Intermittent Fasting, Yes it Works

[harley]

Back on topic. I have been doing a One Meal A Day thing for the past three days. It's not really an intentional decision, I just eat a (big) meal at around 4 to 6 and don't get hungry again before I go to bed. The next day I start getting a bit peckish around noon, but it's easy to ignore and by the time I'm ready to eat I'm hungry but not starving. Interesting, since all my life I've been hungry all day, especially late at night. It's amazing what dropping carbs from your diet does to change the body's rhythm. It would be really nice if this would allow me to lose those last 7 or 8 lbs and reach my goal of getting under 200 lbs for the first time in 40 years.

 

[ElizabethT]

I started around the end of January. 211lbs. Today I was at 192. I have not been religious to any one time slot. First week 16/8 to 18/6. Then a couple of weeks at 20/4, then back to 18/6. I have found it easy to do. and I like the results so far. Real question is how easy is it to live on 16/8.

I am about 3 months + into a 16/8. I find it very easy. There have only been 2-3 occasions over that time period where it didn’t work because of social engagements or travel.

I haven’t changed my workouts or much else. I just don’t eat breakfast and I don’t eat after 7-8pm.

Same as COcheesehead above. Basically I'm just not eating breakfast, so it's no big deal to sustain. And the lack of bouncing blood sugar from constant small meals has been amazing. I can't explain it, and I started it intuitively, not because I read something somewhere. So, I guess I should watched that video someone posted to find out just exactly why it's working!

 

[ElizabethT]

So obviously you have found that it doesn’t reduce your ability to workout at all?

I am super duper active (about 30 miles a week of walking, running or hiking, plus yoga and strength training) and I am amazed at how well I'm feeling. Yesterday we did a seven mile hike and I was positively surging at the end in spite of not having eaten since dinner the night prior. I tend toward hypoglycemia, particularly during long hikes/runs, and have had zero occurrences since I started doing a roughly 16/8 intermittent fast.

I feel like it should be said that just because this is working for me, after years of trying lots of different methods to sustain energy, lessen my hypoglycemia and stabilize my weight, doesn't mean it's for everyone. Having fallen into it accidentally, the result of trying to avoid overeating on a cruise we were on in January, no one was more surprised than me when the weight began to come off. So if it doesn't work for you, I get it, believe me.

 

[Rianne]

Good article as the IF studies continue. From "The Big Think" referencing a Singapore study. Seems the 16/8 model is most beneficial.


"The benefits do not stop with neurogenesis. As the Singapore-based team writes,
"Prophylactic IF has been shown to promote longevity as well as ameliorate the development and manifestation of age‐related diseases such as cardiovascular, neurodegenerative, and metabolic diseases in many animal studies. It has also been postulated that IF is able to cause changes in the metabolic pathways in the brain, which leads to stress resistance capacity of brain cells."



https://bigthink.com/mind-brain/intermittent-fasting?rebelltitem=3#rebelltitem3

 

[audreyh1]

Correct. That was an early concern of mine, but it was more of a mental block than a physical concern.

The first meal after a workout tastes really good though.

When I first started keto I read so many claims and warnings that you couldn’t do aerobic workouts or other intense workouts with the super low glycogen stores from a keto diet. But I also read about long distance endurance athletes that did very well on it. My personal experience was that once I was mostly fat adapted after a couple of weeks, I had no difficulty resuming my pretty intense (for me) 45 min cardio weight training workouts. it absolutely did not matter when I had last eaten. It was very freeing. A lot of the frequently dished out dietary advice for working out is hogwash.

 

[braumeister]

once I was mostly fat adapted after a couple of weeks, I had no difficulty resuming my pretty intense (for me) 45 min cardio weight training workouts.

It also applies to endurance, like marathon running. There is no more "wall" to worry about hitting. That was a very pleasant surprise for me.

