Pent up demand from Saving "Too Much" ??

[halv45]

I'm 42, married, 2 kids 7 and 11. No debt at all. House has been paid off for 6 months. I make 65-70k a year, wife makes about 5-10k working parttime. We save 10% + our (old) house payment of $800 since we no longer have that obligation.

I hate debt and I had this thing about paying off the house. At the time my job wasn't going the best (new management) so I figured if I had the house paid for I could kind of tell them ....to put it nicely... buzz off if I needed to.

Now, my job is better. Thing is, I basically bought myself nothing in the past 10 years so I could take the money and get the house paid for. We did stuff almost every weekend, but nothing that cost much. We drove old cars, wore thrift store clothes. All the extra money I had I paid on the house and I sold off my collectibles I've accumulated prior to that (baseball cards, coins, a couple cars I restored etc). Once I remember joking we could leave our doors unlocked because nothing in the house is worth stealing. It was kind of a good feeling. That's all good except...

I kind of "want" stuff again. Nothing too big. Maybe $5000 worth of some of the things I sold to pay for the house. Thing is, I wonder if that's the "right" thing to do? And I wonder if I get those things back, will it feed the "wanting" more and more?

Anyone ever go through this??

 

[Sarah in SC]

We bought some stuff after getting the house paid off, but it was smaller things, like a couple of chairs for the porch. But I guess the lbym kinda gets to be habit, where you know what else the money will buy (ie freedom) so you think...should I spend this or save it for just about every purchase.

Admittedly, we spend freely on the stuff we really want and value, but still try very hard not to waste money on stuff that isn't high value for us. For us this is experiences and not physical "stuff" for the most part.

If some of the stuff you sold to pay off the house is stuff you value really highly, then you will know it and consider those things to be worth the spending.

 

[iam21177]

Are you concerned you won't be able to control your "wants" if they get out of control in your eyes?

 

[halv45]

Are you concerned you won't be able to control your "wants" if they get out of control in your eyes?

Not really. It's more I feel guilty spending the money maybe? Sometimes I have the "I don't NEED this, so I shouldn't have this" thought.

 

[iam21177]

What does your wife say about it? Is it in the budget to buy something nice for yourself (sounds like it is)? I guess you can see how it feels after you've acquired it. Maybe you can even return it if it doesn't feel good to keep it.

I have feelings of not being financially secure sometimes, yet we are approaching a hefty milestone in the next year. I know my feelings stem from other things, not from actually being financially insecure, but I recognize that. Not quite sure what to do about it yet! Maybe you're in this boat? Guilt stemming from something else?

 

[halv45]

What does your wife say about it? Is it in the budget to buy something nice for yourself (sounds like it is)? I guess you can see how it feels after you've acquired it. Maybe you can even return it if it doesn't feel good to keep it.

I have feelings of not being financially secure sometimes, yet we are approaching a hefty milestone in the next year. I know my feelings stem from other things, not from actually being financially insecure, but I recognize that. Not quite sure what to do about it yet! Maybe you're in this boat? Guilt stemming from something else?

I have purchased things when we were just about done paying off the hosue and I resold them. I remember thinking 'why am I doing this? I'd not like I can't afford it.'

As far as guilt, I rember my first real job at 16 I had to drive 25 miles to work one way. I worked 6 days a week, 8-12 hours a day. My folks gave me an old car to use but the radio didn't work too well. So, towards the end of summer I bought a new radio for $55. It was the only money I spent all summer. Boy they yelled and yelled at me for that. I mean, it was a want, but also a need you know?

Reading this back, I'm wondering if there's a lot more to all this? And maybe I'm just screwed up?

 

[iam21177]

I think you're on to something there (no, not the screwed up part!). Having been torn a new one as a teen for a new $55 radio for your 50 mile a day commute by your parents - that probably scarred you a little bit. Planted that guilty feeling or bad feeling for spending or squelched your desire to do anything for yourself. Just a long shot!

Sometimes with purchases, I just sit on the idea for a few weeks. At first the urge might be strong, like I have to keep looking at it online. Then after a while I lose interest and then before I know it, I'm already living just fine without the purchase. So that is another method - sit on it for a while.

I lived in an uncertain and "walking on eggshells" type of home growing up. I later learned that children in those environments are always waiting for the "other shoe to drop." I know I do. My husband and I have over $700k NW and will be hitting $1M in retirement in the near future. We're 37 and 35. yet, I don't feel secure enough. So I'm going to work on getting a will and living will set up. Maybe that will ease me. I know where it stems, just quite not sure what to do about it.

 

[Cassius King]

You're in a good spot in life. Completely debt free, including the house. I would have no problem rewarding myself or family if I was in that situation. Especially as long as I was saving for retirement.
You don't know what tomorrow brings, if you'll even have a tomorrow, you deserve to enjoy it a bit right now.

 

[Animorph]

Make the budget, figure out what you need to save for retirement, then you can spend the rest.

