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Old 10-29-2020, 11:31 AM   #61
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We have only been retired a little over 2 years.
DH pension began mid 2018. DH IS 63 and Iím 59.. We have not collected SS yet.
Our WD rate for 2019 and 2020 was 3.5% of 12/31/2018 portfolio. Of this amount I move 20k annually to Ally savings account for future major home project or car replacement.
In my opinion, it is way too early to determine if we have over saved. A lot can happen in 30+ years. Luckily we do have non essential items we can reduce if necessary.
My hope is we do have $ at the end for our children and grandkids. I donít understand the comments that inheritance can ruin them. I truly believe that our generation has been very fortunate. For example, DH has a pension- that is rare today. So i will be very happy if thereís a little $ at the end to make their lives a bit better.
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Old 10-29-2020, 01:16 PM   #62
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I had done all the on-line calculators and even built my own spreadsheets that looked at average returns and historical returns. Everything said we're OK, but I couldn't convince myself, let alone DW, so we are still working.

Then I did the simplest possible analysis of a "no return on investment", "no inflation", "no change in spending", "no change in laws" world. Assumed both of us lived to 90.

Found that we would never spend more than 42% of what we have. So I think we have over-saved!
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Old 10-29-2020, 03:01 PM   #63
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Having inherited some of my portfolio, I donít mind at all if Iíve over saved. Until Medicare age, my only fear is not hiring able to get health insurance then having a million dollar health problem.

DS is struggling to find a decent wage career path that makes him happy, but he has a number of activities that give him joy. If he inherits his retirement, thatís fine with me.

Career achievement is overrated. Too many people who were department chairs and medical leaders have abruptly quit and moved to other career paths with greater life satisfaction. 18 months after retiring, Iím still struggling to deal with the damage done by chronic burnout.

Iíd rather see my offspring have a joyful life than have to worry about food, clothing, and housing in the event of a job loss.

Having over-saved is a very good problem to have.
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Old 10-29-2020, 07:09 PM   #64
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Until Medicare age, my only fear is not hiring able to get health insurance then having a million dollar health problem.

.
My biggest fear there too, no matter how many FIRE calculators I run. I retire at 47, long about 54 or pick a number before Medicare, there is no healthcare available for political or other reasons yet to be determined. You get really sick at that moment with million dollar bills. Not hard to do.

It's really a shame you can do everything right financially and that always hangs over us US citizens at least. That stress alone is killing me
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Old 10-29-2020, 07:24 PM   #65
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The only number I care about is "max out of pocket"
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Old 10-29-2020, 07:28 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by whatnot View Post
My hope is we do have $ at the end for our children and grandkids. I donít understand the comments that inheritance can ruin them. I truly believe that our generation has been very fortunate. For example, DH has a pension- that is rare today. So i will be very happy if thereís a little $ at the end to make their lives a bit better.
I guess we all know our kids better than anyone here on the forum. It's always been my opinion that way too much money is worse than a bit too little money. Kids learn more from struggling than they do from sudden wealth. We have consistently helped each of the kids. We've helped with down payments on houses, funded Roth IRAs (now worth 50K), often given unsolicited gifts (10K) and been available as a financial back up. In short OUR plan has been to help our kids get established while we are still living.

With that in mind, we do not feel a need to leave our kids all our wealth when we die. We'll leave a nice "chunk" that will be something nice to remember us by, but we won't dump half a mil on each one. The kids know that our priorities through our life times (and theirs) has been to our favorite charities. We've always seen that the kids had everything they need and we'll continue to do that as long as we live. However, our charities - who have no way to w*rk for money - will get the lion's share of the remainder of our wealth - should we continue to maintain and/or grow it. If illness or inflation destroys our wealth, all bets are off in any case. May that never happen to any of us!

I don't expect anyone else to do what we are doing or maybe even understand it. However, no one else knows us or our kids like we do. I think each family needs to have their own plan and execute that plan to the best of their ability. As always, YMMV.
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Old 10-29-2020, 07:36 PM   #67
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Having inherited some of my portfolio, I don’t mind at all if I’ve over saved. Until Medicare age, my only fear is not hiring able to get health insurance then having a million dollar health problem.

DS is struggling to find a decent wage career path that makes him happy, but he has a number of activities that give him joy. If he inherits his retirement, that’s fine with me.

