Yahoo Finance - Dead is the new RE!

[Midpack]

So, I think boss shopping isn't necessarily helpful. Outlasting a negative boss situation is a very satisfying experience, though.

I won't bother with the details, but my 32 year career has seen very good and very bad bosses. Though the bad ones were tough to take during their tenure and I polished up my resume, I never really took steps to leave keeping my focus on my long term, knowing they wouldn't be around forever. My approach has paid off handsomely, and some of the bad ones are no longer employed. It takes longer than I'd like, but more often than not in my experience someone catches up with the bad ones eventually. Sometimes you have to leave a bad situation, but it's not always the best direction. Sometimes waiting them out is best for numero uno, as gruesome as it can be in the shorter term. And ironically I learned useful things from everyone of them, even if it was 'what NOT to do' from some of them.

 

[Notmuchlonger]

Doing nothing is an art form. Bunch of no good #$#@@! I'm an artist!

 

[Khan]

Doing nothing is an art form. Bunch of no good #$#@@! I'm an artist!

After 4.5 years, I believe I have mastered the art.

This morning I sipped tea and felt the cool breeze, and watched the birds and squirrels on the lawn for ~20 minutes. I didn't do anything, I didn't think about anything; I just was.

 

[BunsGettingFirm]

When I tell people I no longer work, the next question they usually ask is "what do you do all day?"
Well, I look at them with an exhausted smile and answer, "I'm soooo busy doing nothing all day, I just don't have time to do anything else"

Hey, you're back, so did you end up in the Southwest? If so, how's the cycling? Are you finding that you do more cycling now than you did before retirement? Are you burning out on all the cycling, or is that still holding your interest?

 

[Dawg52]

I'll take my crappy golf, peanut butter sandwiches, and gall bladder talk any day over work. What's not to like?

 

[BunsGettingFirm]

I have heard of people who quite their jobs and was dissatisfied with all of these activities: cycling, reading, watching TV, chilling out at the beer garden, going shopping, or going for a walk. At the time I was 27 or 28, and I was shocked. What could be more fun than having all the time world to train, race, and recover like a professional bike rider and still have time left to watch TV and read books?

 

[MJ]

Hey, you're back, so did you end up in the Southwest? If so, how's the cycling? Are you finding that you do more cycling now than you did before retirement? Are you burning out on all the cycling, or is that still holding your interest?

Hi BGF. I am still in Chiang Mai Thailand. I haven't been back to the U.S. since late 2007. For me, the bicycle has always been more like owning a stock horse. It still is my main mode of local transportation. It keeps me fit and I enjoy wonderful rides around the surrounding country so unless I am physical unable to ride, it will remain an intregal part of my lifestyle. I love the idea that I am not poluting the air and not spending money on gas. That's why I love Chiang Mai. It is so easy for me to cycle here. Of course, I am used to dealing with city traffic. Cycling in CM is a piece of cake compared to NYC, Bangkok or worse, Saigon, cities I have spend time cycling about.
I've been having some minor knee issues (no pain yet) that have curtailed my serious bi-weekly mountain climbing rides as well as any serious cycling trips for now. I am going to take it easy for another 6 months and see if the knee improves. It did 6 years ago.

 

[LoftyNotions]

I think someone needs to take this guy's crack pipe away. All these years I've dreamed of playing crappy golf and was even willing to settle for a municipal course. Now he's trying to ruin it for me. If only I could find a way to raise enough money to join the country club.

Oh, wait, I know... I can sell my gall bladder.

 

[Nords]

Obviously the author never read Nord's the fog of work.

I think Marshall Goldsmith is a good writer, but he essentially lives out of airplanes and frequent-flyer lounges in between doing standup for thousands of people and getting to tell execs how to fix their screwed-up behavior. Why would anyone want to retire from that?

He won't retire until [-]he's dead[/-] the flight attendants notice that he didn't return his seat to the full upright position.

And in his defense, I don't have to write on deadline...

 

[Independent]

retire-and-be-happy: Personal Finance News from Yahoo! Finance

Dead is the new retirement. OK, that doesn't sound appealing, but working till you drop is a heck of a lot better than playing crappy golf at the country club, eating chicken salad sandwiches for lunch, and complaining about your gall bladder.
At least, it is if you can find a job in retirement that brings meaning and happiness. So says Marshall Goldsmith, whose blog entry "Brett Favre and the Difficult Art of Retiring Successfully" appeared last August on the Harvard Business Review's Web site...

