Put them on notice

[ScaredtoQuit]

I broke a cardinal law today. I told my boss that I was going to ER this year. But here's the rub... I don't intend to do it until 12/1. The reason I decided to give her such a long notice was because we've been friends for 25 plus years. I wanted to give her enough time to plan for my replacement. I figured that if I waited until the very last minute (as everyone else has recommended) I would really be screwing her.

I don't think I am losing anything. There is about a ZERO chance that my Company will decide to offer a severance package in the next ten months. Other than that, I can't think of any other compelling reasons why I should have kept quiet. Any thoughts?

 

[Brat]

What's done, is done.

My concern is the length of time of your notice, something could happen that would derail your plans. IMHO 60-90 would have been more than sufficient for a friend/manager to adjust and would decrease the risk on your side.

In addition, some companies pull internal security authorizations when notice is given.

 

[Coach]

Scared, I'm in the same boat. I've worked for my boss for 25 years and consider her a good friend. Although I haven't set a date yet, she knows I'm getting close, and she'll get months of notice when the time comes.

In my case friend trumps boss. I think you did the right thing.

Coach

 

[ScaredtoQuit]

I don't know how much this would count if the chips are down, but I didn't actually say I was definitely leaving. What I said was that there was a very high probability that I would leave. I believe that if I suddenly decided to work another year it would not be a problem. Such is the nature of my relationship with my boss AND the tight market for suitable replacements.

 

[HelpMeRhonda]

I agree, sounds like you did the right thing.

What field are you in ?

 

[tomz]

My situation is similar. I'm retiring at the end of 2007 and have known my boss for 10 years. In my position, we often talk about things a year or 2 out. As such, it was difficult for me to be in meetings and participate in discussions of plans for 2008, 2009, etc. Consequently, I gave my boss a heads up about 6 months ago. I think he thinks that I won't do it and he acts like I'll still be around. I have to give the formal notice to HR 2 months before I actually go.

I think you did the right thing.

 

[MasterBlaster]

What I have noticed is that people use the announcement of ER long in advance as a method to get a promotion.

So just maybe you be induced to stick around.

 

[youbet]

What I said was that there was a very high probability that I would leave. I believe that if I suddenly decided to work another year it would not be a problem.

I thought she was your friend........ By telling her in this manner, you gave her no help whatsoever. She can't hire your replacement. She can't start training another current employee. She can't start phasing you out. About all she can do is forget you said anything for now and in a few months call you in and ask if you are really going to retire and what the date is.

Until you give her a firm date, you've done nothing for her. And this is too early to give a firm date. I agree with Brat, the most professional and considerate thing to do is to give about 90 days notice, less if you have reason not to trust your management.

 

[SteveR]

...Until you give her a firm date, you've done nothing for her. And this is too early to give a firm date. I agree with Brat, the most professional and considerate thing to do is to give about 90 days notice, less if you have reason not to trust your management.

I agree.

I am about ready to tell my management that I am going to retire in April. The problem is that they may not have a replacement for my boss (one of the three jobs I am currently doing) by then and I would be leaving a massive hole in the organization if I left before that. The problem is that I don't see much activitiy in replacing my boss. I now have a new boss's boss to contend with. I have requested a phone conference with him to give him the news so he can get off his butt and get somebody in here. I will offer to stay one more month or so but they have to show some effort. I did this same thing (three jobs at the same time) here three years ago and it took them 8 months to fill the jobs. I already told them I will not do that again. No one knows I am serious about leaving. It will come as quite a shock for some. I would like to wait until the cabin sale is final (end of March) before I give them my date in case the sale falls through and I have to carry the mortgage another month or two. Having a nice paycheck would ease that pain so I believe it is in MY best interest to wait on the final decision but to let them know I will be leaving soon.

 

[Nords]

I think anyone who announces their departure earlier than required is giving away whatever little they had in the way of flexibility.

Turn it around-- is your company required to give you a year's notice that you could be laid off?

How long does it take your company to hire a replacement for any of the people who you've seen leave over the last year? How fast has your "friend" been hiring them? That's probably at least how long it'll take to hire your replacement.

Look at MJ-- he was ready to go and just about to give his boss the company's required notice when bam-- they laid him off with a big goodbye gift. He was required to give a lot more notice than he got, too!

