10 best countries to retire - any been there?

[kcowan]

Here at Lake Chapala, most (but not all) homes are listed in USD since the MLS here is a group of mostly gringo realtors. This is true in many expat areas in MX. Though when the deed is recorded it is recorded in pesos at the exchange rate as of the date of settlement.

Yes the standard is to buy and sell in USD on all coasts and in selected other destinations such as Lake Chapala and San Miguel de Allende. Although it creates a sense of safety, the underlying prices in pesos are impacted by economics just like anywhere else. As an example, our friends owned a high end condo worth $700k and he sold it 2 years ago for $500k. The good news for them was that they were upgrading, so the cost of their upgrade dropped from $175k to $125k.

Another anomaly that this creates is that it means that you can sell for no gain in USD and still owe substantial tax in pesos due to exchange gains.

 

[bmcgonig]

Yes the standard is to buy and sell in USD on all coasts and in selected other destinations such as Lake Chapala and San Miguel de Allende. Although it creates a sense of safety, the underlying prices in pesos are impacted by economics just like anywhere else. As an example, our friends owned a high end condo worth $700k and he sold it 2 years ago for $500k. The good news for them was that they were upgrading, so the cost of their upgrade dropped from $175k to $125k.

Another anomaly that this creates is that it means that you can sell for no gain in USD and still owe substantial tax in pesos due to exchange gains.

As an example if the value of the peso versus dollar drops 5% will the house price drop as well?

 

[kcowan]

As an example if the value of the peso versus dollar drops 5% will the house price drop as well?

It has actually been going the other way owing to the uncertainty of NAFTA. So nominally 1 USD got 17 to 20 pesos. So a $170k condo is now valued at $200k because the peso has gone from 17 to 20. So a $30k gain even with no market action.

 

[explanade]

The best thing about the UK is it's proximity to the EU and the ease of traveling between them. That may be getting more difficult in the future. Oh and of course those lovely character homes in the South East. My Canadian wife of 30 years needs to apply for a visa to stay there, and it is not guaranteed, and will cost $5000 for the privilege.

You gotta admit being able to drive to the South of France and stay there for a while is really nice.

How much is private supplemental insurance?

I was in Spain and they were telling me about 50 Euros a month gets you access to private hospitals, if the ones on the public health care are not available.

 

[explanade]

What would be the answers if cost of living wasn't to be considered?

You're not necessarily a billionaire but you don't have to try to seek out the lowest-cost areas?

Would there be as many people choosing South and Central America or SE Asia?

 

[Alan]

How much is private supplemental insurance?

I was in Spain and they were telling me about 50 Euros a month gets you access to private hospitals, if the ones on the public health care are not available.

We pay about $100/month for the 2 of us, in our 60’s, includes vision and dental. Kicks in if NHS waiting times are longer than 6 weeks.

My wife just found out she needs cataracts surgery in both eyes which we plan to have done at a local private hospital.

This week I had our GP (PCP) look at a suspicious mole on my back that my wife could see growing. He immediately referred me to the NHS skin specialist unit and I have an appointment in 11 days time.

 

[eastnortheast]

We had to come into Bangkok today for a visa interview and the traffic around the US Embassy is horrendous, literally takes 1/2 hour to move 1 mile, we missed the street to our hotel and it took 1 1/2 hours to circle back to it, not a city I’d like to live in

Agree with this! LOL Spent a lot of time in Thailand (BKK specifically) for work and always made sure that my hotel or apt. was close to the BTS or MRT.

 

[97guns]

Agree with this! LOL Spent a lot of time in Thailand (BKK specifically) for work and always made sure that my hotel or apt. was close to the BTS or MRT.

I rode the light rail one time there, we were packed in like sardines, not sure if it was rush hour commute or the norm

 

[eastnortheast]

We had to come into Bangkok today for a visa interview and the traffic around the US Embassy is horrendous, literally takes 1/2 hour to move 1 mile, we missed the street to our hotel and it took 1 1/2 hours to circle back to it, not a city I’d like to live in

I rode the light rail one time there, we were packed in like sardines, not sure if it was rush hour commute or the norm

I think the rush hour commute. I was usually heading north to Chatuchak for work, and tried to avoid the peak (i.e. 8 am or 5 pm) timeframe.

 

[97guns]

I think the rush hour commute. I was usually heading north to Chatuchak for work, and tried to avoid the peak (i.e. 8 am or 5 pm) timeframe.

The wife likes to take the boat taxis in the rivers/canals and its pretty tame in comparison to the other modes of travel but their destination points are limited, I’d rather stay out of Bangkok all together

 

[Major Tom]

My big hangup about the UK too. So much to love about it, but oh dear where is the sun?

