Our new big FIRE adventure

[FIREd]

Ceilings - as W2R suggested - area rugs and upholstered furniture will dampen the echo effect. We did the labor ourselves in de-popcorning... But only after testing for asbestos. We tested positive for asbestos upstairs - and those are still popcorn. (It's super pricey to dispose of asbestos popcorn and illegal to just put it in the landfill.) We didn't have any issues with the ceiling and DH just treated it like any other drywall surface (it was sheetrock under the popcorn)... patch & tape where necessary - then we painted. If you do remove the popcorn - do it before you have the floors done - it would stink to get paint on new floors.

Countertops - have you considered alternatives to granite? We did ours in a combination of stainless steel and butcher block. (Mostly stainless - but butcher on one area near the stove.) I *love* the ease of stainless - there is a reason it is the countertop of choice in commercial kitchens.... so easy to keep clean. If you go this route - make sure you shop around. We found sheet metal shops jacked up the prices when we mentioned it was for a residential kitchen... so we ended up ordering through a commercial kitchen supply place... About half the price of granite.

We went with a nice porcelain in the kitchen and bath - then marble basketweave in the master bath. It's nice to have a touch of luxury - and it's a small enough space that it wasn't too pricey.

Good luck with this project!

I would like a stainless steel countertop for the reasons you mentioned (easy to keep clean and sanitary), but we are already going for a white on white look and I wonder if stainless steel is not going to make the kitchen look too sterile?

 

[haha]

You didn't mention just biting the bullet and getting rid of the place with adequate discounting. That is what I would do. Moving from San Francisco to rural or suburban Alabama may be all the change you would want to handle for a good long time.

Ha

 

[ElizabethT]

Oh I love me a good remodeling project!

Re: Wood Floors. I now have them throughout most of my home aside from bathrooms and three bedrooms. I love the look of one sweeping floor covering, and they are very easy to care for, including the wood flooring in our kitchen. We elect to remove our shoes after entering our home, a personal preference.

And with regard to echoing - between area rugs and 'normal' furniture we do not notice a difference. Emptying a room out for painting, then yes, we definitely hear echoing, but it diminishes immediately upon rug and furniture replacement.

Re: Ceilings. I vote for getting rid of the popcorn as I don't see it ever coming back in style, nor the current preference for smooth ceilings ever going out of style. This is a messy, but easy and relatively inexpensive change that delivers very big bang for your buck IMHO. If you do proceed, I wouldrecommend having your painter do the job before you move in as it does generally render the house unlivable during the two-to-three day process.

 

[FUEGO]

You didn't mention just biting the bullet and getting rid of the place with adequate discounting. That is what I would do. Moving from San Francisco to rural or suburban Alabama may be all the change you would want to handle for a good long time.

Ha

That's my thinking too - knock $20k or $50k off the price and be done with it. Then rent a nice house or condo if you can't find one to buy. I bet someone would buy it and turn it into a rental if the price were right (or try to flip it themselves).

FIREd, at least you're FIREd and can superintend the construction project.

 

[FIREd]

You didn't mention just biting the bullet and getting rid of the place with adequate discounting. That is what I would do. Moving from San Francisco to rural or suburban Alabama may be all the change you would want to handle for a good long time.

Ha

In early 2015, we had fallen so hard for California that we told the realtor to sell the AL house ASAP, at any price. DW was still working and not looking to retire early. With her income, we could easily afford to stay in the Bay Area and even started shopping for homes here. The realtor did not price the AL house aggressively enough however, and it failed to sell quickly. We pushed for more price cuts and at one point, the house was listed at a major discount to the original listing price. The more we lowered the price, the more buyers looked for gotchas and we failed to get an offer (the feedback we got from prospective buyers was getting worse and worse with each price cuts).

Then a number of things happen in 2015 which made us rethink our strategy. After much reflection, DW and I agreed that it made sense for us to move back to the Southeast after all. We looked at several cities around the area we like best (TN, NC, SC, norther GA, Northern AL). As it turned out, AL was actually pretty attractive. Since we already had a house there, there was no point in aggressively discounting the house any longer.

We determined that we can still make the house work for us, why lose a bunch of money on it (in fees, commissions, and discounts), to buy another one not so far away?

