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Old 11-12-2020, 10:48 AM   #41
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A co worker took her lump sum pension, just at the 2008 crash, convinced by her advisor she could do better. Ended up coming back to work "on call" for another 10 years before she fully re-retired.
Another co worker switched to another company, withdrew his pension due to being badly in debt. He is still working at the other company.
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Old 11-12-2020, 05:04 PM   #42
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Netflix's "Dirty Money" episode 8 or 11, look it up.

An atty., along with the town & state's (Needham, Ma) compliance steal*(imo) a compentent elderly individuals 1-2M+ in assets for claimed maintenance issues like trimming trees, not owed taxation.

You might find it enlightening.
I'd heard similar crediable stories elsewhere nationwide, NV was another location iirc.

I've heard of families, robbing family elders of wealth leaving them clueless & destitute. Then the elderly decline to prosecute, unreal.
The state refuses to do clawbacks, its perplexing.
Watch your resources!

Good luck & Best wishes......
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Old 12-16-2020, 09:20 AM   #43
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All of my grandmothers (surviving spouse) died essentially penniless, but in good nursing homes at 94 yo. DW's grandparents were similar. Out of those four couples, only my father's parents had a portfolio with stocks. Nearly all of that went to LTC.

My parents (early 80s) lived frugally and have $1M socked away in conservative CDs, cash, small bit in stock and a paid for house. Pretty good for a teacher and nurse retiring at 59.

My in-laws, lived large and on the edge for decades - displaying wealth instead of saving. In the early 2000s, they dropped an eye popping amount to remodel their house, kept a stabled horse, and new car leases (Tahoe and Mercedes). Also bought 10 acres of desert in Scottsdale as an (illiquid) investment that they later tried to sell to me when the bottom dropped out during the Great Recession. With 2 kids at home an a disabled DW, I did not take their (unrealistic) offer. Evidentially they had kept their stash in stocks, and just blew through it after the drop. Subsequently, they took out a reverse mortgage and declared bankruptcy. Electrical Engineer trained and previous corporate VP/ entrepreneur FIL worked until March of this year (age 87) as a cashier at Walgreens instead of applying for SNAP and other programs we looked up. With covid pandemic, we asked him to stop and said we (and a brother in law) would assist when unemployment runs out. I have harbored some resentment for years for their lifestyle, but try not to let it show with DW or her parents.

Funny thing, I learned my retirement savings and investing strategy early on during visits to the in-laws by reading Forbes, Fortune and Money magazines.

Apparently, FIL did not read his own magazines.
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Old 12-16-2020, 12:47 PM   #44
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I was just reading a thread by @Dawgman who decided he's 'over saved,' which doesn't seem uncommon here.
Fortunately or unfortunately, I'm in this same situation. To large of a savings to actually use up without wasting it plus I'm still saving $3,000 a month from my pension income that's not being used.

I agree that many of us on this forum are in a similar situation. Hard for many people like myself to spend money after spending decades saving it.
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Old 12-16-2020, 03:14 PM   #45
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Iíve noticed that even people without portfolios manage to muddle through.
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Old 12-16-2020, 03:19 PM   #46
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We could easily cut back and live on our pensions if needed.
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Old 12-17-2020, 10:50 AM   #47
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No, but we have a few relatives who have, or will, essentially retire with nothing.

DW gets very tired of them commenting about how 'lucky' we are.

They are clueless.
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Old 12-17-2020, 12:09 PM   #48
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DW gets very tired of them commenting about how 'lucky' we are.
I have not experienced this yet, but I expect to upon retiring early (57) next summer. Formulating my response... Do you think this is possibly a good reply:

"Oh, what part of it do you think was due to luck?"
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Old 12-17-2020, 12:14 PM   #49
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I have not experienced this yet, but I expect to upon retiring early (57) next summer. Formulating my response... Do you think this is possibly a good reply:

"Oh, what part of it do you think was due to luck?"
I'm going to steal that one in early 2022!
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Old 12-17-2020, 02:35 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by Out-to-Lunch View Post
I have not experienced this yet, but I expect to upon retiring early (57) next summer. Formulating my response... Do you think this is possibly a good reply:

"Oh, what part of it do you think was due to luck?"
I don't think it's a good reply, honestly. Unless your intent is to just get them to stop saying that sort of thing to you.

From what I have seen so far, there are people who think it's mostly due to hard work, good decisions, a good education, and a person's raw ability. These people will not kvetch at you. (They will also mostly not learn from you either, for the most part.)

There are other people who think it is more about the color of your skin, the health you were born with, the people you were born to, the country you were born in, the looks you were born with, and the things that happen to you, including the good things that were given to you and the bad things that happened to others. These people may kvetch at you, and I think your response will not persuade them to join in a respectful discussion between their point of view and yours.
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Old 12-17-2020, 03:53 PM   #51
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I don't think it's a good reply, honestly. Unless your intent is to just get them to stop saying that sort of thing to you.