I'm not exactly sure what my hangup about the UK is, but I think it's a combination of things. Most folk seem to enjoy, at some point, going back to where they are from. For some reason, having grown up there, my attitude is, "Been there, done that. It was fantastic, but no need to do it again."

Being honest, a lot of it most likely has to do with my relationship with my family. They are all good people, but I have a very strong need for my own space. If I were back in the UK, the invitations to family get-togethers, weddings, christenings, etc etc would start rolling in. I know this sounds terribly anti-social, but all that hanging out with family would be too much for me. I really enjoy my peaceful and quiet single life on the West Coast.

I enjoy the UK for short visits but, and I don't mean this to sound like a criticism, there is an air of overwhelming mundanity for me. It has a comforting air of stability which, for me, also translates into a slightly dull "nothing ever changes" atmosphere. In truth, I probably need a shrink. Does anyone else feel the same way - that going back to where they are from is somewhat overwhelming, or would feel like going backwards? It doesn't stop me from watching lots of British TV though, and fantasize about living there once again

 

[JakeinChina]

I'm not exactly sure what my hangup about the UK is, but I think it's a combination of things. Most folk seem to enjoy, at some point, going back to where they are from. For some reason, having grown up there, my attitude is, "Been there, done that. It was fantastic, but no need to do it again."

Being honest, a lot of it most likely has to do with my relationship with my family. They are all good people, but I have a very strong need for my own space. If I were back in the UK, the invitations to family get-togethers, weddings, christenings, etc etc would start rolling in. I know this sounds terribly anti-social, but all that hanging out with family would be too much for me. I really enjoy my peaceful and quiet single life on the West Coast.

I enjoy the UK for short visits but, and I don't mean this to sound like a criticism, there is an air of overwhelming mundanity for me. It has a comforting air of stability which, for me, also translates into a slightly dull "nothing ever changes" atmosphere. In truth, I probably need a shrink. Does anyone else feel the same way - that going back to where they are from is somewhat overwhelming, or would feel like going backwards? It doesn't stop me from watching lots of British TV though, and fantasize about living there once again

I had the exact same feelings when I was in my 20's and early 30's living as an expat in Asia. I missed my extended family at times, but whenever I travelled back to see them and where I grew up in northern New Jersey, it just always felt like a big let down. I was bored, It was the same old thing I had in the past, and nobody or nothing ever really changed.

Then I got older, had a family, and would love to move back to where I grew up, its just that its very expensive and I might choose an area that is cheaper since I don 't already have a job in the U.S. I still miss my family greatly in the U.S as were still living in Asia, but even now, when I do see them, its a slight let down. Nothing really changes and they are still the same people doing there thing, with their own families.

Two things of changed since I've become older. One is, I want to move back to the States to give my daughter the same childhood (or similiar) as I had.

Secondly, I want to take care of my mother who is getting older, and I feel its my responsibility to some degree, to help out more. I've been away for a very long time, and its my turn to help out more instead of letting my two brothers take all the work load with my family.

Your single so I can see where there is a difference, but I did have your same feelings when I was younger.

 

[Aus_E_Expat]

I enjoy the UK for short visits but, and I don't mean this to sound like a criticism, there is an air of overwhelming mundanity for me. It has a comforting air of stability which, for me, also translates into a slightly dull "nothing ever changes" atmosphere. In truth, I probably need a shrink. Does anyone else feel the same way - that going back to where they are from is somewhat overwhelming, or would feel like going backwards? It doesn't stop me from watching lots of British TV though, and fantasize about living there once again

I understand your comment, but I think it is not so much of where we came from but just getting bored.

I have spent almost 20 years living in the same city - it is one of the most dynamic and exciting cities in Asia, but it is now a case of been there done that.

I enjoy returning to Australia on a regular basis. As long as that does not fall back into trying to replicate what I did when I was a teenager, too much hanging out with old friend, instead finding new friends and interests, I think going back should be ok.

 

[Nemo2]

Born in London, England, I escaped almost 60 years ago. Go back? Not a chance.

 

[Alan]

I'm not exactly sure what my hangup about the UK is, but I think it's a combination of things. Most folk seem to enjoy, at some point, going back to where they are from. For some reason, having grown up there, my attitude is, "Been there, done that. It was fantastic, but no need to do it again."

Being honest, a lot of it most likely has to do with my relationship with my family. They are all good people, but I have a very strong need for my own space. If I were back in the UK, the invitations to family get-togethers, weddings, christenings, etc etc would start rolling in. I know this sounds terribly anti-social, but all that hanging out with family would be too much for me. I really enjoy my peaceful and quiet single life on the West Coast.

