Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 01-03-2020, 06:55 PM   #41
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Katsmeow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: DFW Area (Tx)
Posts: 4,729
Quote:
Originally Posted by EastWest Gal View Post
My two major credit cards give me the option of seeing my "estimated FICO credit score" every month when I go on their website to pay my bill. On the same day, one card reported a score of 835 for the past several months. Two minutes later, the other card reported a score of 809, also for the past several months.

Whatever. I mostly don't care, but it shows that the number is hardly an exact science.
It sort of is. But there are factors that can vary. First look at which credit score they are offering. For example, I have one bank that offers FICO Score 8. Also, from which crediting reporting agency. Not all creditors report to all agencies. Also when people pull credit they often don't pull from all agencies. So, with TransUnion I might have one more credit pull than I have at Experian or wherever. Also, while major credit card companies may report to all 3 lots of others creditors don't. For example, if you have a late payment to a doctor they might report to only one of the credit agencies.

We are getting ready to perhaps refinance our house. The lender I am working with said that there are actually multiple FICO scores. The one that the bank shows online is one that is the credit card FICO score. But, mortgage companies have one that varies a little and is a mortgage related score. You can go to myfico.com itself and can buy your actual score from all 3 agencies. This will show you your scores for mortgage, auto loans, etc.

But basically there isn't just one credit score there are different versions of FICO Score (Score 8 is very common but it isn't the only one) and it can vary depending on which type of score it is (mortgage, auto loan, etc.).

And, of course, if the data it is getting varies from one agency to another then the result will vary. For mortgage purposes, I was told that they get the mortgage score from all 3 bureaus. Then they use the middle score. If it is a couple they use the lower middle score of the two people. So, if my middle score is 820 and DH's in 810 they would use DH's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden sunsets View Post

Fast forward to 2020, we will be purchasing a new vehicle in April and I've thought about how to obtain better pricing, based on borrowing vs cash. I had planned to get to the bottom line cost, based on a cash purchase and then once presented with the opportunity to finance, ask for a further discount if we agreed to finance. I gather you are saying, agree upfront to finance at a set cost and then switch gears at the last moment to cash. Am I correct?
Used to dealers might give you a better deal if you were financing with them but they wouldn't be upfront about it. The last few cars I bought, though, it was different. Sometimes, they would offer a choice of a lower price or a lower interest rate. But, this was absolutely disclosed upfront. Other times, it made no difference whether I was financing or not. They were clear that it made no difference at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HadEnuff View Post
can you check your own credit score without adversely affecting it?
Yes.
Katsmeow is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 01-03-2020, 06:57 PM   #42
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Tampa
Posts: 8,401
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazz4cash View Post
I compared the free credit scores from several accounts and the Vantage scores were 30-35 points lower than the Fico scores.
Interesting. Mine is the opposite with about 30 points higher.
__________________
TGIM
Dtail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 06:20 AM   #43
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Amethyst's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,259
Same here. No difference in price no matter how we spun it. We had picked out the car online and gotten an offer which was already lower than other dealers for virtually the same car (they make it hard or impossible to compare apples to apples). We paid cash because that's what we planned, but it made no difference in the final offer. That was in 2015.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Katsmeow View Post
I

Used to dealers might give you a better deal if you were financing with them but they wouldn't be upfront about it. The last few cars I bought, though, it was different. Sometimes, they would offer a choice of a lower price or a lower interest rate. But, this was absolutely disclosed upfront. Other times, it made no difference whether I was financing or not. They were clear that it made no difference at all.

.
__________________
If you understood everything I say, you'd be me ~ Miles Davis
'There is only one success – to be able to spend your life in your own way.’ Christopher Morley.
It involved a mannequin hand, and an electric shaver taped to a golf club! - "The Other Guys"
Amethyst is offline   Reply With Quote
I pay cash too
Old 01-04-2020, 08:37 AM   #44
Recycles dryer sheets
Canoesmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Winters in N. Scottsdale, summers in Alpine, AZ
Posts: 55
I pay cash too

When I buy a vehicle I write a check. But with my credit bureaus frozen, they wont let me take the vehicle until the check clears as they can't see my credit rating on their system (I show them that it is 835 online, but they don't care about that) That is irritating. Im guessing that even paying “cash”, if you had a low score they'd make you wait until the check clears.

