Survived 10 years of early retirement

[dm]

Wow, beautiful plane...RG even for a relative newcomer to flying. What year is it, and how many hours on the engine? Your first plane, or did you go a little smaller first then move up? Most important, how often do you fly it?

Curious about your shooting and reloading as well. I recently did a home built 5.56, to comply with CA law (none of the "evil" features...). I shoot handguns mostly, but have a few rifles and carbines. And I've done a small bit of work on my other carbines to bring them into compliance with CA's new laws. I typically shoot about twice a month, usually take 4 pistols to the range, blow thru 300-400 rounds. When DSIL comes with, we've come close to firing 1000 rds between us. I usually take two 9mm and a 45 plus either a 380 or a 40. I've also set up a range on my property, and use it for a 22 sometimes, when I feel like shooting but can't get away.

Engine has around 500hrs. It's a Beechcraft Debonair. I actually bought the plane when I was still a student pilot. I fly around 100 hrs a year and try to go up at least every two weeks just to stay in practice.

I only reload for pistol at this time, 9mm and .45. I enjoy shooting the hanguns more. I never shot hanguns much in the past so it's kind of new to me. I did buy one of the evil black rifles last year, no problems in Florida. My Canadian relatives were a little surprised when I walked into a gun shop and walked out with a new handgun in a matter of minutes.

Reloading is as much a hobby as saving money. I like trying different loads to find out what shoots best. If you shoot a lot it also saves some money, especially rounds like the .45. I have the Dillon 550, it doesn't take long to reload a few hundred. If you save your brass it cost about $130 per 1000 to reload 9mm, .45 is a little more for FMJ, a little less for lead.

 

[davismills]

At age 62, I was reluctant to renew my CFII. You have inspired me to crack the books and renew it for another 2 years. Thank you!!! I love flying, but felt I was getting a bit old for it.

 

[dm]

Been meaning to ask this for a while now.

Any rough indications on what an airplane would cost under the following assumptions:

• No hangar costs
• Room for one passenger and two dogs, as small as possible otherwise
• Maintenance done by third parties
• Cruising speed at least 100 miles

Probably best to split it into: 1) fixed annual cost, including a minimal number of miles to stay flyworthy and 2) additional cost per mile.


I fully realize it can be all over the place, just want to get a feel for it. Numbers on the internet I can find are either outdated or confusing ..


Background: working on a relocation scenario where I would live somewhat rural, and have a small airplane to explore.

Fixed cost would be insurance and annual inspection. Cost would depend on plane and value.

I like to fly at least an hour or so every two weeks, but I enjoy it so that's not a problem. It's not good for the plane to sit, and it keeps me in practice.

I can cruise at 170mph @ 12gph, or 120 @ 7. I can go faster, but it cost more, I generally cruise at 10-11gph on short trips as it doesn't make much difference in time.

I've paid $500 for a annual where I helped, and $2,000 for tossing them the keys at the local Cirrus service center. This year I'm paying $1200, I'll change my own oil and do a few minor things myself. It does cost more for mine since I have retractable gear.

The biggest cost is unknown, maintenance and repairs/upgrades. An engine for mine runs $40,000, a new GPS radio can cost $20,000. I paid $700 for a throttle cable last year, $1,200 for a starter adapter rebuild.

I rented a 172 for $100ph and a 152 for $80. I don't think you could fly your own for less if you fly 100hrs or less per year. But it's nice to be able to get in your own plane and know it's been taken care of, no appointments, and can go on a trip and park it at a different location for weeks.

 

[dm]

At age 62, I was reluctant to renew my CFII. You have inspired me to crack the books and renew it for another 2 years. Thank you!!! I love flying, but felt I was getting a bit old for it.

My initial instructor was in his late 70's when I started. He's still teaching, said as long as he can pass the medical he will continue.

He owns 5 planes the last time I saw him. even after giving lessons he would pull his old champ out and go fly by himself. The champ was the only plane he wouldn't rent unless he also in the plane.