 

[FIREd]

That's my thinking too - knock $20k or $50k off the price and be done with it. Then rent a nice house or condo if you can't find one to buy. I bet someone would buy it and turn it into a rental if the price were right (or try to flip it themselves).

FIREd, at least you're FIREd and can superintend the construction project.

Superintend? I intend to do much of the work myself.

 

[haha]

I understand your reasoning, and I hope it works out very well for you.

Ha

 

[FUEGO]

Superintend? I intend to do much of the work myself.

Oh, okay! Even more hands on work!

Your reasoning makes sense to just keep the house and not take a big loss. I couldn't remember how in love you were with the house from your OP several months/years ago and thought you didn't like the house that much and wanted a different house of some sort.

I think I "voted" upthread for your eventual decision - spend a moderate amount on mostly cosmetic issues (no major gutting and renovation) and keep the house you already own. That's what I would do.

 

[FIREd]

Oh, okay! Even more hands on work!

Your reasoning makes sense to just keep the house and not take a big loss. I couldn't remember how in love you were with the house from your OP several months/years ago and thought you didn't like the house that much and wanted a different house of some sort.

I think I "voted" upthread for your eventual decision - spend a moderate amount on mostly cosmetic issues (no major gutting and renovation) and keep the house you already own. That's what I would do.

When I started the thread one year ago, I was not really in love with the house. After having lived for a few years in a modern condo filled with natural light, the house looked outdated and dark. But I was reminded earlier in the thread that we actually enjoyed living there, not so long ago. So it's not a bad house. It just needs a bit of updating. I feel a lot more positive about it now that we have come up with a plan.

 

[Meadbh]

When I started the thread one year ago, I was not really in love with the house. After having lived for a few years in a modern condo filled with natural light, the house looked outdated and dark. But I was reminded earlier in the thread that we actually enjoyed living there, not so long ago. So it's not a bad house. It just needs a bit of updating. I feel a lot more positive about it now that we have come up with a plan.

A good renovation can make your house into a home you love.

 

[spncity]

How about some solar tubes to bring in light?

 

[FIREd]

How about some solar tubes to bring in light?

Potentially. We will start by removing the window treatments partially blocking the windows, painting all the rooms white, and using more reflective surfaces (like light-colored hardwood floors) to bring in more light. And we plan on pushing the tree line back in the backyard to get more light there.

We are also rearranging the rooms a bit. So, for example, we will switch my home office and the guest bedroom. Since I spend much of my day in my office, it makes sense to relocate it where there is good natural light. Meanwhile, the guest bedroom rarely gets used -mostly at night anyway- so there is less need to have lots of natural light in that room. Yet the guest room had the best light and my office was a cave. So we'll move the office to the front of the house, where the lighting is adequate throughout the day, and the guest room to the back, where it is darker (when it gets used, guests only spend the night there anyway). Why did we not think about it before? Ha!

We'll see. We might still have to use solar tubes for the back rooms...

 

[FIREd]

Update for those interested:

We made the move back to Alabama a month ago. We originally considered living off-site during the renovation of the house, but we decided to tough it out and live on-site with the mess (sizable saving + the mess = motivation to keep working toward our goal).

Upon pulling into the driveway after a 4-day drive from California, I really wondered if we had made the right choice. The house needed some TLC after being vacant for more than 2 years. It felt like such a step down from our modern condo in SF! DW and I spent the past month raking and bagging leaves, power washing, sweeping, scrubbing, painting, etc... And repairing a bunch of small stuff. We discovered 2 small leaks when we turned the water back on (one involved a cracked toilet). We had to change a capacitor on the HVAC. And the handle on a storm door, and the weather stripping under the front door, and a couple of soffit vents, and on and on... Now I am starting to see again why I used to love this house!

With the uncertainty related to healthcare, I am glad that we decided to go with a more conservative renovation plan, as we don't know how long we will be able to stay here. We are now concentrating on renovations that will add the most value to the house in case we have to sell. We have ordered the hardwood flooring that I will lay throughout the house - except in the kitchen and bathrooms. We went for a light-colored wood floor to brighten up the interior. I already pulled up all the carpets on the first floor and was relieved to discover that the slab underneath was in excellent condition (last year's drought led to settling issues in this area).

So it's a work in progress. I give myself until the end of the year to get the house ready for market - if we end up having to sell. There is a lot of painting to do, some tiling in the kitchen and bathrooms, maybe new countertops too.