A shot across FIRE's bow.

I think the article says something to Marshall Goldsmith's (who is "a consultant to executives") clients. I don't know if it says anything to most of us.

Generally, people who love their jobs should continue working. Lots of executives love their jobs (or, at least could love a job along the same lines as what they do). They have power, prestige, and perks. Why end a deal like that just because you can afford to?

If they want to continue working, but at a slightly different job, they might take advice from a consultant who provides a 7-point, action-orientd, to-do list. Sounds like a good executive approach to me.

 

[audreyh1]

Let's dissect this. If someone doesn't like chicken salad sandwiches, they shouldn't eat them for lunch whether they are retired or working. If I want to complain about my gall bladder (which was removed 15 years ago), I would do so at work if I am at work.

That would reduce the argument to "working till you drop is a heck of a lot better than playing crappy golf at the country club".

I would suggest that we all should have the opportunity to pursue our dreams sometime before we die, and retirement is a good time to pursue them. Who is to say that golf is an unworthy dream?

Work involves doing what you must do to earn a living, whether you happen to feel like it or not. If someone prefers work to pursuing their dreams, then maybe they need to do some more introspection and self questioning about what their priorities really are.

If someone's work and their dreams coincide, more power to them. But I think that is not generally the case and when it isn't, retirement is not only justified - - it is something that we owe to ourselves.

Fabulous post Want2Retire!! You've got it down, and you're not even retired yet!

It always seems to me that folks who think retirement is nothing more than a life sentence of dull, meaningless and unfulfilling activity are really exhibiting a shocking lack of imagination.

Audrey

 

[dixonge]

That would reduce the argument to "working till you drop is a heck of a lot better than playing crappy golf at the country club".

I'm thinking even fans of golf would have a hard time disagreeing with this one...

 

[Midpack]

If someone's work and their dreams coincide, more power to them. But I think that is not generally the case and when it isn't, retirement is not only justified - - it is something that we owe to ourselves.

Fabulous post Want2Retire!! You've got it down, and you're not even retired yet!

It always seems to me that folks who think retirement is nothing more than a life sentence of dull, meaningless and unfulfilling activity are really exhibiting a shocking lack of imagination.

Audrey

...never mind, we (Audrey & I) already had this (heated) discussion. We're not 180° apart, but we're not on the same plane...

 

[W2R]

...never mind, we (Audrey & I) already had this (heated) discussion. We're not 180° apart, but we're not on the same plane...

Sorry if I stirred something (heated) up! It was not my intention at all. My intent was just to express some "Rah! Rah! Retirement!" sentiment.

 

[ziggy29]

Sorry if I stirred something (heated) up! It was not my intention at all. My intent was just to express some "Rah! Rah! Retirement!" sentiment.

In any event, I hope we can all agree that whether or not we believe "early retirement" is the Holy Grail, achieving financial independence to the degree that allows one to retire is a very good thing whether we want to retire or not...

 

[Kroeran]

I have encountered a number of cases where achieving the power to walk out gave the person more power to control thier work environment.

One thing I learned a long time ago, rewards come from relative power, not merit, and that negotiating power comes from having more alternatives than the other side of the table.

This can be misplayed however. If you let it get out that you can walk away any time, astute managers will avoid you, knowing that you won't say how high, when asked to jump.

Has there been previous discussion of the Die Broke approach here? This includes the philosophy that one should find job you actually like, even if it pays less, and you do it until they take you out feet first.

 

[REWahoo]

Has there been previous discussion of the Die Broke approach here? This includes the philosophy that one should find job you actually like, even if it pays less, and you do it until they take you out feet first.

I'm pretty sure if you use the search button to look through the 569,000 posts on the forum that you'll find the subject has been thoroughly vetted a number of times. Of course much of the discussion could be sour grapes from those of us who weren't fortunate enough to find such a job.

 

[ziggy29]

This can be misplayed however. If you let it get out that you can walk away any time, astute managers will avoid you, knowing that you won't say how high, when asked to jump.

