very very little they do not have to! Guess that is the path to low expense ratios--customer be damn
Nwsteve

I dare you to go over to Bogleheads and say that .....

(PS: I agree with you)...

 

[73ss454]

You get what you pay for.

 

[FinanceDude]

You're buying the best IT support that your expense ratio can afford...

 

[Finance Dave]

No problems here that I am aware of. Lucky I guess.

+1, but I only check about quarterly.

 

[anethum]

When you log on to the Vanguard site in the evening and view your accounts, do you click on "Balances and holdings" link just under the total for the "Total assets" line? When I do that, the new page reflects that day's closing values for any individual stocks or ETFs I own.

I haven't encountered the "missing money" or inaccurate data that you described. It's possible that my dividends get posted a day later, however. I haven't paid close attention to that.