I gave the Navy 12 months' notice of my departure. My relief didn't even show up until the 15th month after I gave notice. But somehow a warm body was found to sit in my chair until the new guy knew what to do, and somehow the department muddled on without me. (I worked pretty darn hard setting up that autopilot before I left, too, and I wasn't giving up any of my terminal leave to keep an eye on people!) Those of you who're worried about imploding your departments by departing without extra warning may have overestimated your importance to the ability of the organization to exist without you.

I can think of one benefit of announcing your departure before its time. It's the same benefit of announcing that you're going to lose 25 pounds or start working out 3x/week-- the public commitment forces you to stick to your statement.

 

[Goonie]

According to our contract, I'm required to give 120 days notice, which I've done. However, when I first heard they were going to offer the ER Incentive, I told my boss that I would be taking it....That was in February of last year!

I wanted to give them every opportunity to get someone hired to replace me, so I'd be there to train them, since my j*b is was very technical (laboratory tech). They brought someone in from another department to replace a former co-w*rker, and he is the one I had to train, because they d*cked around for a year and haven't hired my replacement. The boss said they may have someone to replace me by the end of April or maybe May! I'm GONE the 1st week of April!


IF I wanted to blow off ER and stick around, I could with NO problem. The notices are just formalities, and are not binding. The only thing that will "lock-in" my ER, is when I send in my pension request form 30 days prior to my 'going over the wall'. And I WILL send it in as soon as I get back from Florida in March! Actually everyone there is absolutely convinced that I'm not coming back to w*rk when I get back from FL!!! (I've already cleaned out my desk and lockers, and the few items I have left there, would take all of 2 minutes to retrieve when I get back!) 8)

 

[bssc]

In my annual review, when they ask you where you want to be in five years, I said retired. My boss said, "Me Too."

 

[Craig]

With respect, I feel the same as Brat et al.


As a manager, she has the responsibility to staff her department. Now she is in a tough position. Her friendship with you encourages cooperation with what you want to do. But if a sharp candidate appears (and, they do ... it's just that most staff don't know about it, and managers often don't bite), then her responsibilities will require her to consider hiring that candidate. She is your friend, but we're talking about her job here, and she is not ER.

Frankly, if I were the manager, I would begin casually recruiting right now. Via my business network, I'd put feelers out, and see if I can surface some solid candidates.

A manager's job is to keep the place productive, minimize turnover ... but when turnover is necessary, do it on the company's schedule, not the employee's ... and make transitions as seamless as possible.

If a new hire in made in the next two or three months in your company, and they handle similar tasks, seem to be receiving training in your general area, etc. ... then that will likely be your replacement. Or, if the company is large enough (as ours is), then I send them for training in another region, and slip them into place after 30 to 60 days.


You sound set, so no big deal. Best of luck, and enjoy ER. I'm jealous.

 

[Jeb-NY]

In my annual review, when they ask you where you want to be in five years, I said retired. My boss said, "Me Too."

I did the same thing for about 2 years before I RE. I also told the two bosses above me to treat me nice if they wanted me to stay. I was waiting for a good buyout or 60 whichever came first but I didn't tell them that. The company offered a buy out to all over 55 that gave me a year severance and I signed up. Both bosses said they thought they were treating me nice. I told them they were but the corporation was treating even nicer.

I actually thing they did keep me out of some BS training and other things to keep me happy, so my threats probably did help me tolerate the last few years. Walked out the door at 57.5 and the way the place has changed in the last year I'm not sure I could have made it to 60.

Jeb

 

[SteveR]

I think anyone who announces their departure earlier than required is giving away whatever little they had in the way of flexibility...

How long does it take your company to hire a replacement for any of the people who you've seen leave over the last year? How fast has your "friend" been hiring them? That's probably at least how long it'll take to hire your replacement.

...Those of you who're worried about imploding your departments by departing without extra warning may have overestimated your importance to the ability of the organization to exist without you.

I would beg to differ with you on this one at least in my case.

Last time they replaced my boss it took them 8 months.

It took 7 months for them to find me for my current position.

They don't offer early retirement because there is no retirement unless you are 65.

They don't do buyouts because they can't (don't) fill open positions very fast at all.

They don't use consultants in key jobs...have to be a full time regular employee. (I
already went down that road).

I don't have an inflated opinion of me in the position...I just know how hard it is to attrack people to this company and this location.