From what I have seen so far, there are people who think it's mostly due to hard work, good decisions, a good education, and a person's raw ability. These people will not kvetch at you. (They will also mostly not learn from you either, for the most part.)

There are other people who think it is more about the color of your skin, the health you were born with, the people you were born to, the country you were born in, the looks you were born with, and the things that happen to you, including the good things that were given to you and the bad things that happened to others. These people may kvetch at you, and I think your response will not persuade them to join in a respectful discussion between their point of view and yours.
Thanks for the comments. FWIW, after I posted (and before I read this) I reflected that a lot of the things on your list ARE part of my sucess, and I AM lucky. I also "did the right things," but that is a necessary, not sufficient, condition.

One of the musicians I rather like has a lyric: "It takes a whole lot of help to make it on your own."
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Old 12-17-2020, 07:26 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by Out-to-Lunch View Post
Thanks for the comments. FWIW, after I posted (and before I read this) I reflected that a lot of the things on your list ARE part of my sucess, and I AM lucky. I also "did the right things," but that is a necessary, not sufficient, condition.

One of the musicians I rather like has a lyric: "It takes a whole lot of help to make it on your own."
Glad you saw that for yourself. Retiring (early or not) does require a degree of luck, along with work and sacrifice. We never know the cards others have been dealt.
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Old 12-17-2020, 07:40 PM   #53
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Glad you saw that for yourself. Retiring (early or not) does require a degree of luck, along with work and sacrifice. We never know the cards others have been dealt.
Now, to be fair to me, such a response does not deny the role of luck. It invites (admittedly, in the best possible reading), the interlocutor to examine what was luck and what was not.
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Old 12-17-2020, 08:11 PM   #54
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Maybe something like ďLucky, yes.... but thereís a LOT more to it than that.Ē
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Old 12-17-2020, 08:22 PM   #55
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Maybe something like ďLucky, yes.... but thereís a LOT more to it than that.Ē
I like it!
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Old 12-17-2020, 10:32 PM   #56
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I just say yeah got lucky and landed a job on Wall Street and then usually no follow up.
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Old 12-17-2020, 11:25 PM   #57
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In 2000 ARCO (Atlantic Richfield Company) was broken apart with the majority of assets absorbed by BP. As part of the sale, the employees were offered a generous severance that included "5&5" (5 years tacked onto years of service and onto age for purposes of pension calculations). This coincided with the end of the DotCom bubble, where any idiot with a brokerage account had been making it as a sideline day-trader. It was perfectly natural for quite a few of the ARCO employees to take their 5&5 pension as a lump sum with plans of day trading to an early retirement fortune. I don't know of one single one out of 20 or so I'm familiar with that weren't back at work within 4-5 years. In many cases unable to find work at anywhere near their previous position or income.
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Old 12-17-2020, 11:48 PM   #58
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Not running out yet, but 5 years ago we assumed we would be getting an inheritance from DH’s mom. Her and her late husbands pension and SS covered all their expenses plus, she had 7 figures saved and was adding to it every year. I don’t know for sure where she stands financially now, but any inheritance we might have thought was coming is likely gone. In home care is quickly eating up her savings, in spite of having a great insurance plan that covers a chunk of it.
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Old 12-18-2020, 06:18 AM   #59
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Not running out yet, but 5 years ago we assumed we would be getting an inheritance from DHís mom. Her and her late husbands pension and SS covered all their expenses plus, she had 7 figures saved and was adding to it every year. I donít know for sure where she stands financially now, but any inheritance we might have thought was coming is likely gone. In home care is quickly eating up her savings, in spite of having a great insurance plan that covers a chunk of it.
Interesting.
Could eventually be in a partial version of your situation.
My father at 90 y.o. now needs 24/7 home care. My parents also have a 7 figure portfolio which was being added to each year, but will decrease for the first time next year.
They also do have an LTC plan, but it will only cover 66k yearly and the cost is around 150k yearly.
Ironically, the nursing home coverage is similar.

What is different is I control all their investments, so I can see what the balances and total spending is.
Additionally, they do have an irrevocable trust for some of their monies, so perhaps the monies won't go to zero.
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Old 12-18-2020, 07:06 AM   #60
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Thanks. That’s a relief.
Yeah, I believe SSDI is the part on your SS statement where it says "If you became disabled right now, your payment would about.... $X,XXX a month".

Looking at my own SS statement, the disability benefit is just slightly below what my benefit would be if I took SSA at 67. However, that may vary from person to person.

At some point though, you quit getting SSDI and get your regular SS benefit, instead. I can't remember if that's at age 65, or your FRA.

My uncle went on disability when he was 61, and I do remember at some point, his benefit went down slightly when he went from SSDI to regular SS. His FRA was 66, but I swear it seems longer ago than that. But, 65 versus 66 is only one year, and my memory ain't what it used to be!

As for SSI, according to the SS website, the maximum SSI payment, as of 2020, is $783/mo for an individual and $1,175 for a couple. However, many states add a supplement to that.
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