Living abroad for a few years in the cheaper countries...

[ShokWaveRider]

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Originally Posted by Puravida1 We sold up and moved to Malta. Its just south of Sicily and culture is a cross between the UK and Italy. It has two official languages, one of which is English. Even though you are an EU citizen living in another EU country, you dont get free healthcare unless you are working and paying into their system. Infact nearly all EU countries will only allow citizens from other EU countries live there if they carry private insurance. That said, insurance is much cheaper than the US.

What if you are a Maltese Citizen coming back to Malta after living abroard all your working years? I am a Citizen. DW is not..... yet but is entitled to be because of mine.

[Puravida1]

You get free access to public hospitals in Malta and also a Maltese European Health Insurance card that will get you free care while travelling in the EU. You also get free care in the UK via the UK Malta Reciprocal health care agreement. This would also allow you to retire to the UK instead of Malta and get free public care there. Your wife gets the same as you.

[gerntz]

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Originally Posted by Puravida1 We sold up and moved to Malta. Its just south of Sicily and culture is a cross between the UK and Italy. It has two official languages, one of which is English. As few things to consider: - You cant get out of US taxes so count on paying the same taxes as you would at home. Moving to another state before you move can save you some money, but that wont work if you keep your primary home and rent it out. California in particular will not recognize your move if you do this. However most countries in Europe will also declare you resident after a few months and then tax your worldwide income including social security etc, even if you leave that money in the US. You may find this makes living in Europe more expensive tax wise than staying at home. The only countries I have seen that dont do this are the former British colonies: Gibralter, Cyprus and Malta. Even though you are an EU citizen living in another EU country, you dont get free healthcare unless you are working and paying into their system. Infact nearly all EU countries will only allow citizens from other EU countries live there if they carry private insurance. That said, insurance is much cheaper than the US. The language barrier is real. Even in places like portugal you will find that the locals all speak portuguese to each other and if you are away from the gringo areas many will not have english. The netherlands is probably the best country for multilingual english speakers and even there its common to find yourself stuck if you dont speak dutch. Malta and Ireland are the only two remaining English speaking countries in the EU and Spanish is really only useful in Spain. Be careful with crime. The chances of being attacked are in general lower than in the US, but in many places, property crimes are much higher. Having your home robbed is still an unpleasant experience. I always look for bars in ground floor windows on houses to determine if the crime is too high for me to want to live there

Malta is quite nice in my limited experience.

[6miths]

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Originally Posted by gerntz Malta is quite nice in my limited experience.

Yes agree. We greatly enjoyed Malta. Definitely a nice mix of attributes. Spent a couple of weeks there with UK relatives.

[brett]

We enjoyed Malta. We stayed in several different places-small hotels or B&B's.

We found air/travel connections to Malta to be very good. Especially Air Malta. Lots of low cost airline options. We flew in from Prague and out to Catania, Sicily. The Catania fare was only slightly higher than the ferry cost.

We plan to go back...and revisit Sicily on the same trip.

[Ed_The_Gypsy]

I would sell the house. Experience.

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Originally Posted by JoseSantiago Hi friends, So I wanted to get some thoughts, I am close to the glorious early retirement and have always wanted to live abroad, in my pension system if I leave at 20 years (public safety) my pension is around 65k, verses 25 80k, I have saved from real estate and construction work, and various side jobs so I'll have around $1 million in 401/457 (hopefully w no major dips), mortgage paid off, no kids, no divorce payments. I'm considering leaving at 20 rather than 25 and living in south america or cheaper parts of Europe for 5 years instead of working 5 more years. I could rent my house out for $2500 a month (minimum). My thinking is to not touch my 401/457 and live soley off rent and a bit of pension, thus making the package perhaps even better than working 25 years. What's been the general experience in moving to cheaper countries and renting out your primary? Any... I wish I knew I should think about? I.e. Dual taxation? I'm fluent in 3 languages and hold dual citizenship to live in the EU, South America a bit more complicated but doable to legally stay. Thanks as always for any thoughts or feedback.