I enjoy the UK for short visits but, and I don't mean this to sound like a criticism, there is an air of overwhelming mundanity for me. It has a comforting air of stability which, for me, also translates into a slightly dull "nothing ever changes" atmosphere. In truth, I probably need a shrink. Does anyone else feel the same way - that going back to where they are from is somewhat overwhelming, or would feel like going backwards? It doesn't stop me from watching lots of British TV though, and fantasize about living there once again

I fully understand.

We are the exact opposite in that we get on great with our family and friends and enjoy spending a lot of time with them. They are scattered across the country in places we love to visit anyway - East and west coast of Scotland, Cheshire, Durham and Wiltshire. We also have great vacations away with them. In the 2 years we have been back we have spent long weekends in rented houses in Derbyshire and Staffordshire plus spent 2 weeks in Belgium. Next year we are already booked up to spend 2 weeks in the Scilly Isles and 2 weeks in a cottage in France.

We have also been very fortunate to have lived and worked as adults in 8 different places in England and Scotland including 3 cities, 3 small towns and 2 villages. The place we chose to move back to is a market town in N Yorkshire at the foot of the Cleveland Hills, and in 30 minutes walking from our house, climbing 700' up through the woods we are in the North Yorks National Park on one of the many moors. 5 miles walk in the other direction, up and over a hill then down through fields and valleys is the coast with beautiful beaches and coastal footpaths along the tops of cliffs that are hundreds of feet high.

Bus services are plentiful and very easy to use. One of our criteria this time was for our old age and decreasing mobility. The 2 villages we have lived in, including one about 20 miles from where we live now, were really nice but you absolutely need a car as it is a long way from shops, doctors, hospitals etc.

We love America and in the first 8 years after retiring looked for somewhere we would like to move to, spending 3 to 4 weeks in rental houses in several places but the draw of family and friends won out.

Sorry about the long post, but we just got back in after walking out for breakfast and am feeling very mellow. The attached photos were taken just now from my computer desk. The nice thing about the weather here is that it is never too hot, too cold or too wet to stop us walking. No such thing as bad weather, just the wrong clothing. (It is currently 77F)

 

[Totoro]

Being honest, a lot of it most likely has to do with my relationship with my family. They are all good people, but I have a very strong need for my own space.

In truth, I probably need a shrink. Does anyone else feel the same way - that going back to where they are from is somewhat overwhelming, or would feel like going backwards?

I'm in the same boat on both accounts. Don't live that far away from close family and university friends (2 hour drive) and I do miss them, yet December escapes are standard to avoid the mundane and small family issues (also because of the darkness). Even when I lived closeby I tend to close myself off a bit, while for my mental health it would probably be better to actually be more open and engaged.

Likewise for the second part: it would make sense logistically and in terms of environment (greener) to move back near my childhood town right now, but I can't bring myself to do it. Rather go to New Zealand, literally on the other side of the planet. Maybe I'll get over myself, don't know.

Shrink me up too ...

 

[Totoro]

I think people can get accustomed to anything. I keep reading about parts of Scandinavia that have the highest per capita consumption of antidepressants, yet always come out on top in surveys of the happiest populations. They are expensive places to live with climates that can hardly be considered favorable, but most wouldn't consider leaving.

In my case not really: I have mild SAD (self-diagnosed). I get mildly depressed by end november right up to mid march or so due to lack of sunlight. Did a short expat stint in Finland in the middle of winter, and it was much worse. Lights and such help, but not much.

Ask any Scandinavian about the happiness survey, and they usually reply too with: "when was the survey taken, in summer or winter"

They are fantastic places to live, also as an expat, the lack of sunlight however excludes it for me as a permanent (seasonal is fine) base. Have enough challenge with the Netherlands as it is. One reason why I cross the equator as much as I can every winter.

 

[umograd83]

I have lived abroad (semester in Mexico City). Let me tell you, there’s no place like home. I will never live abroad again.

 

[mexexpat]

What would be the answers if cost of living wasn't to be considered?

You're not necessarily a billionaire but you don't have to try to seek out the lowest-cost areas?

Would there be as many people choosing South and Central America or SE Asia?

We can afford to live almost anywhere in the world. But we chose Mexico for a variety of reasons. Most expats here in Ajijic are not here for economic reasons; most own another nice home, often in Canada or the US. In San Miguel Allende, most expats we know there own two homes outside of MX, usually another in North America and one in Europe. Again, these expats are not in MX because they can't afford to live elsewhere.