I'd have a big problem with buying back something like a collectible that I had sold, if I had to pay more. That doesn't save anything. But something that you've been delaying would be appropriate.

 

[Amethyst]

When Mr. A. and I got married, we both had been living very frugally (I've posted elsewhere about his terrible old car, as well as how I "pared the cheese" very close for years, so I could escape apartment living and buy a little house for myself).

We went a little wild the first few years, bringing our wardrobes up to date, going to shows, restaurants, etc. It really was pent-up demand, combined with newlywed nest-building. We bought a little sports car, sold our house, bought a fancier one, and decorated/landscaped it.

Then we decided we'd indulged ourselves enough, and it was time to get back to our frugal ways. I can't really explain it, except that it was like indulging yourself with a fancy meal and rich dessert, and then going back to your usual oatmeal for breakfast. We still like to talk about those free-spending years, and are not sorry we had them.


Amethyst

 

[ERhoosier]

CONGRATS!!! Nothing wrong with treating yourself (& family) after a big accomplishment like paying off the mortgage. Spending a bit to reward achievement is not like an alcoholic falling off the wagon. I've even seen a number of local church congregations which held "mortgage burning" parties to celebrate. It doesn't hurt to loosen up periodically & live a little- within reason of course.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Make the budget, figure out what you need to save for retirement, then you can spend the rest.

I think the key is to begin with the end in mind. Have a retirement plan in place, and a budget that supports it. Then spend freely and without guilt based on your budget.

We have our guilty pleasures built into the budget for each year. That way I don't agonize over each and every optional purchase all the year through.

 

[Walt34]

I kind of "want" stuff again. Nothing too big. Maybe $5000 worth of some of the things I sold to pay for the house. Thing is, I wonder if that's the "right" thing to do? And I wonder if I get those things back, will it feed the "wanting" more and more?

Anyone ever go through this??

Well, one could call Suzie Orman and ask "Can I afford this?". (That's a joke aimed at the forum members in general, not you. She's not highly regarded if you haven't seen those threads.)

Seriously, I can relate. I grew up in a "walking on eggshells" environment with an alcoholic father. We bought our cars at a junkyard and did the needed repairs to get them roadworthy again. A six-pack of Coke and a box of Ritz crackers was a rare treat. So I'm familiar with the "pent-up demand" feeling.

So I'd say as long as other responsibilities are met you're not doing yourself or your family any favors by depriving yourself for some unknown and undefined purpose simply because "that's the way I've always done it".

And it did take me a while to get there. In spite of knowing all that on a rational level, I still felt a twinge of guilt when I dropped $12k on a motorcycle five years ago.

 

[Marita40]

I'm on a super-frugal, fairly painful course to pay off my mortgage in one year (Nov. 2014) which will make me debt free. I've been staying the course but chomping at the bit and already have a list of things I will buy--from the mundane (new undies and socks; a blender) to the altruistic (more charity giving; treating friends to dinner) to the splurge (beach vacation; pilates classes). Anticipation is keeping me going!

 

[Meadbh]

Buying something you have wanted and anticipated for ages is wonderful and I think a life of LBYM needs to have these treats built into it. Otherwise it could get dull and you might feel deprived. The trick is not to get sucked into having those treats too often and to keep the cost within reasonable limits. For example, this summer I spent a few hundred dollars on new gadgets for my kitchen. As a result, I am getting far more enjoyment out of cooking at home (as well as eating better and saving money). OTOH, I am not buying a boat anytime soon!

 

[LakeTravis]

Anyone ever go through this??

All the time.

Whether I'm thinking about and researching a new truck, a boat, maybe a couple of jet-skis or some dirt bikes.

Then a few days go by and I forget all about it.

Until the next time I start daydreaming again.

I think it really is the LBYM habits that become ingrained over time. I'm not sorry for it nor do I regret it because just going thru the motions of researching a purchase can often satisfy the urge to make the purchase itself.

 

[travelover]

...... OTOH, I am not buying a boat anytime soon!

Me neither. I can't decide between horses and an airplane.

 

[butterfly]

I understand how you feel.
We are mortgage free and almost ready to pull the pin to be FIRE.
Once we are there DH and I have decided to have 5k each to "blow" on whatever we want.
We have done without for longer than a decade and will have retired at ages 38 and 41.
We both may not even spend it...that's how we feel now we can afford something; we don't want it anymore and enjoy the freedom of choosing not to buy it over the actual thrill of the purchase.
It's weird, but liberating.

 

[traineeinvestor]

I can both emphasise and sympathise.

I'd suggest running the numbers and (assuming all is well) decide how much you can spend without putting a hole in your FIRE plans. Whatever you come up with, I'd suggest waiting at least 3-4 months - not only do you get the benefits of delayed gratification, but you may rethink the idea all together.

Also, there has been quite a lot written about money spent on experiences rather than things producing a better feel good factor.

Further thought - maybe spend the money on something that has at least some chance of holding its value if you want to resell it at some point in the future (e.g. old coins, stamps, antiques etc - whatever appeals to you).