[Old Microbiologist]

ncbill - I agree. But, the US is not the cheapest or even the best in the world. You are correct though we "could"enroll back in Part B, pay the penalties and get free medical through the military again. I "could" also go to the Landstuhl Medical Center in Germany for "space available" treatment. I was, after all, guaranteed "free" medical care for life when I re-enlisted back in 1973 after being drafted in 1971. They have more or less (except the betrayal of McCain) kept their end of the bargain but have put some of the financial back on us retirees. Should Medicare for All ever pass then this all goes out the window. Maybe the pandemic will be enough to force our legislature to abandon their support for the medical corporations. If you consider we are less than 10% infected and everything has gone off the rails. We still have 90% or more of the population to go and it is already obvious the vaccine program is to going not be enough to prevent another half a million deaths. Yes, Hungary is just as awful in this regard and our death rate per million is nearly as high as the US. But, Hungary is taking vaccine from every possible corner and will begin manufacturing the Sputnik V this month. The US is stuck with a dodgy, unproven mRNA vaccines with zero long term testing or even any animal testing prior to going into human subjects. The mRNA method is new and untested for long term effects. If the 4 cases of facial palsy from the clinical trial hold up (which indicates an auto-immune reaction) then a lot of people are going to be unhappy especially when they try and sue as Congress has indemnified the corporations. So, I think US medical is going to be overwhelmed for the foreseeable future. It is the same pretty much everywhere outside of Asia.

Surprisingly, here in Hungary we get modern medical treatment at decent prices. Should I need something ridiculously expensive done, and I can't imagine what that might be, there are options inside the EU. Switzerland is close enough and although not inexpensive is a modern alternative. My wife is Russian and maintains dual citizenship so I could also take advantage of that and get medical treatment done there almost as cheap as here and perhaps a bit more modern especially in the private arena. In the private pay arena where you pay cash the options expand immensely. For example, every physician in Hungary is a government employee and their salaries are modest yet considered high here at around 2000 Euros a month. Physicians aren't in it for the money here and are happy to serve the people. However, almost every physician maintains private office hours, usually one day a week, in the evening. Some have external clinics they have created for this purpose and these are modern, clean, and very well equipped. Some just use their normal government offices but after closing. My wife's cardiologist has created a co-op clinic which is 1/4 mile away and has everything including an MRI and CT scan. The cost for a private full body CT scan is under $200. They have every specialist in the clinic and have their own small laboratory. So, we seem to be fine without needing to enroll in the National Health Care program.

[ncbill]

Uh-huh...can you get organ transplants there?

Both the Mexican expat I mentioned previously (liver) and my own father-in-law (kidney) received their "pre-owned" organs after age 75...most expenses paid thanks to Medicare, though in my F-I-L's case the VA also covered his most expensive post-transplant medications.

Like I said, if you're in the above situation you probably won't mind paying the cumulative annual penally for late signup for Medicare Part B.

[Thomas3857]

Very interesting thread with great information. Our first thought was to retire to Spain in the next couple of years. Have been there a number of times and my Spanish skills are improving. Looked at an area around Valencia as it´s on the sea and less expensive than Barcelona. However, after researching taxes I´m not sure that´s our best move. Spain has a wealth tax and although it varies depending on the region it can take a big bite. Additionally, the progressive tax rate is extremely high. As I understand it, we will be considered a tax resident if we live in the country for 183 days or more. We are now considering Portugal primarily because of the non-habitual residency tax program. Never really considered Latin or Central America for a variety of reasons (crime, health care, corruption, etc.) but the reality may be different from my perception. For us, taxes and health care are the main issues now. Still doing my research.

[Poopycat]

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Originally Posted by ncbill I don't know of any Central or South American countries with such a requirement, and as you noted, those are also on your list.

They are on my list but not as high up there as Portugal or Spain.