Which could hurt you in trying to find a new j*b. If hiring managers don't think you'll have a sense of urgency about the j*b -- that you won't care because you don't have to (like the phone company!), that you won't be motivated by fear, that sort of thing -- they may be more likely to pass on you in favor of someone they can exert more control and leverage over.

Of course, if you become FI on the job and you demonstrate your value, it's also more likely that you can parlay that into a more enjoyable work experience, as my father did once he turned 55 and became pension-eligible. It's at the point when you are FI and when your bosses don't want you to retire that brings the unusual point in time, the worker, not the employer, has the stronger hand.

I'm pretty sure if you use the search button to look through the 569,000 posts on the forum that you'll find the subject has been thoroughly vetted a number of times. Of course much of the discussion could be sour grapes from those of us who weren't fortunate enough to find such a job.

True that. I am a bit envious of people who truly love their j*b to the point where they don't see a need to retire from it. And increasingly, I've been more thinking "second career" than pure FIRE recently. I think I'd rather do the rat race thing until age 50 and then find something lower-paying I'd enjoy more until 60 than stay with the rat race until 55. How it actually plays out partially depends on how my wife's new gig eventually plays out.

 

[Midpack]

True that. I am a bit envious of people who truly love their j*b to the point where they don't see a need to retire from it. And increasingly, I've been more thinking "second career" than pure FIRE recently. I think I'd rather do the rat race thing until age 50 and then find something lower-paying I'd enjoy more until 60 than stay with the rat race until 55. How it actually plays out partially depends on how my wife's new gig eventually plays out.

Me too, although at different ages than you chose. We're already FI, unfortunately health care (I have good coverage now) may cause us to hesitate. I expect my situation will play out; stay with the current work (not bad, just boring after all these years) until I just can't stand it anymore, and then move on to something I'd like to do regardless of the pay. I am one of those people who would rather learn/work at something than relax.

I am actually thinking of staying with MegaCorp, but pursuing a Sales job after 32 years in manufacturing - just for the challenge and change in scenery. If I'm not as successful, at least I'll never wonder what it might have been like.

 

[Rambler]

Which could hurt you in trying to find a new j*b. If hiring managers don't think you'll have a sense of urgency about the j*b -- that you won't care because you don't have to (like the phone company!), that you won't be motivated by fear, that sort of thing -- they may be more likely to pass on you in favor of someone they can exert more control and leverage over.

My now retired CFO used to tell me "its always better to hire a young thirty-something with a non-working spouse, two kids and a mortgage...they work harder and last longer".

R

 

[Kroeran]

I've been more thinking "second career" than pure FIRE recently..

apologies to those who have already tread this well worn path

I wonder if it is about achieving play and dignity.

Once you are at the point of financial independence, life expands to all these choices.

a job you can walk away from, a job where you can tell anyone who is making you uncomfortable to F-off, including "the boss", is not really a "job", but is more a past-time, so it is FIRE "in spirit".

 

[M Paquette]

apologies to those who have already tread this well worn path

I wonder if it is about achieving play and dignity.

Once you are at the point of financial independence, life expands to all these choices.

a job you can walk away from, a job where you can tell anyone who is making you uncomfortable to F-off, including "the boss", is not really a "job", but is more a past-time, so it is FIRE "in spirit".

Ah, that explains what I was doing that last 10 years of 'work.'

My former mini-corp was bought by a MegaCorp, and there were several times following the merger that I was driven to tell persons to... um... do that thing. Things got better once mini-corps management took over MegaCorp (which led to "Who bought whom?" questions everywhere), but yeah, it was more of an interesting hobby than a job, I suppose.

I did leave in early 2008 to full FIREdom, mostly because the tasks I had left weren't particularly interesting. Hobbies aren't supposed to be boring, right?

 

[ziggy29]

I did leave in early 2008 to full FIREdom, mostly because the tasks I had left weren't particularly interesting. Hobbies aren't supposed to be boring, right?

Even when you're FI, I guess if a j*b isn't stressful and unbearable, one could ask their self: If I wasn't doing this boring j*b, would I be doing something more interesting and fulfilling with my time? If not, you might as well keep w*rking and making the bucks (and perhaps the bennies) until you can answer "yes".