But I am positively liking the new, more upscal-ish vibe of the area. It has become so much more attractive than it used to be thanks to two new upper middle class neighborhoods that were built in the last few years. The new money has attracted a lot of new dining options and a huge Whole Foods. Lots of nice cars and designer goods too, which were non-existant in this area just a few years ago. Living in an older neighborhood, I don't feel the need to compete with the new crowd, but I sure appreciate the amenities that they have attracted.

 

[REWahoo]

Thanks for the update. Sounds like the old neighborhood is much better than when you left it - something that isn't always the case when you go home again.

Also sounds like you'll end up really liking both the area and the house, especially after putting so much effort into remodeling. And I may be in the minority but I believe the healthcare mess will eventually (and painfully) get worked out, allowing you to stay and enjoy the results of all your hard work.

 

[W2R]

Yes, thanks for the update! Renovating and doing so much yourself is hard work. I hope perhaps you feel more optimistic about living in Alabama once the house is more livable and you have had a chance to recover from the trip and renovations. Glad you made it there safely.

I'd imagine it seems nice to not be paying that high SF rent any more.

 

[FIREd]

Thanks for the update. Sounds like the old neighborhood is much better than when you left it - something that isn't always the case when you go home again.

Also sounds like you'll end up really liking both the area and the house, especially after putting so much effort into remodeling. And I may be in the minority but I believe the healthcare mess will eventually (and painfully) get worked out, allowing you to stay and enjoy the results of all your hard work.

Hoping that you are right on the healthcare front, because we could see ourselves stay here for the long haul.

 

[FIREd]

Yes, thanks for the update! Renovating and doing so much yourself is hard work. I hope perhaps you feel more optimistic about living in Alabama once the house is more livable and you have had a chance to recover from the trip and renovations. Glad you made it there safely.

I'd imagine it seems nice to not be paying that high SF rent any more.

It is very nice. The move relieves some pressure on our portfolio while still allowing more discretionary spending. It puts us in a better position to weather the next bear market.

 

[Bestwifeever]

Your "new" old house sounds awesome, FIREd, and it's always fun to rediscover why you liked something so much in the first place. Perhaps you can enjoy health care tourism in the old country once a year or so if the evolving US health care system turns out not to be a good fit for you, and enjoy the best of both worlds.

 

[Koolau]

FIREd, I haven't reviewed the entire thread so you may have already addressed some issues about which I'm curious. No need to respond if too personal or impertinent.

First let me say that we moved to HI 10 years ago from the midwest. We did so for the weather, the lifestyle, the beauty, no snow, etc. etc. Our kids scattered within the mainland and the planes go both ways. We're very happy with our choice, BUT it has been a costly choice - which we have been able to afford. While we can see no reason to ever permanently return, we have that as a back-up if financial issues arise that threaten our enjoyment of Paradise. With all this in mind:

I can't recall why you moved to SF area and then also wondering why you are returning to Alabama. Are you now looking at the experience as a 5 year vacation or an experiment which has run its course? I think I'm just trying to learn from your experience because our "experiment" is still running and I'm still looking for pitfalls. Thanks ever so much!

 

[FUEGO]

Sounds like you're getting back into the swing of things! Hope it's beautiful there in AL this week like it's been in NC (70's, perfect outdoor weather other than a few sprinkles).

We've had a heck of a month with our house. HVAC service to (hopefully) fix a 50% reduction in operating efficiency (dirty coils; low refrigerant due to very very slow leak). Main sewer line was clogged - $389 for plumber to come out (at least we found the clean out which was 2 ft underground!). Then the electricity started flickering and we lost power for a day while the power company replaced our meter base and housing (still waiting on them to replace the neutral back to their transformer; currently using a "service saver" device they temporarily installed). And all this happened in the middle of finding a roofing contractor to replace our roof (at least it'll be mostly free after insurance - yay for hail damage!). And there are other lingering minor plumbing things. Oh and the decking on the push mower rusted through so I need to replace it before it falls apart while mowing and slices me open.

Owning a home is fun, let me tell you. Can you tell me more stories of renting a condo?

 

[FIREd]

Your "new" old house sounds awesome, FIREd, and it's always fun to rediscover why you liked something so much in the first place. Perhaps you can enjoy health care tourism in the old country once a year or so if the evolving US health care system turns out not to be a good fit for you, and enjoy the best of both worlds.