In two weeks I will know if the cabin buyer will meet his contractual obligations and if the deal will close or not. If so, I will be giving my boss my notice of intent and will see what they offer for me to stay. If not enough then they will have to move very fast on replacing the three positions I am currently filling.

I am looking forward to that converstation.

 

[dex]

Generally speaking you closed off some of your options. Things could happen in the course of a year that might require or give you the desire to postpone your RE plans. (I broke my collar bone 2 weeks before my RE date - I was to give my written notice the next day. I stayed until after the operation, and healing process.)

For example,
1. You should be getting a full physical - what if you have a disease that will require extensive treatment and follow up care. Now you might want to say in your job for the benefits and possibly advance in the company. But, you will always be looked at as the guy who wants to RE once he can; so why promote him?

2. Bonuses and raises - did you get your final one or it due? If it is due why should they give you the highest possible raise - no need to keep you happy. This could slightly affect your 401K contribution, social security and pension - slightly.

3. Perception in the office by upper management and subordainates (if you have them). Your imput becomes marginalized in the office and your work satisfaction goes down.

Not to be too hard on you but a cardinal law is a cardinal law for a reason.

Finally, I don't think there is anything such as a friend in the work place. We have aquaintances and close aquaintances. (Friends are those who you confide personal information and seek advise from. Something you should not do in the workplace.)

 

[ScaredtoQuit]

How long does it take your company to hire a replacement for any of the people who you've seen leave over the last year? How fast has your "friend" been hiring them?

Six months to a year.

 

[Brat]

Don't make their inability to act your problem. You need to assume that they are grown-ups.

 

[tryan]

... i agree ... I never seen mega-corp hire to fill an anticipated vacancy (unless it was required to bid new business).

They'll wait until the very last moment then run around like chickens with thier heads cut over.

 

[SteveR]

... i agree ... I never seen mega-corp hire to fill an anticipated vacancy (unless it was required to bid new business).

They'll wait until the very last moment then run around like chickens with thier heads cut over.

The reason for this is that you can't get a requisition for to fill an open position until it is in fact open. That means you can't have two people in the same job at the same time so you can't even start looking (officially) until the position is vacated. We accept letters of resignation as proof the position is (to be) vacated and we can then start the process to get a req. generated and approved. This alone takes 1-2 weeks. Recruiting requires the job be posted (except for exec. director and above) for 2 more weeks before the interview process can begin.

If you find a qualifed and interested candidate in a week they will need to give notice if outside of the company or their move negotiated with their current manager if internal.

Best case would be 5-6 weeks from the date of a letter of resignation or retirement. More commonly, it takes 2-5 months and even longer with highly technical positions or in locations that are difficult to attract candidates. It took me over a year to fill one job and it was not for lack of looking. We pulled out all the plugs but there was not much interest in the position and the experience requirements were unique.

 

[Nords]

The reason for this is that you can't get a requisition for to fill an open position until it is in fact open.

Man, and I thought the military's alleged "personnel management" system was screwed up.

Once upon a time I was told that I couldn't get a new drain valve for a military toilet until I turned in an old drain valve. The Supply Officer eventually regretted preaching that policy at me.

Steve, your post has been a real eye-opener. By any chance are you employed at a publicly-traded company whose stock may be available for shorting?

 

[SteveR]

...Steve, your post has been a real eye-opener. By any chance are you employed at a publicly-traded company whose stock may be available for shorting?

Take your pick...they are all about the same. :

 

[chinaco]

When the money (raise pool) is divided, I have seen people targeting ret get short-changed on the raise. The money is used to retain other employees. Money is the biggest retention tool.

Granted your raise may have been only a %, but it could affect you if you have a traditional pension plan since the amount is often calculated using an average of the last x years times a percentage for each year of service. Bottom line is that the last few years of wages have a real finanacial impact. Granted, it is a small amount, but it is real.

And by the way... when it comes to dividing the money up in large departments and Mid-size to large corps, your boss has only partial input... they often cannot override the mob (other mgmt). In other words, despite your immediate bosses intentions, they could be overriden

Also, if you change your mind and dlay the ret, this same situation is liable to haunt you going forward for the same reason. They are likely to believe you have only delayed the ret decision. The same raise situation will occur the next year.

I have seen it happen!

One final note: no one will ever tell you that it occurred.