Andy - Any Progress on the Privacy Notice?

[chinaco]

Wondering how that effort is going.

[brewer12345]

Quote:

Originally Posted by chinaco Wondering how that effort is going.

<jeopardy theme song>

[retire@40]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brewer12345 <jeopardy theme song>

What is "still working on it?"

[chinaco]

Crickets chirp... Silence?

[ERD50]

And is there a 'Terms of Service' or 'User Agreement' published?

It would be nice to have some guidelines to reference for, oh I don't know. posting under multiple names, adding links to commercial web-sites on your fiest posts w/o any other real content, ....?

Here's a sample - it's fairly straightforward, could probably be simplified for this crowd:

Investors Hub - User Agreement - Updated 8/15/05

-ERD50

[Andy R]

I got a copy of a privacy statement from the attorney and it is so generic that I really need to go over it and make it more suitable for forums. I have a Terms of Service (example) that I have to use for all the Social Knowledge sites (I will post that soon). It's generic and then on the other sites we have Community Rules (example) that talk about the rules for each site (like no advertising, posting under multiple accounts, etc)

For the next couple of days I have to focus on getting the info my account needs to get my 2006 taxes filed (since Oct 15 is approaching rapidly). After that I will get the privacy policy reviewed and comments sent back to the attorney. I plan to use the same privacy policy on all my sites so I want to do it once and do it right.

I'll ask one of the mods to start another thread on the community rules and we can discuss the rules we want to have here. That will make enforcing them soooo much easier.

[chinaco]

Fair enough Andy. Thanks

[cute fuzzy bunny]

Andy -

Given that there is a whole forum full of people, many experienced in forum usage and at least a handful with legal experience, perhaps you could post the item you received from the attorney and let everyone have at it for a bit.

It might certainly save you a few bucks in attorney fees, you'd get comments during the construction instead of after.

Besides, it seems to me that the only part that people are immediately interested is the part about how much, if any, of our personal information will be disclosed to 3rd parties or within the Social Knowledge enterprise, who will disclose it, and what controls are on those to whom the information is disclosed to.

"No information collected is retained except for backup purposed, distributed or disclosed to 3rd parties" is good enough for me.

[Martha]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cute fuzzy bunny Andy - Given that there is a whole forum full of people, many experienced in forum usage and at least a handful with legal experience, perhaps you could post the item you received from the attorney and let everyone have at it for a bit. It might certainly save you a few bucks in attorney fees, you'd get comments during the construction instead of after. Besides, it seems to me that the only part that people are immediately interested is the part about how much, if any, of our personal information will be disclosed to 3rd parties or within the Social Knowledge enterprise, who will disclose it, and what controls are on those to whom the information is disclosed to. "No information collected is retained except for backup purposed, distributed or disclosed to 3rd parties" is good enough for me.

He would have to add that even though every effort is made to protect privacy, he might have to release private information in certain circumstances, like in response to a search warrant or subpoena. So he will need the lawyer for that kind of cya.

[Andy R]

CFB, nice to see you around.

Attached is the version that the attorney sent me. I have only read over it twice and need to take some time to properly review it soon. I have not even sent him my feedback, it's not close to finished but I appreciate your comments and feedback. It will indeed help me give him feedback to get this done.

Thanks,

Andy

[Andy R]

I just reread the document and wanted to let you know that we will NOT share any of your info. It's possible in the future there will be an opt-in check box to share with 3rd parties but for now, we don't share anything. If that option is added it will be unchecked by default and you will have to explicitly opt into any 3rd party sharing. Right now I do not have your permission and nothing will be shared.

Also, I need to get him to add in a clause about behavioral targeting which is just a CYA in the event I can ever get around to setting up a system that understands members better and can provide more relevant ads to members. An example would be different ads to members who post 80% in the Young Dreamers forums vs someone who is already ERed. Another example would be on the Airstream Trailer site showing different ads to someone who owns a new Airstream vs someone who owns a 1960s Airstream (they buy different types of products). This will not be info that is shared with anyone but an ad system that can use profile info and behavioral info to try to show more relevant ads to members.

[cute fuzzy bunny]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy R CFB, nice to see you around.

I've been busy digging up a few hundred feet of french drains to since someone drove a truck over them and crushed them flat at some point, plus 4000 square feet of dry rot repair and caulking.

And I sold my old house. Lots of fun. Still made good money on it though.

Maybe I should go back to work and pay someone to do all this stuff.

I just got Halo3 and Bioshock in the mail, so I guess i'll see you again around Thanksgiving.

[Martha]

The draft says in part:

For some services, we also request credit card or other payment account information which we maintain in encrypted form on secure servers.