As far as healthcare goes, we have options and we will adapt. As for the house, I can't wait to make it even better.

 

[FIREd]

FIREd, I haven't reviewed the entire thread so you may have already addressed some issues about which I'm curious. No need to respond if too personal or impertinent.

First let me say that we moved to HI 10 years ago from the midwest. We did so for the weather, the lifestyle, the beauty, no snow, etc. etc. Our kids scattered within the mainland and the planes go both ways. We're very happy with our choice, BUT it has been a costly choice - which we have been able to afford. While we can see no reason to ever permanently return, we have that as a back-up if financial issues arise that threaten our enjoyment of Paradise. With all this in mind:

I can't recall why you moved to SF area and then also wondering why you are returning to Alabama. Are you now looking at the experience as a 5 year vacation or an experiment which has run its course? I think I'm just trying to learn from your experience because our "experiment" is still running and I'm still looking for pitfalls. Thanks ever so much!

We moved to SF for DW's work back in 2012. I was already retired, so for me it felt like I was offered a vacation on the West Coast. When we moved to SF, we figured that it would be temporary because of the high cost of living in the Bay Area (no way could we stay there after DW retired, I thought). But in the end, the hight cost of living was not the primary driver for our move back to AL.

The primary driver was MIL, who lives in AL and turns 74 soon. She is starting to need help and DW (who is her only family) felt like we should move closer to assist her when in need. We happened to have a paid-for house a few minutes away from MIL's home. It had been vacant for a while and felt like a loose end, so it seemed logical to move back into the house and utilize that asset. Tonight for example, MIL was involved in a minor fender bender and she really appreciated the fact that we were close by for support.

Also, our FIRE plan was originally tailored for an average or slightly above average cost of living area in the US, and not for an area like SF (we lived most of our lives in fairly affordable locales and had no reason to think that one day we would experience living in a city as expensive as SF!). While FIREcalc said that we could have retired in SF in the end (thanks to the bull market of the past few years), it would have required a WR which was higher than we felt comfortable with. Our budget in SF was also dominated by non-compressible expenses like housing and it would have been difficult to cut back on spending during a bear market. In AL, our basic expenses are much, much lower, and with 30-40% of our expenses being discretionary, we have plenty of flexibility. It gives us greater peace of mind.

Finally, unlike many people, we do not have strong preferences for the area where we live (as long as it is safe and the weather is half-decent). We have lived in sprawling metropolises, mid-size cities, and small towns. We have always managed to make the most of our environment. We were happy in SF and we were happy in AL before that.

There is no telling if our return to AL will be permanent. For now, AL is the place to be for us. Ten years from now, who knows? We are still young and we are not yet looking for a final place to hang our hat...

 

[FIREd]

Sounds like you're getting back into the swing of things! Hope it's beautiful there in AL this week like it's been in NC (70's, perfect outdoor weather other than a few sprinkles).

We've had a heck of a month with our house. HVAC service to (hopefully) fix a 50% reduction in operating efficiency (dirty coils; low refrigerant due to very very slow leak). Main sewer line was clogged - $389 for plumber to come out (at least we found the clean out which was 2 ft underground!). Then the electricity started flickering and we lost power for a day while the power company replaced our meter base and housing (still waiting on them to replace the neutral back to their transformer; currently using a "service saver" device they temporarily installed). And all this happened in the middle of finding a roofing contractor to replace our roof (at least it'll be mostly free after insurance - yay for hail damage!). And there are other lingering minor plumbing things. Oh and the decking on the push mower rusted through so I need to replace it before it falls apart while mowing and slices me open.

Owning a home is fun, let me tell you. Can you tell me more stories of renting a condo?

Isn't home ownership swell? Renting a condo was fun, but I sometimes missed the tinkering.

 

[brucethebroker]

As a survivor of 11 personal home moves, plus two vacation home moves over our marriage (all but two serious fixxer uppers), DW and I can appreciate your hard work returning home. Home renovations can be both happy, and frustrating times. We still love looking around, but now want to skip the mid-level fixxer uppers and only seriously consider the redecorating/cosmetic type challenges.

Hope you quickly get through your Alabama re-do!

 

[TrophyWife]

Can you divide and build a second home on the lot? Do some minor upgrades to the big one and then Air BnB it or use it when family is in town, once your small home is done.