Career achievement is overrated. Too many people who were department chairs and medical leaders have abruptly quit and moved to other career paths with greater life satisfaction. 18 months after retiring, I’m still struggling to deal with the damage done by chronic burnout.

I’d rather see my offspring have a joyful life than have to worry about food, clothing, and housing in the event of a job loss.

Having over-saved is a very good problem to have.
I could not agree more with everything you said about your DS. I just don’t understand the idea that money will ruin kids. IME, the ruining usually happens far earlier than an inheritance. I’ve seen wealthy kids who are amazing citizens and spoiled brats who contribute nothing. How parents handle issues of money make a huge difference, as does temperament of course.

As someone who put a lot into my career and had a lot of stress around financial security, I would love nothing more than to have my kids grow up and be able to choose a career they love, irrespective of the dollars involved.
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Old 10-29-2020, 07:39 PM   #68
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The only number I care about is "max out of pocket"
A good approach, it still assumes some plan will be available with a premium one can afford to have a "max out of pocket" to begin with.

I hear ya though. In essence if your premiums are $12,000 a year and max out of pocket is $18,000 the two combined could be budgeted at $30,000 a year assuming a policy remains available for purchase.

The way the rules are always being challenged by politicians, insurance industry, doctors and all sorts of other interested parties; it is still a bit of a crapshoot at best.
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Old 10-29-2020, 08:44 PM   #69
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Part of the reason we may have "over saved" are two unexpected items:
1) An inheritance from our parents estate that we did not plan on, that due to patience became even larger.

2) Planning for a worst case medical costs before medicare that did not materialize. In sum, based on ACA non-subsidized rates in 2016 (due to my pension we would not be eligible for any subsidy) and advice from our Megacorp financial planner, we planned for close to $150K in medical premiums/expenses before Medicare. My retirement method and Megacorp retiree insurance plans will make actual costs less than $50K.

We have no need to raise our other spending. While we do not know what the future holds, for now the difference will just go into the "over saved" pot.
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Old 10-30-2020, 04:43 AM   #70
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Have to admit being in the over save camp. We spent $60K on renovations this year, and only needed 2.6% WR for that. Since so much travel was cancelled this year, we have $10K of our $30K travel budget left over. I figured that if we had no renos, and normal travel, we would only need 1.6% WR (plus the modest pension). I'm planning now to redo the home office like an English Tudor library with lots of oak.
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Old 10-30-2020, 06:02 AM   #71
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I can't be all alone here. Like most on this site (I would assume), long time big % saver, always LBYMs, "relative" frugality in my genes, worked the plan with an designed exit at 55 (when kid 4 was out of the nest/independent). I moved the goal posts many times as I dialed in my desired retirement spend (FatFire growing by inflation annually), ran (what now appears to be ridiculously) conservative assumptions (i.e. no SS, all my withdrawals taxable as income despites having 50% in after tax accounts). Fast forward to today, I'm 56, decided on a phase out (still earning income mainly because my biz is still very lucrative even on a very part time/Covid world basis and I need to fill some idle time). None the less, I have started running real calculators that take into account a "real" withdrawal strategy, which includes plugging in my basis on my after tax accounts, tax implications based on our current known taxes, a conservative 75% of SS at age 70, a 6% annual return on a 60/40 AA, and all the models say I will easily double my NW by age 94! Yes, 1st world problems that can be solved thru charity and gifting to kids. None the less, funny how we play Jedi mind tricks on ourselves to motivate us to "get to the number" and then you get there and wonder why you worked like a dog to hit some magical number that was overkill. Anyone else wakeup to this?
Dawgman; If you had it to do over again would you really do things differently? I think not. I think you love the belt and suspenders position you are in. I think you loved your business and had no reason to cut the cord sooner. I think you've led the life you wanted too, with very little if any deprivation and still managed to pile up a bundle. Good for you.

I say this because that is exactly what we did. Heck our withdrawal rate has never even approached 1% and probably never will. I recognize your mindset and through your posts over the last few years know that you spend a bundle and can continue to in your retirement. I don't know why you are second guessing your path to wealth.
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Old 10-30-2020, 07:48 AM   #72
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It's been more than a year since I stopped working and only now I'm fully grasping that for years I've been too focused on making and saving money and neglecting what's really important to me: time. An unusual resource in that it can’t be saved. Your life is passing by every second regardless of what you are doing.