I assume you don't collect this information as you are not selling anything on this site?

We offer some services in connection with affiliated web sites. Personal information that you provide to those sites may be sent to Social Knowledge in order to deliver the service and is processed in accordance with this Policy. The affiliated sites may have different privacy practices and we encourage you to read their privacy policies.

I am not sure what this means, odds are this does not apply to us. What services?

Social Knowledge collects information about your transactions with us and our business partners, including information about your use of services we offer. When you send email or other communication to Social Knowledge, we may retain those communications in order to process your inquiries, respond to your requests and improve our services.

What business partners?




My comments are coming from the point of view of a user of this site, not your point of view as an owner.

[cute fuzzy bunny]

Andy - what does this part mean:

"In addition, some companies that Yahoo! has acquired have their own, preexisting privacy policies."

What has Yahoo got to do with this?

[Martha]

Andy, you might want to look at some privacy policies that were specifically designed for discussion forums. There are a lot of good ones out there. You can't copy them without violating copyright, but it will give you a good idea of what needs to be covered.

[Elspeth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cute fuzzy bunny Andy - what does this part mean: "In addition, some companies that Yahoo! has acquired have their own, preexisting privacy policies." What has Yahoo got to do with this?

The policy is very heavily based on the Yahoo Privacy Policy, and this is probably a holdover that should have been deleted but wasn't.

[Elspeth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy R Also, I need to get him to add in a clause about behavioral targeting which is just a CYA in the event I can ever get around to setting up a system that understands members better and can provide more relevant ads to members. An example would be different ads to members who post 80% in the Young Dreamers forums vs someone who is already ERed. Another example would be on the Airstream Trailer site showing different ads to someone who owns a new Airstream vs someone who owns a 1960s Airstream (they buy different types of products). This will not be info that is shared with anyone but an ad system that can use profile info and behavioral info to try to show more relevant ads to members.

Isn't this already covered by the following statement in the "Third-Party Advertising" section: "Our Web advertising partners may set cookies to allow the ad server to recognize your computer. Ad servers may compile information about where you saw their advertisements and determine which ads are clicked, which allows an advertisement network to deliver targeted advertisements that they believe will be of most interest to you."

[chinaco]

Andy, why don't you think about creating a separate themed advertising site for that sellers can post their products and services. Keep that off of the main boards.

I also would not be opposed to some links listed in the forum to the other site.

Somehow the request for the privacy statement has bubbled your intentions to the top.

I expect a solid privacy statement that protects us... and spells it out clearly... without a lot of exception that enable you to sc3w us one day.

Most people here have principles that are against being used. Most of us do not want to be your Honey Pot (known tactic) to attract the unsuspecting and lure them to the seller.

That behavioral tracking that you are doing with Google ticks me off. Why? You did not spell out that you were going to do it. You should have that in BOLD LETTERs on the site. It is not so much that you are doing it... but you are doing it in a surreptitious way. And I must tell you I resent the heck out of it. It seems a little sneaky.


Just be clear about your intentions or we will interpret your intentions for you and everyone else.

Personally, I have already picked my alternative forum and joined it. Many of the people here are already there also.

[DRiP Guy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy R CFB, nice to see you around. Attached is the version that the attorney sent me. I have only read over it twice and need to take some time to properly review it soon. I have not even sent him my feedback, it's not close to finished but I appreciate your comments and feedback. It will indeed help me give him feedback to get this done. Thanks, Andy

Pardon my directness, but you are sending off a terrible vibe by saying you have picked up some privacy policy laying around somewhere, and that you haven't had a chance to really look at what some lawyer sent you....


YOU are responsible for your privacy policy. You. I would hope you have some principles, some limits, some intents, that you could write down, THEN look for appropriate verbiage and or lawyering.

Failing to take direct, overt, meaningful responsibility for directing the policy to meet YOUR intent leaves me completely distrustful.

[Elspeth]

Quote:

That behavioral tracking that you are doing with Google ticks me off. Why? You did not spell out that you were going to do it. You should have that in BOLD LETTERs on the site. It is not so much that you are doing it... but you are doing it in a surreptitious way. And I must tell you I resent the heck out of it. It seems a little sneaky.

Isn't it just fine-tuning of the same sort of thing which already leads to different ads at this site from the ones we get at the Royal Forums and on Andy's other sites? If you're going to have ads, you may as well have relevant ones; personally I get ticked off more by ads for irrelevant rubbish which look as though nobody's taken a moment to think about the people visiting the site than by targetted ads, which, once in a very great while, are even useful.