 

[pb4uski]

....I kind of "want" stuff again. Nothing too big. Maybe $5000 worth of some of the things I sold to pay for the house. Thing is, I wonder if that's the "right" thing to do? And I wonder if I get those things back, will it feed the "wanting" more and more?....

I've never really gone through this but I do have a "wish" list of things that would make life easier/better and I pick things off the list here and there.

If you're doing well I doubt that $5k one way or the other is going to derail your plans. I suggest that you make a list, prioritize things, buy the first thing, sleep in the list for a month and then revisit it and see if the next item on the list is still attractive. You deserve a splurge after how well you have done.

There is a delicate line between depriving oneself saving for a goal and prudently saving for a goal that I have struggled with for a long time.

 

[FIGuy]

I'll offer my perspective. We recently moved across the country and decided that the sum value of our possessions didn't warrant paying for a moving truck so we sold everything that didn't fit in two cars and a 4x8 trailer, probably at least 80% of our stuff by volume not including furniture. I've never been one of those "own less than 100 things" types (ha!), but we love the freedom that comes from only owning what brings real value to our lives and not much else. I guess I'm saying that we look at purchases in terms of "will this bring my life value" more than "can I afford this thing". The afford question is made less relevant by the value question. We love thrift stores and craigslist. We are pretty much planning to sell it all one day and load up a couple big hiking bags to travel.

I do suspect you will feed the "wanting" more and more. Each little consumer purchase rewards our brains with a short term rush. Careful you don't get addicted. I have to watch myself on that as well. My wife and I agreed to each get $220 / month to spend however we wish. Either one of us can raise that so that we don't feel resentment, but neither of us have yet. The rest is for basic cost of living items only. We save about 75% of our net pay that way.

 

[LoneAspen]

Me neither. I can't decide between horses and an airplane.

I'll take the airplane, please

When I quit (hopefully in another 18 months or so), I plan on moving back to Colorado, finding a good flight school, getting my pilot's license, and buying a plane.

I want to do more traveling once retired, but I HATE commercial air travel. HATE it. I'd much rather have the freedom to fly my own plane wherever and whenever I want (weather permitting).

I've often read, don't even bother to try and financially justify owning a private plane. I guess the same is true with boats and horses. When my sister told the family she was buying horses to breed them, we all did a facepalm. My family will do the same with me when they find out a plane is on the agenda

 

[LoneAspen]

I'll offer my perspective. We recently moved across the country and decided that the sum value of our possessions didn't warrant paying for a moving truck so we sold everything that didn't fit in two cars and a 4x8 trailer, probably at least 80% of our stuff by volume not including furniture.

When my real estate business went under in Colorado, and I was forced to move back to Silicon Valley for IT work, I did something similar.

Sold or gave away everything that I couldn't box up and put in the back of my Jeep Grand Cherokee.

I've often told people...it's both liberating and depressing, at the same time, to be able to move with all your belongings in the back of a Jeep. But since everything's worked out for the better in the meantime, I'll err on the side of "liberating".

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Buying something you have wanted and anticipated for ages is wonderful and I think a life of LBYM needs to have these treats built into it. Otherwise it could get dull and you might feel deprived. The trick is not to get sucked into having those treats too often and to keep the cost within reasonable limits. For example, this summer I spent a few hundred dollars on new gadgets for my kitchen. As a result, I am getting far more enjoyment out of cooking at home (as well as eating better and saving money). OTOH, I am not buying a boat anytime soon!

I love kitchen gadgets. Most of my recent kitchen purchases have saved money in the long run. Small appliances like crock pots and rice cookers can be real time and energy savers, especially if they help you eat at home and cook from scratch.

I have a long list of items I have either bought or want to buy that will save more money than they cost - items like thermal drapes, native plants that do not need watering, solar Christmas lights, how to DVDs and courses, used books on simple living, rechargeable batteries and cloth napkins.

Much of our camping and sports equipment have been good deals because we use them over and over again, like our bikes and camping stove. We have also gotten a lot of fun out of things like our backyard grill and fire pit.

Halve45 - Personally, I am glad we sold our collectables. I like paring down to stuff that we enjoy and use frequently. If you really miss your collectables maybe you should replace a small amount with a set dollar value and see how you feel. If you just want to do a little guilt free shopping I would try buying some items that either save money in the long run or are reusable for hours of low cost fun and entertainment.

 

[Jay_Gatsby]

W We still like to talk about those free-spending years, and are not sorry we had them.

Ask yourself if having an extra $10k, $15k or even $25k when you're 80 is worth passing up buying something that will make your life happier, richer and more enjoyable now?

It is a very common question on ER.org whether someone is saving too much. If you have to ask, you probably are. LBYM can be "addictive" in a sense - you're "buying" your freedom. The faster you buy it, the better, right? WRONG Once you have a plan to become FIRE, and that plan contains a specific savings goal and time frame for achieving it, you have to let yourself be free to spend whatever extra you have to enjoy life *now*.

The secret to healthy LBYM is how [-]much[/-] you save.