You can bring a horse to water, but you cannot make him drink

[Blue531]

A younger friend of mine doesn't see the point of investing money because she doesn't think she is going to live very long and thinks that is why a lot of people don't. I don't know if this is true or not, but if she feels that is the case, of course, she is free to do so. If someone doesn't deem it important, who am I to make them think otherwise? How someone can not see the value in it, is beyond me for so many reasons. Of course, we have no idea how much time we have, that is a given. But on the chances that there is a good chance I will live awhile, I am willing to forego 10% of my salary to investments. I don't think that is a big sacrifice to make. The way I see it, 10% is all we needed to invest from the time we began working until retirement to have "enough". But for other reasons younger people don't think about like having enough money gives you choices and peace of mind later at a stage in life that is beginning to wear you down. We assume when we are younger that we will always feel as good as we do then, not realizing that time changes things and nothing is guaranteed. Health issues come up or spouses or family you depended upon pass away. 10% is not so hard to do for a little insurance financially because like it or not, we exist in a world that requires money in order to survive and to provide for our basic necessities. No, we may not live very long, but what if we do.

 

[audreyh1]

This year has taught me well that people have an unbelievable variety of beliefs about their lives and the future and many have no interest in facts at all. How they survive with their decision making amazes me. But what do I know?

 

[Rianne]

We have family members who prefer to spend than save. It's not philosophical, they just spend on things, high end vacations, new furniture, expensive home/cars. They cannot RE and they are older than we are. It was a choice. They never listened to us so we stopped talking about finances.

We saved way more than 10% of our earnings over 30 years of work. I'd say more like 30%, sometimes more. We took vacations, ate out, were socially active, had a nice house...nothing extravagant. No one knows how long they will live. Everything in life is a risk of some sort. "Live below your means" is a mantra on this forum. This philosophy has worked for most of us

 

[Aerides]

Sometimes, <insert stupid sounding reason here> is what we tell others to change the subject. You could make the same arguments about diet, or exercise as well, but a lot of people just don't always want to be told You Should...

Doesn't mean she really thinks she's going to die young and not need money, might just means she's not comfortable with the discussion.

 

[Blue531]

To Rianne: A brother of mine is five years older and has spent the same and wants to take early social security but can't afford to. He fussed at me last week for not telling him what the "secret" was. I told him that if it were any consolation to him, that I've tried to help some around me but no one listens and that he wouldn't have either. Plus when I came to the profound realization of what compounded investing could do, I wasn't making much in salary and had debt so why would he have listened to me? I, too lived below my means and still had a home and two cars and took some vacations and had what I needed over the 25 years I invested. Some manage, most don't. Thanks for your comment btw!

 

[Gumby]

People who want you to tell them the secret never want to hear a story that starts with "well, about 30 years ago, I . . . ." They want the secret that will allow them to bypass those 30 years.

 

[Chuckanut]

I don't mind if some people want to work all their lives. That is their choice.

I do mind them telling me how 'lucky' I am to have retired at 62, not have car payments, etc.

 

[MRG]

Are we related? I have a sister who won't invest in anything. Talking to her is impossible. She didn't make much money so she took her SS at 62, because she needed the money while she continued working full-time. [emoji2957]

 

[Amethyst]

+100. I am sorry for a young person who has decided she doesn't have long to live. Medical issues, I presume.

My parents were old enough to be grandparents (40 and 47) when I came along. As a teen, I observed first-hand what late middle age and early old age did to them physically. They simply weren't the same parents my considerably older siblings remembered, and their means decreased with age too. I figured I couldn't help the DNA too much, but I could try my best to pad the means.

This year has taught me well that people have an unbelievable variety of beliefs about their lives and the future and many have no interest in facts at all. How they survive with their decision making amazes me. But what do I know?

 

[Car-Guy]

A younger friend of mine doesn't see the point of investing money because she doesn't think she is going to live very long and thinks that is why a lot of people don't.

When I was "young" I had the opposite view... I thought I was going to live forever... So I worked hard and saved. Now, that I have lived as long as I have, I "know" time is short. (Relatively speaking) Now I'm in that blow that dough phase...

 

[Chuckanut]

+100. I am sorry for a young person who has decided she doesn't have long to live. Medical issues, I presume.

My parents were old enough to be grandparents (40 and 47) when I came along. As a teen, I observed first-hand what late middle age and early old age did to them physically. They simply weren't the same parents my considerably older siblings remembered, and their means decreased with age too. I figured I couldn't help the DNA too much, but I could try my best to pad the means.