And its hard and unwise to show up at the dealership with $65k in 100’s
__________________
To abstain from the enjoyment, which is in our power, or to seek distant rather than immediate results, are among the most painful exertions of the human will.
N. W. Senior, 1836
Canoesmith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 09:20 AM   #45
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Rianne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Champaign
Posts: 3,455
I bought our new car in my name, not DH. Bought with financing and paid it off in 3 payments. My credit score jumped 30 points. All our credit is frozen (had to unfreeze for financing). I used the financing to get an additional $1K off the purchase price of the car knowing I'd pay it off. My first payment was $21K and I paid < $50 in interest, total.
__________________
"If you want to go fast, go alone. If you want to go far, go together.
Rianne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 07:31 AM   #46
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: College Station
Posts: 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden sunsets View Post
Aggie; I'm trying to wrap my head around this approach. The last two cars we bought, were financed, at less than 1% interest after we planned to pay cash, but were presented with financing at .75% interest. We never tried to negotiate a lower price after opting for financing, vs paying cash.

These two purchases date back to 2010 and 2011. We later realized a missed opportunity in better out the door cost if financing, after these transactions.

Fast forward to 2020, we will be purchasing a new vehicle in April and I've thought about how to obtain better pricing, based on borrowing vs cash. I had planned to get to the bottom line cost, based on a cash purchase and then once presented with the opportunity to finance, ask for a further discount if we agreed to finance. I gather you are saying, agree upfront to finance at a set cost and then switch gears at the last moment to cash. Am I correct?
Well I guess the thread is derailed, probably for the better , so lets go.
The first key is to NEVER EVER simply walk into a dealership like we did in the old days and start the buying process directly with the car conman. Every car guy I know says that , in order to get the best deals, you should do all of the ground work via the inter webs. For a lot of us old farts this is not as second nature as it is to the youngsters who grew up with a computer in his face but it is the way of the world today. I actually visit a pile of car lots ( we got the time..dont we ?) ignore the car salesman and look at the various models. I usually tell them Im just in for service and want to look at what's new. You can always find a bored vulture who will spend a little time showing you around. Once you decide what you want start emailing the internet dept and get some specifics and prices. They usually never ask about how you will pay and you should get a deal that will be as close to bottom line as possible. Get 3-4 dealerships involved. When you decide go to the dealership with a file folder or clipboard containing all of your offers and work em down to your final price. Simply do not answer any financing questions or WALK OUT ! Decide how much time and effort you want to spend to save a few hundred dollars. Once you get em off the sticker you will find that the deals are all about the same. They really don't make a lot on new car sales, they make it on needless add-ons and service. The real trick is being DAMN FIRM in that damn little room with the professional con man whose ONLY job is to sell you CRAP and act all indignant when you refuse to pay $970 for a stupid window etching that he will tell you will deter every car thief on 3 continents!!!

I posted a question on an automotive board I use that is full of car guys and saelsmen. Asked about the belief that there is a better bottom line for financing vs cash. SO far damn near every one of them said NO, not really. They may have a small incentive available to the salesman to help drive the mark to the fiancee dept but its not worth the hassle and there are still the little hidden finance charges they tack on as fees and such. They ALL say the key is to be FIRM and resist the various fees and add ons and ALL agree 100% that the real key is the use of your FEET ! Couple of em say that the ONLY way to get the real bottom line is to WALK OUT a couple of times. They always have a few shekels available to lure a real buyer back and are trained to respond. IF the dealership does not bend or you feel that they are really not prepared to play their OWN DAMN GAME..walk out. It is either the wrong time of the sales calendar or they are genuine crooks ( a very relative term for the worlds largest organized crime racket) .

Have Fun and Good Luck
aggie76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 08:54 AM   #47
Recycles dryer sheets
GreenEggs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 229
Seems we all have stellar FICO scores on this forum.


Since we've started chatting about car buying I've got a story to share. We wanted to get an RV for retirement and after visiting a big RV lot realized that we didn't really want to deal with driving, parking, and storing a big one. It's just going to be the 2 of us and we decided to do the "van life" thing instead. We wanted 4wd, which is only offered by Mercedes, and as a diesel. I priced them & read about them and didn't think I wanted to spend that much money, so began looking at the options from Ford & Dodge. I'd just purchased a pretty blue enclosed trailer, so we found a pretty blue Dodge Promaster van at a dealership in a small town nearby. We quickly realized that we didn't like the Promaster and decided we'd concentrate on finding a Ford Transit. The next Friday evening I was looking over Carguru.com and saw a 2016 MB Sprinter, 4wd, tall, extended with under 12,000 miles for $34K, and it was at the same Dodge dealership that we'd just visited. I still had the salesman's card in my pocket, so I called him at 9 A.M. the next morning. I asked to confirm that the price online was correct & he checked and confirmed and said "yes". I said "Great, I'll see you in an hour with my checkbook."

