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Old 07-27-2017, 10:06 AM   #21
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An electric car has a lot of hidden expenses. Just to charge the battery is a bit expensive, unless you can use a charging station away from home.

It may cost ~$5 to charge the battery at home, for only 100 or less miles.

Be sure to figure total cost, not just the "no gas" price.
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Old 07-27-2017, 10:44 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Senator View Post
An electric car has a lot of hidden expenses. Just to charge the battery is a bit expensive, unless you can use a charging station away from home.

It may cost ~$5 to charge the battery at home, for only 100 or less miles.

Be sure to figure total cost, not just the "no gas" price.


Can I ask where you get your data? $5 for an at home charge? I've driven a Nissan Leaf for 5 years. I have a home charger. If I need to charge the battery from "empty" it MIGHT cost 50 cents. I have time of use rates from my utility and charge overnight for cheap. Even if I have to charge at peak rates it would never approach $5.

As for other "hidden expenses" other than electricity...those would be tire rotation, windshield wipers, an occasional car wash and the annual battery check required to maintain the warranty ($50/year after yr 3). I'm not sure other 100% electric cars would be significantly different.

Edit: Upon further thought, 50 cents per full charge is understated, $1-2 is probably more reasonable, however compared to a gallon of gas, this is still a bargain. But putting the cost of fuel differences aside, I am still curious what the other hidden expenses are that Senator mentions in his post. My maintenance costs are really next to nothing.
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Old 07-27-2017, 10:48 AM   #23
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An electric car has a lot of hidden expenses. Just to charge the battery is a bit expensive, unless you can use a charging station away from home.

It may cost ~$5 to charge the battery at home, for only 100 or less miles.

Be sure to figure total cost, not just the "no gas" price.
An acquaintance bought a used Nissan Leaf and uses it 5 days a week to go to work with a round trip of 55 miles and on the weekends to run errands. His electric bill went from about $100/mo to $160/mo after the Leaf purchase. I'm not sure how this compares to what it will cost to charge the Tesla or what the Leaf owner's rate is for electricity.
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Old 07-27-2017, 11:59 AM   #24
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An acquaintance bought a used Nissan Leaf and uses it 5 days a week to go to work with a round trip of 55 miles and on the weekends to run errands. His electric bill went from about $100/mo to $160/mo after the Leaf purchase. I'm not sure how this compares to what it will cost to charge the Tesla or what the Leaf owner's rate is for electricity.

$60/mo is still markedly cheaper than fuel, at least here in CA. That'd be a reduction of 75% fuel cost for me, probably more for a person with a 55mi round trip. Granted, it's a leaf vs a sedan with 25 mpg, but...

Teslas also manage charging power usage very efficiently. An older used Leaf would have an older battery, require more frequent and more lengthy (relatively speaking) charging than a new Model S, FWIW.

All that said, I agree that assuming fuel cost to be "essentially free" is an exercise in kidding yourself.
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Old 07-27-2017, 12:53 PM   #25
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I take it the newer ones are faster, but still 30 minutes?
I've been saying for years that the chargers need to be next door to restaurants. Plug the car in, go get dinner. If the chargers are at major rest stops this shouldn't be difficult.
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Old 07-27-2017, 01:10 PM   #26
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I think you will be quite happy with a Tesla Model 3 if you don't mind the wait. It may be a bit smaller, a little slower, and slightly less range, but otherwise it's got all of the sizzle that one expects to get when driving a Tesla.

I can't justify the $100K cost of a Model S, but I'm more than happy to spend half that on the Model 3.
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Old 07-27-2017, 01:48 PM   #27
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$60/mo is still markedly cheaper than fuel, at least here in CA. That'd be a reduction of 75% fuel cost for me, probably more for a person with a 55mi round trip. Granted, it's a leaf vs a sedan with 25 mpg, but...

Teslas also manage charging power usage very efficiently. An older used Leaf would have an older battery, require more frequent and more lengthy (relatively speaking) charging than a new Model S, FWIW.

All that said, I agree that assuming fuel cost to be "essentially free" is an exercise in kidding yourself.
Exactly. And at some point, the electric car will need a new battery. That is expensive.
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Old 07-27-2017, 02:18 PM   #28
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I wouldn't buy one simply because there are better vehicles that cost a lot less.

The other reason is that it's estimated that Musk and his companies have been the recipient of close to $5 billion in corporate welfare:

Elon Musk's growing empire is fueled by $4.9 billion in government subsidies - LA Times
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Old 07-27-2017, 02:43 PM   #29
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I think you will be quite happy with a Tesla Model 3 if you don't mind the wait. It may be a bit smaller, a little slower, and slightly less range, but otherwise it's got all of the sizzle that one expects to get when driving a Tesla.