It turns out that being fearful about money, working at a ridiculous job and oversaving robbed me of enjoying my time.
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Old 10-30-2020, 07:53 AM   #73
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I find myself in the same situation, although I'm still working. The plan is to sell my company in three years @60. At that point our income will be triple our expenses (with a heavy travel budget). I have a new a new concern that didn't even exist a year ago-a huge increase in taxes. Considering the 3 trillion spent in COVID relief and an election who knows where we end up tax wise? NJ Gov. Murphy has already instituted new taxes and/or increased taxes on "the rich". I saw on TV someone said there are approx 3,000 counties in the U.S. If so the relief fund equates to $1 Billion per county...might be working for a while.
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Old 10-30-2020, 03:26 PM   #74
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Recognized that some years ago! The DW and I started gifting the annual no tax maximums to the DD a few years ago.... Other than that, I've been practicing blowing that dough on an accelerated schedule.
Phenomenal. My ole man uttered the words 'jeez I might need to start giving some of this to my kids I cant spend it fast enough'

A good problem to have. But so far no gifts hehehe.
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Old 10-30-2020, 03:44 PM   #75
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We were all savers before our retirement, so even after our retirement, I think we still enjoy seeing our numbers grow. Hard to break the habit.
Take a lesson from Robbie- blow that dough! I saved and scrimped and lived below my means until 3 months ago. Just bought our dream house, and are in the process of buying furniture, garage workstation/cabinets, and doing improvements. I'm having a hard time coming up with enough $ to spend that don't require paying more taxes this year!
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Congratulations
Old 10-30-2020, 03:47 PM   #76
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Congratulations

First well done. We came out better than planned, but the bottom could drop out of the markets, or, or, or and I could what if all day.

One relative is spending $20K per month taking care of his Alzheimerís afflicted dad.

Better to have a solid cushion and not need it rather than the opposite.

That said, enjoy life!
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Old 10-30-2020, 04:01 PM   #77
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I might have over saved. I tell myself if the markets collapses I have a home paid for and hopefully SS will still be around. I would be ok. I worry about my one single adult daughter. She got caught in the generation who has college but no jobs that pay well. I have to resist helping her but she does ok. She is so frugal, drives her deceased grandmother car, works 3 PT jobs. When she told me she had 20k in savings I almost fell over. Every yr I do her taxes and I put money in a ROTH for her, she doesn't know it. She gets a savers credit and I feel like I done something for her.
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Old 10-30-2020, 04:20 PM   #78
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My DH and I feel we did without in our younger days in order to save money. No regrets there. We have a senior housing condo that we rent. The people renting it are getting a govt agency to pay for approx 3/4 of the rent. In conversation and background checks, this couple must have spent every dime they made. He retired from the post office on a disability pension. His wife gets a small SS check so she must have worked at least 10 years but not made much money. They asked me to sign a paper verifying their rent so they could get food stamps. They are living a good standard of living, next door to retired people who have saved their money. I wish them no harm, they are nice people but I can't help but feel a bit jealous that they are living a very nice standard of living and must not have saved anything. It makes me wonder if I should transfer all my money to my kid and then apply for all these benefits too.
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Old 10-30-2020, 04:31 PM   #79
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My DH and I feel we did without in our younger days in order to save money. No regrets there. We have a senior housing condo that we rent. The people renting it are getting a govt agency to pay for approx 3/4 of the rent. In conversation and background checks, this couple must have spent every dime they made. He retired from the post office on a disability pension. His wife gets a small SS check so she must have worked at least 10 years but not made much money. They asked me to sign a paper verifying their rent so they could get food stamps. They are living a good standard of living, next door to retired people who have saved their money. I wish them no harm, they are nice people but I can't help but feel a bit jealous that they are living a very nice standard of living and must not have saved anything. It makes me wonder if I should transfer all my money to my kid and then apply for all these benefits too.
Blanche Dubois may "have always depended on the kindness of strangers." But that is not the life for me.
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No Such Thing
Old 10-30-2020, 05:38 PM   #80
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No Such Thing

As far as I am concerned there is no such thing as saving too much. The wife has been 11 years into her retirement while I am 6, and we are both now 67. We only need about 1.5% of our net worth on a yearly basis to be all in on our costs, meaning we should never run out of money. But no one knows what the future holds so having as much saved as possible is always a positive. Don't belabor how successful you were at saving; just enjoy it.
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