 

[cwatson69]

Retired, when I turned 55, eight years ago and loving every minute of it!!!

 

[Walt34]

Been meaning to ask this for a while now.

Any rough indications on what an airplane would cost under the following assumptions:

• No hangar costs
• Room for one passenger and two dogs, as small as possible otherwise
• Maintenance done by third parties
• Cruising speed at least 100 miles

Probably best to split it into: 1) fixed annual cost, including a minimal number of miles to stay flyworthy and 2) additional cost per mile.

I fully realize it can be all over the place, just want to get a feel for it. Numbers on the internet I can find are either outdated or confusing ..

Background: working on a relocation scenario where I would live somewhat rural, and have a small airplane to explore.

A Beechcraft Debonair is a fairly high-end single engine airplane and from what you're describing you'd use it for it is probably much more airplane than you'd need or even want. At the time I was flying (mid 1970's) a ballpark number for hull & liability insurance was 10% of the airplane's value every year.

The annual inspection can be all over the place depending on what they find, and some are better at doing little maintenance things like a drop of oil on all the control line pulley bearings. Yes that adds shop time but it can make a huge difference in how the airplane handles. On one annual inspection it was out of the shop in just over one day, the next one it was in there four days. I always took time off work to help, that does cut the cost some if the shop will let you. Not all will.

How big are the dogs? If they're small perhaps a two-place airplane like a Cessna 150 can be had for ~$15k and up to perhaps $30k or more if it has IFR gear and a newish engine, nice paint and interior. If the dogs are larger you might want a four place airplane, those start ~$20k and up depending on equipment and condition. A four place fixed gear airplane is going to have a fuel burn of between 9 and 12 gallons per hour depending on engine size so that's something to pay attention to. Depending on the area of the country fuel will be ~$5/gallon so you're looking at ~$50/hour just for fuel. A two place airplane can have a fuel burn as low as four gallons an hour but it won't be going 100 mph. Like a house, don't even think of buying without a pre-purchase inspection. An AD (airworthiness directive) that has not been done can cost five figures.

If you're going to keep the airplane a long time you will want to have a large stash of cash for an engine overhaul, that will be $15k-$30k or more depending on the engine on a fixed gear airplane. Retractable gear aircraft usually have larger engines so they cost more.

For prices Trade-A-Plane is a good place to start, that publication has been around since rocks were soft.

 

[Souschef]

Been meaning to ask this for a while now.

Any rough indications on what an airplane would cost under the following assumptions:

• No hangar costs
• Room for one passenger and two dogs, as small as possible otherwise
• Maintenance done by third parties
• Cruising speed at least 100 miles

Probably best to split it into: 1) fixed annual cost, including a minimal number of miles to stay flyworthy and 2) additional cost per mile.
I fully realize it can be all over the place, just want to get a feel for it. Numbers on the internet I can find are either outdated or confusing ..

Background: working on a relocation scenario where I would live somewhat rural, and have a small airplane to explore.

Depending on how rural you are, you might want to consider renting. The rule of thumb is 100 hours is about break even between owning and renting.
I was very busy flying for Angel Flight last year, but only flew a little over 60 hours.
I live near a small uncontrolled and rent a Cessna 172 wet for $127/hr.
I have flown large dogs in it, and it cruises at about 100 knots.

 

[imoldernu]

28 years of very happy retirement since 1989 when DW and I were 53.

Never had a real airplane, but over the years, several campers, lots of small boats, scooters, my '78 Motobecane Super Mirage, a pair of roller skates that have never been worn, several kites and one U-Control biplane with a 1955 OK Cub .29 twinstack.

Life in the slow lane... Surviving well, and looking ahead to four score and ten.






.

 

[sweetana3]

We could say almost the same thing. Retired at 56/57 over 10 years ago. Now we have several volunteer "jobs", hobbies and travel to occupy our time. When we retired, we had met our stated financial goals and now have doubled the size of the portfolio.

Hope the next 10 years holds steady in health, activity and wealth.