I can't justify the $100K cost of a Model S, but I'm more than happy to spend half that on the Model 3.


Nobody really knows what a Model 3 will look like or what it will be able to do. We have promises. That's it. Can't see putting money towards that yet. If it comes out like the X, ick.
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Old 07-27-2017, 09:04 PM   #30
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Hard to save enough gas to justify the 100k but the car is unbelieveable. I bought one and love every minute of it.

For me it was a small portion of my assets but I do plan on keeping it a long time

I don't know of any tesla owners that regret their purchase.
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Thinking of buying a Tesla Model S. Someone talk me out of it!
Old 07-27-2017, 10:23 PM   #31
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Thinking of buying a Tesla Model S. Someone talk me out of it!

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Hard to save enough gas to justify the 100k but the car is unbelieveable. I bought one and love every minute of it.

For me it was a small portion of my assets but I do plan on keeping it a long time

I don't know of any tesla owners that regret their purchase.

Wouldn't expect any Tesla owner to say that they do. It's tough to admit we made a mistake, especially one that could be perceived as frivolous by outsiders.

Me? I love Teslas and would have one in a minute if money were no object. May anyway. But I fear buyers remorse... we will see of that changes in two years when I'm in the market.
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Old 07-27-2017, 11:18 PM   #32
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100k for a damn car? You would have to be nuts.
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Old 07-28-2017, 03:31 AM   #33
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All Teslas have ultimately been vanity purchases by affluent buyers, with significant tax incentives to boot (the Model 3 may be closer to an everyperson vehicle). It would take forever to break even on gasoline and they're by no means zero emissions as some seem to believe. There's no emissions reductions in regions with coal power plants, but there are reductions (not zero) where natural gas fuels power plants. Hydro and alternative power do approach zero emissions, small but growing sources?
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Old 07-28-2017, 06:00 PM   #34
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I think most people buy Tesla's not to save gas or even save the planet. I think they buy it because it's an amazing car

I wouldn't buy one if I didn't have sufficient means. It's s luxury item.

I have bought many things I regretted, but not the tesla. In fact I ordered a second one.
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Old 07-28-2017, 07:27 PM   #35
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I think the technology is so cool that it just could be worth the price when you consider that you not only get a nice car but also the coolest toy on the block. Still I don't think I could justify it for myself. I'm not too worried about range on Oahu, but I don't have access to my own charging station (parking structure has no provision for charging.) I'm sure I could find a charger, but that could get old quickly.

The other thing I found out recently (on this forum) is that you don't own the software and programs (according to Is99). They also monitor your use of the car, so they may well be able to say "Sorry, Charlie, your warranty is invalid because you did X, Y, or Z."

So, if I haven't talked OP out of buying an S model, then by all means, OP, enjoy the heck out of it. YMMV
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Old 07-28-2017, 07:42 PM   #36
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I read today that Tesla has 143,000 federal tax credits remaining @$7500 each. If they have 400,000 deposits on Model 3, then a lot of buyers won't get the federal tax credit. Plus the buyers of the S and x are taking from that pot.
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Old 07-28-2017, 08:38 PM   #37
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Tesla doesn't have anything that Ford, Chevy of Dodge doesn't have, other than subsidies. Or any of the foreign companies, like Honda and Toyota.

I suspect that there will be large competition for electric vehicles, and the prices will drop. They have to. Tesla doesn't have anything special.
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Old 07-28-2017, 08:46 PM   #38
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I think the technology is so cool that it just could be worth the price when you consider that you not only get a nice car but also the coolest toy on the block.
Who thinks they're cool toys besides those that buy them? I see them & say, OK, so what. I can only go 250 miles or so in it without a hassle. Now when Toyota's new solid state batteries double travel distance, then you got something. To each their own. No envy/care here.
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Old 07-29-2017, 09:30 AM   #39
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Who thinks they're cool toys besides those that buy them? I see them & say, OK, so what. I can only go 250 miles or so in it without a hassle. Now when Toyota's new solid state batteries double travel distance, then you got something. To each their own. No envy/care here.
For reasons mentioned and because they don't fit my financial profile, I'll probably never buy one. BUT I think they are cool. Just because they aren't perfect (and don't work for me) doesn't mean they don't have some very cool technology and capability. If you haven't done so, look up the "launch" in ludicrous mode on YouTube. If you don't think that's cool, then I guess you and I will just agree to disagree.
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Old 07-29-2017, 09:50 AM   #40
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They are indeed crazy scary and mind blowing fast. Repairs are expensive , the brakes cost over 10k to repair because they seldom get used due to regenerative braking which recaptures the momentum to charge battery. The problem is the brakes don't get used therefore go bad and no one can work on them.
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