When I arrived he said that after speaking to me he double-checked with the sales manager about the price and the posted price was actually incorrect. It was supposed to be $54K instead of $34K, but since they had told me it was $34K they would honor that price if I decided to purchase it right then. Wow! I eagerly wrote the check & nobody ever asked about my credit score.

Who's heard of a dealership honoring a $20,000 misprint?
GreenEggs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 02:02 PM   #48
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Chuckanut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: West of the Mississippi
Posts: 12,452
Quote:
Originally Posted by athena53 View Post

If I got a call like the OP from some bottom-fishing debt collector threatening to report me to the credit bureaus over a smallish debt, I'd laugh at them, too.
From what I have heard, these bottom fishers often buy lists of people who owe money but the statute of limitations is past. However, if they can get you to make any payment, no matter how small, the clock starts again from the beginning. I am all for people paying their debts if at all possible, but beware being tricked into into doing something that will open you up to many more years of harassment.
__________________
The worst decisions are usually made in times of anger and impatience.
Chuckanut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 02:44 PM   #49
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 3,326
I paid little attention to credit scores, but even in FIRE, they still matter. For example, I am taking out a standby HELOC. They care about your score as do credit cards- we shuffle them for award points.

I do not need credit per se, but I think it is wise to have access to it because you never know.
Montecfo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2020, 11:00 AM   #50
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
gayl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Diablo Valley (SF Bay Area)
Posts: 2,207
My credit score dropped drastically 2 months ago (was 770 to 740s) as my last revolving loan was pd off 3 yrs ago & I only have 1 open card (3 closed in 2011-2015). Am I concerned? Nope. I only borrow from USAA and they assured me that they only use my track record with them.

Last car: 11/14 USAA negotiated price, walked in with a check from them, and when they wanted to sell me their extended warranty I pulled out the USAA quote ($330). Was out of dealership and back before lunch ended.
gayl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2020, 11:45 AM   #51
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Western NC
Posts: 2,726
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuckanut View Post
From what I have heard, these bottom fishers often buy lists of people who owe money but the statute of limitations is past. However, if they can get you to make any payment, no matter how small, the clock starts again from the beginning. I am all for people paying their debts if at all possible, but beware being tricked into into doing something that will open you up to many more years of harassment.
Never discuss terms or payment over the phone.

With any debt collector the first thing is to demand written proof of debt.

And in my state their license number, since they can't legally collect debt here unless licensed.

I've never had any creditor claims go beyond that step, though to be fair I knew all the claims were bogus anyway.
ncbill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2020, 12:30 PM   #52
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 1,063
Quote:
Originally Posted by aggie76 View Post
I recently had the usual stealth bogus medical charge , less than $1000, over a fully covered procedure from TWO years ago that some debt collector called me about. Of course I told them to stuff it where the sun doesn't shine , prove it ( which they claimed they didn't have to !!) etc... When it got to the threats about reporting me to the credit nazis I simply said I couldn't care less. It felt so good. Why should I care ?
I had a very similar experience. My doc had me get an MRI. The MRI provider didn't bother to get the pre-approval required by my insurance co and the insurance co refused to pay.

First the MRI provider tried to get me to pay and I told them to go pound sand. Then they turned it over to a collection agency and I told them to pound sand as well.

The collection agency warned me of the dire consequences to my credit score (cue ominous music). So what, I said. My score dropped below 800 for a couple of months. Yawn.
CoolRich59 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2020, 04:51 PM   #53
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Brunswick
Posts: 76
Quote:
Since I do not buy into the emotional mantra about having to have a paid off house in retirement I still have a significant mortgage of our property.
I have a friend who is a magistrate in the local county probate court. I told him that old joke:

You know your financial planning is great when the last check you ever write bounces.

He looked at me in disdain and told me I absolutely was wrong. He routinely handles cases where there are hundreds of thousands of debt at the time of death and no estate to pay for the debts. No estate = written off debt.