I also had older parents. My younger sister had even older parents than I did! While they both lived a long time (90 and 92), as a teen and then a young adult I had the opportunity to observe how my older parents were already slowing down compared to the parents of most of my peers. That was an incentive to save and invest so I didn't have to work well into my 60's.

 

[PatrickA5]

I have a brother who made great money owning his own business while in his 40's. I remember I was kind of envious when he was buying huge houses and I was struggling to pay off my $85K house (early). He always had new (leased) his/hers Lexus. Kids got new cars on their 16th birthdays. Lived next door to a pro football player who was always throwing parties. Life was good! Then came the decline in business combined with a divorce and bankruptcy. I imagine he's now envious of me and wished he'd taken the slow/steady LBYM approach, but you can't change the past. I'll give him one thing, he's always been ambitious and worked hard - but sometimes life throws curve balls.

 

[Sunset]

OP - Perhaps your friend says this simply as an excuse to avoid talking about how they spend all their money on regrettable stuff.

 

[Walt34]

+100. I am sorry for a young person who has decided she doesn't have long to live. Medical issues, I presume.

In my entire life I only knew one person who was reasonably certain that she'd never see 65 because of genetics. She was right. The irony was, she still had plenty of money when she passed and could have lived a much more luxurious existence but she didn't care about that stuff.

All the others didn't have any excuse for not saving and are now regretting it.

 

[Yoheadden]

You don't know how many times I've said that phrase.

I have employees both, older than me and as young as teens/twenty somethings.
I have tried to explain to the older workers how wasteful it is to live with cc debt and that they want interest to work for them, not work for it. Some people just seem stuck in their ways and don't want to make the effort to change.
It's just ironic that these are the same people that complain that they don't have enough money and will never be able to retire.

As for the younger ones, we just try to instill the importance of saving and not spending it, just because they now have it.

 

[yakers]

A comment from some of us from the 60s, if I knew I was going to live this long I would’ve taken better care of myself.

May even apply to financial issues [emoji6]

 

[jimbee]

Humans are not rational.

 

[Car-Guy]

Humans are not rational.

You must know my DW..... And come to think of it, several others in my family...

 

[Amethyst]

"Why is the dog howling?"
"He's sittin' on a cocklebur."
"Why doesn't he get off the cocklebur?"
"He'd ruther holler."

Some people just seem stuck in their ways and don't want to make the effort to change.
It's just ironic that these are the same people that complain that they don't have enough money and will never be able to retire.

 

[Walt34]

Humans are not rational.

Well, they are, but people didn't evolve to plan ahead for 30-year retirements. They evolved to survive on the plains of Africa. The whole idea of living long enough to retire really only happened in the last half of the 20th century. It's probably going to take a few generations for the lessons to really stick.

Reading the book "Thinking, Fast and Slow" by Daniel Kahneman was a real eye-opener for me. It is not light reading but I found it fascinating.

 

[jimbee]

Well, they are, but people didn't evolve to plan ahead for 30-year retirements. They evolved to survive on the plains of Africa. The whole idea of living long enough to retire really only happened in the last half of the 20th century. It's probably going to take a few generations for the lessons to really stick.

Ok, many humans aren't rational now, in their current environment.

Reading the book "Thinking, Fast and Slow" by Daniel Kahneman was a real eye-opener for me. It is not light reading but I found it fascinating.

That is an excellent book. I've read it.

 

[CardsFan]

Ok, many humans aren't rational now, in their current environment.

Not sure what that is supposed to mean.

 

[rk911]

back in high school ('64-'68) a buddy figured he wouldn't live past 30. the way some folks rack up debt sure makes it seem like that attitude has no shortage of followers.

 

[skipro33]

Humans are not rational.

I agree, but they do rationalize. Every single bad decision they will rationalize in their mind as either the only option they had if they even are willing to admit it was a bad decision, or that the decision is the right one even though it is painfully obvious it isn't.
An example was someone I knew who wanted Lasik surgery about 20 years ago. They were convinced that this was the answer to living with 20/20 vision without glasses. Well, there were complications and she's now legally blind. It's very difficult to make a decision on an elective procedure, ignore the risks and then have to deal with the consequences. The only way her mind could accept things was that she convinced herself this was the right decision and that the results are not that bad. Talk about your delusions! But that's the way things go. With money, people with that mindset will always believe that I am nothing but one lucky bastard and that they are unlucky and that nothing they can do will ever change that.

 

[RobbieB]

So you invest 10% and your friend doesn't? Because she won't live long?

And we should fix her somehow? Why bother?