 

[kimcdougc]

Retired (2) years now. DH is now 59 and I am 57. Traveling in our RV is fun. Now trying to plan DH 60th birthday. Think he wants to do a 15 day Hawaiian cruise. Fun fun. Life is good.

 

[Mulligan]

Nice! I got my private license at age 25 and bought a Piper Tri-Pacer and had a ball with it for a bit over two years. An airplane is great for day trips but since neither I nor the airplane was qualified for instrument conditions that limited it's use for much beyond that. It is also great that you are doing this while you can - I'm now 67 and given that I've had some cardiac issues in the past couple of years I'm doubtful a flight physician would issue a medical certificate.

My golfing partner who is 87 always notices planes in the air that fly by on golf course. He gave up his little plane first then his license 20-30 years ago. Last week when he was looking and identifying the type of plane, I asked him if he could fly it and land it now. He quickly answered "Ya damn right I could fly it and land it".

 

[Souschef]

Retired (2) years now. DH is now 59 and I am 57. Traveling in our RV is fun. Now trying to plan DH 60th birthday. Think he wants to do a 15 day Hawaiian cruise. Fun fun. Life is good.

Sorry to rain on your parade, but that 15 day cruise is 10 days at sea and 5 days in Hawaii.
Unless you are enamored of sea days, I would rather fly to the islands as we have done and spend the time there.
I have attached 2 trip stories, one of our first visit to Kauai, and another of our stay in Honolulu and Maui.

 

[Souschef]

My golfing partner who is 87 always notices planes in the air that fly by on golf course. He gave up his little plane first then his license 20-30 years ago. Last week when he was looking and identifying the type of plane, I asked him if he could fly it and land it now. He quickly answered "Ya damn right I could fly it and land it".

I just turned 79, and will be flying a Belgian Malinois from Ramona CA to Santa Barbara on Friday through Pilots & Paws.
There are other ways that do not require a medical certificate, like the Light Sport aircraft. All you need ids a driver's license.

 

[street]

You retired very early an did just fine. One interesting things is that you are worth more today then 10 years ago. You have done well!

 

[YVRRocketSurgery]

Really enjoy these post-retirement follow up stories. They provide me with a lot of optimism and anticipation.

However, one thing I'll debate is the one more year part. The missus and I have a large enough nest egg, before government benefits, to support our current spending/lifestyle which I can't complain about. However, I'm 45 and the missus hasn't even hit 40 yet. I'm hoping to work another 5 years and retire around 50 with the missus a few years after that. Expecting the extra few years will reinforce our nest egg to satisfy our risk concerns and allow us to spend on some stretch target retirement goals/plans/luxuries while still being young enough to have many years of enjoyment out of them. Anyways, hoping the extra 5 years of wage slaving will be worth it. Fine balance between ER years and enough money for your goals?

 

[Totoro]

Thanks for the airplane replies (and apologies for the part hijacking). Dogs would be medium-sized (Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever type).

Renting probably would be step 1, as I would likely start out near a local airport (e.g. Dunedin NZ - Otago airclub).

Silly question regarding rentals: how does it typically work if you want to go on a multi-day trip in terms of finances? e.g. fly out day 1 two hours, stay two nights, fly back. Is that even possible since the aircraft is not available for others during that time?

 

[Scuba]

Really enjoy these post-retirement follow up stories. They provide me with a lot of optimism and anticipation.



However, one thing I'll debate is the one more year part. The missus and I have a large enough nest egg, before government benefits, to support our current spending/lifestyle which I can't complain about. However, I'm 45 and the missus hasn't even hit 40 yet. I'm hoping to work another 5 years and retire around 50 with the missus a few years after that. Expecting the extra few years will reinforce our nest egg to satisfy our risk concerns and allow us to spend on some stretch target retirement goals/plans/luxuries while still being young enough to have many years of enjoyment out of them. Anyways, hoping the extra 5 years of wage slaving will be worth it. Fine balance between ER years and enough money for your goals?