Are there economic-driven expats in Ajijic or SMA? Yes, but not as many as there were 20 or 30 years ago, or so I've been told by more seasoned expats in these parts.

 

[bmcgonig]

It has actually been going the other way owing to the uncertainty of NAFTA. So nominally 1 USD got 17 to 20 pesos. So a $170k condo is now valued at $200k because the peso has gone from 17 to 20. So a $30k gain even with no market action.

If the peso was devalued e.g., going from 17 to 20, shouldn't the dollar price decrease? Assuming the underlying price in pesos stayed the same.

 

[Koolau]

I'm not exactly sure what my hangup about the UK is, but I think it's a combination of things. Most folk seem to enjoy, at some point, going back to where they are from. For some reason, having grown up there, my attitude is, "Been there, done that. It was fantastic, but no need to do it again."

Being honest, a lot of it most likely has to do with my relationship with my family. They are all good people, but I have a very strong need for my own space. If I were back in the UK, the invitations to family get-togethers, weddings, christenings, etc etc would start rolling in. I know this sounds terribly anti-social, but all that hanging out with family would be too much for me. I really enjoy my peaceful and quiet single life on the West Coast.

I enjoy the UK for short visits but, and I don't mean this to sound like a criticism, there is an air of overwhelming mundanity for me. It has a comforting air of stability which, for me, also translates into a slightly dull "nothing ever changes" atmosphere. In truth, I probably need a shrink. Does anyone else feel the same way - that going back to where they are from is somewhat overwhelming, or would feel like going backwards? It doesn't stop me from watching lots of British TV though, and fantasize about living there once again

I think I'm the opposite. Of course, I spent 60 years within 10 miles of where I was born in the midwest. When we moved almost 5000 miles to Paradise, it was wonderful - and we love it there. BUT when we return (as we have now) for the summer, I just seem to ooze back into the vibe. We get to see as much (or little) of family as we want to. We get to reconnect with old places, familiar events, old friends, etc. I find I actually LIKE to see corn and soybean fields now! We can travel by car - as far as our backs can stand the ride. It's wonderful in its own way.

We aren't true expats but someone said it best: Hawaii is the US but it's not America. I think our time split is just about perfect at least for now. We never experience winter and yet we get to reconnect with our old life. I look at it as the best of both worlds. YMMV

 

[kcowan]

If the peso was devalued e.g., going from 17 to 20, shouldn't the dollar price decrease? Assuming the underlying price in pesos stayed the same.

Yes but the underlying price is in pesos. Displaying values in $ is just a convenience for expats. My illustration was an attempt to show that the price goes up by $30k when pesos remain the same. Perhaps a poor choice. That would be a good outcome.

 

[kcowan]

We can afford to live almost anywhere in the world. But we chose Mexico for a variety of reasons. Most expats here in Ajijic are not here for economic reasons; most own another nice home, often in Canada or the US. In San Miguel Allende, most expats we know there own two homes outside of MX, usually another in North America and one in Europe. Again, these expats are not in MX because they can't afford to live elsewhere.

Are there economic-driven expats in Ajijic or SMA? Yes, but not as many as there were 20 or 30 years ago, or so I've been told by more seasoned expats in these parts.

Yes I agree. Fewer economic expats these days. We chose PV because:
-great weather in all but 4 months
-many expats to socialize with
-approachable locals who are friendly
-great choices for dining out (950 restaurants in greater PV)
-good shopping
-great selection of art galleries and live theater
-direct frequent direct flights to NOTB
-good TV and internet
-great medical care
-unmatched COL
-lots of expat visitors from NOTB during the season

There are a few economic refugees who live here on SS. They lack the money to travel elsewhere in the summers. They hunker down to tough out the weather.

 

[mexexpat]

We have purchased 2 homes in Mexico, one in 2008 and another last year.

In expat markets, the price of the home has a lot to do with what is going on the the US economy, and here in Chapala area, where perhaps the majority of expats are CDN, the CDN economy.

99% of house sales in MX are cash sales. When the stock markets and housing markets are strong in the US and CDN, sales of houses here to expats reflect that. When the US and CDN are in recession and/or the housing or stock markets are in decline, the prices and sales of houses to expats here is similarly impacted.

I am not saying the MX economy has no bearing on housing prices/sales, but for the most part housing sales/prices here for expats are more a reflection of the US/CDN economies/markets.

 

[Freedom56]

Born in London, England, I escaped almost 60 years ago. Go back? Not a chance.

In my opinion, London is one of the greatest cities in the world. The food is fabulous and there are lots of things to do. The music scene is fantastic. We are headed back again in a couple of days.