He said the companies that loan money, credit cards, banks, whatever, routinely increase other people's payments to create a reserve fund to handle such charged-off debts. He told me, half-jokingly, that I could have a much better life if I ran up a bunch of debt and then spent down assets.

When my parents were close to passing away the elder attorney we engaged warned us against assuming any of my parent's debt, even informally. He said I have absolutely no obligation to pay their debts (as long as I was not guardian, which I was not) and he routinely sees kids put themselves in financial holes by trying to help the parents out. He said it rarely ends up well and all that usually happens is the kids lose a bunch of assets and the old family homes still get repossessed.

Ray
NXR7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2020, 04:57 PM   #54
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Brunswick
Posts: 76
If you have college-age kids and they are not spendthrifts you can help their credit score by adding them as authorized users on the oldest credit card you have. Get the limit lowered if you need to beforehand.

I added my kids to my oldest card and they both ended up with credit scores in the low 800's within a year even though they only had one other credit card themselves and no loans. Their credit report showed a credit history longer than they were old.

Ray
NXR7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2020, 04:58 PM   #55
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
HI Bill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 2,187
Quote:
Originally Posted by davebarnes View Post
True.
But, I am still trying to figure out how to get my FICO score above 817.
It is a game.
Your score is about what mine is, and it never eclipses 820. I have a moderate number of credit cards, but the lack of diversity in my credit usage (no revolving credit, no mortgage, no car loan) is a detriment to the score.

Credit scores, unfortunately, are a measure of how well you use credit, and don't actually look at your credit worthiness (e.g., ability to pay back/assets). They also don't give you credit for paying your bill in full each month. And if the balance on one card exceeds 30% of the credit limit (until the statement closes), you get dinged, even if you pay it off in full. The score system is rigged for those who need credit, and who are likely to fail, IMHO.
__________________
Balance in everything.
HI Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2020, 05:04 PM   #56
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: El Dorado
Posts: 161
Mine stays at 815-820 and we have zero debt. Apparently just paying off credit cards in full every month is enough to get a high score. But it's fairly useless to us, no chance we'll ever borrow a single cent.
steveark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2020, 05:07 PM   #57
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
HI Bill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 2,187
Quote:
Originally Posted by aggie76 View Post
ALL agree 100% that the real key is the use of your FEET ! Couple of em say that the ONLY way to get the real bottom line is to WALK OUT a couple of times. They always have a few shekels available to lure a real buyer back and are trained to respond.
+1. When I went to buy an RX8, I presented my BAFO (best and final offer). The sales guy refused it. I was driving away, when he ran up to my car, and said that they'd take the price I offered. I went to lunch, and the bank to pick up a cashier's check. You're absolutely right.
__________________
Balance in everything.
HI Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2020, 06:00 PM   #58
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Lawn chair in Texas
Posts: 14,183
Mine is 800 something, which is great, but I don’t do anything special to achieve that score. My only debt is a mortgage, and whatever the one-month balance is on my two CCs.
__________________
Have Funds, Will Retire

...not doing anything of true substance...
HFWR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2020, 07:00 PM   #59
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 1,063
Quote:
Originally Posted by davebarnes View Post
True.
But, I am still trying to figure out how to get my FICO score above 817.
It is a game.
My son texted me the other night from his in-laws. His F-I-L's FICO score is 850.
CoolRich59 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2020, 07:29 PM   #60
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 940
Quote:
Originally Posted by JustCurious View Post
In my experience the salesperson always asks about financing well before you get back to the office..."What kind of monthly payment are you looking for?"... "Are you approved for financing at your bank?"..."How many months do you want to finance?"

How do you answer those questions?
I always say, "Doesn't matter. I don't care about any of that stuff, I'm looking for the best price on the car I want. I'll talk about paying for the car after we've settled on the deal."

Clearly we are not the only buyers in this category. I think the salesmen ask this early on, to see which category of buyer you are.
rayvt is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Average credit scores by state calmloki FIRE and Money 33 11-18-2007 08:09 PM
Divorce and Credit scores clifp FIRE and Money 24 11-13-2007 10:13 PM
Question about credit scores David1961 FIRE and Money 28 10-06-2007 10:34 AM
Vanguard Perk Levels Bikerdude FIRE and Money 38 05-08-2007 07:26 AM

» Quick Links

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:44 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.