I agree with you. That's similar to what we did except we were older. Originally planned to ER at 50. However 50 was 2009 for DH & 2010 for me. After taking big hits not only on financial portfolio but also some real estate investments, we decided to work longer and build up more assets. Felt we were FI a couple of years before we pulled the trigger. I had a large financial incentive to stay in place at my company for most of 2017 so we agreed to keep w*rking till I got my windfall. RE'd last Nov. at 56 & 57. Sounds like you'll be able to do it several years earlier- well done!

One thing that helped me become emotionally ready was to start thinking and making a list of activities we were looking forward to trying or doing after ER. That helped me get super excited about leaving and it also felt a lot more positive- leaving to move towards something desirable vs leaving to escape something unpleasant.

 

[Walt34]

My golfing partner who is 87 always notices planes in the air that fly by on golf course. He gave up his little plane first then his license 20-30 years ago. Last week when he was looking and identifying the type of plane, I asked him if he could fly it and land it now. He quickly answered "Ya damn right I could fly it and land it".

I have little doubt that he could. It is sort of like riding a bicycle, you may get a little "rusty" but you never forget. After I retired got some time with an instructor in a Cessna 182 - I forget the exact reason, but the instructor was also an A&P mechanic and often worked on the airplane. The owner told him to use it anytime he liked. Anyway, after about two hours flying time he said I was flying it better than the owner. I hadn't touched the controls on a full-size airplane for at least 28 years!

 

[sengsational]

I've only been retired for 3.3 years. Played zero games of golf, but did a bunch of traveling, about 25% of the time, both in the US and abroad. Usually 3 or so weeks at a time...something I could never do with the stingy vacation allowances from the megacorp. As to aviation, got trained on foot launched paramotor (just rented equipment). Also knocked the rust off my surfing skills. Rented an RV for 3 weeks. But really, I'm still trying to figure out how I really want to spend my time.

 

[brucethebroker]

Just reflecting a bit, I can't recommend ER enough, you never know how many summers you have left. And I look at friends who's health starts to deteriorate and aren't able to do some of the things they would like. Lots of years wasted saving for one more year.

Nearly 4 years in......so far, so good.

I find I have more "summers left" when we snowbird down south!

 

[Koolau]

Thanks for the airplane replies (and apologies for the part hijacking). Dogs would be medium-sized (Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever type).

Renting probably would be step 1, as I would likely start out near a local airport (e.g. Dunedin NZ - Otago airclub).

Silly question regarding rentals: how does it typically work if you want to go on a multi-day trip in terms of finances? e.g. fly out day 1 two hours, stay two nights, fly back. Is that even possible since the aircraft is not available for others during that time?

IIRC rentals for travel with stays can be negotiated on a so-many-hours minimum per day. I'm sure it depends upon the folks who are renting you the aircraft.

Probably the most economical approach to "owning" an aircraft is to form a "club" of at least 3 people. If each person flies 100 hours/year, the fixed costs don't drastically increase the per hour cost. At that rate of utilization, it's unlikely there will be significant conflicts for using the AC. Naturally, there are caveats relating to the folks you include. Naturally, there are legal issues which should be dealt with (protection from joint liability, etc. etc.)

Realistically, the average costs for small aircraft travel is in the $100 to $250/ hour range, depending on equipment. This assumes used aircraft in "good" condition at time of purchase. Quick math suggests about $1/mile to $2/mile. Cars are in the range of $.60 +/- $.20 per mile.

It's really not the most practical hobby, but I think you could make a case that it's more practical than, let's say golf or shooting which are lots of fun but don't have a big payoff unless you are really good enough to win something. At least with flying, you can actually get some place. Considering that many aircraft can carry 3 or 4, you could begin to make a case for it being "cheaper" than commercial flight, though that's very dicy and as with everything "it all depends..."

Considering personal safety, cost, other limitations (weather is probably the biggest), etc., you fly because you enjoy it, not because its always the best way to get someplace. Naturally, YMMV.