 

[audreyh1]

I am super duper active (about 30 miles a week of walking, running or hiking, plus yoga and strength training) and I am amazed at how well I'm feeling. Yesterday we did a seven mile hike and I was positively surging at the end in spite of not having eaten since dinner the night prior. I tend toward hypoglycemia, particularly during long hikes/runs, and have had zero occurrences since I started doing a roughly 16/8 intermittent fast.

I feel like it should be said that just because this is working for me, after years of trying lots of different methods to sustain energy, lessen my hypoglycemia and stabilize my weight, doesn't mean it's for everyone. Having fallen into it accidentally, the result of trying to avoid overeating on a cruise we were on in January, no one was more surprised than me when the weight began to come off. So if it doesn't work for you, I get it, believe me.

I know quite a few people who used the many small meals approach to “manage” hypoglycemia, but I also suspected, based on many videos I had watched, that the opposite approach like IF or keto would probably be far more effective so it’s great to learn that has worked for you. I agree that it’s wonderful to do an endurance activity and not worry about when you last ate, nor “hit the wall” or get ravenously hungry while doing it.

 

[Ed_The_Gypsy]

Like drinking 8 glasses of water a day. I've never been able to find a single scientific reason for that recommendation. The only remotely likely explanation is that it keeps you feeling fuller, so maybe you won't eat as much. But no science.

It prevents kidney stones, I hear.

 

[6miths]

It prevents kidney stones, I hear.

There is no 'high quality' evidence but there would be many theoretical benefits including reduced kidney stones, constipation, and bladder cancer but there could also be some long term downside too. The definitive study is not going to be done. And of course the premise of benefit would be that you had access to a good water supply.

 

[COcheesehead]

Here is my 6 month update, but first one since getting my blood drawn.

12 lbs lost, from a already pretty lean body. Not sure where I had 12 lbs hidden, but they are gone.

Triglycerides down to 59.
Fasting glucose down to 90, from 105.
A1c 5.2
Cholesterol ratio 1.24

All else in good normal ranges.

I am a believer for sure.

Still don't miss breakfast.

 

[razztazz]

There is no 'high quality' evidence but there would be many theoretical benefits including reduced kidney stones, constipation, and bladder cancer but there could also be some long term downside too. The definitive study is not going to be done. And of course the premise of benefit would be that you had access to a good water supply.

I've been intermittent fasting for years and years. And as you might have read right here recently had surgery for a kidney stone. So the empirical evidence (that which we can see) "Suggests" that IF causes the worst kind of kidney stones.

Oh, and apparently it also causes heart attacks. What better study results are there than when the study pertains to yourself and is not confused by aggregate data that speaks only to averages per 100,000 specimens and may or may not corrects for a host of spurious factors etc etc. Like that other thread about finding the best diet FOR YOU because there is no ONE BEST DIET for everybody.

 

[6miths]

I've been intermittent fasting for years and years. And as you might have read right here recently had surgery for a kidney stone. So the empirical evidence (that which we can see) "Suggests" that IF causes the worst kind of kidney stones.

Oh, and apparently it also causes heart attacks. What better study results are there than when the study pertains to yourself and is not confused by aggregate data that speaks only to averages per 100,000 specimens and may or may not corrects for a host of spurious factors etc etc. Like that other thread about finding the best diet FOR YOU because there is no ONE BEST DIET for everybody.

Sorry the intervention that I was referring to was from the preceding post regarding drinking 8 glasses of water a day, not regarding IF.

I do agree with you that studies are based on population samples and individual biology is just that although within some relatively narrow constraints.

When I refer to high quality evidence and studies I am speaking of randomized trials of interventions.

 

[audreyh1]

Here is my 6 month update, but first one since getting my blood drawn.

12 lbs lost, from a already pretty lean body. Not sure where I had 12 lbs hidden, but they are gone.

Triglycerides down to 59.
Fasting glucose down to 90, from 105.
A1c 5.2
Cholesterol ratio 1.24

All else in good normal ranges.

I am a believer for sure.

Still don't miss breakfast.

Well hopefully those pounds lost are from fat in and around the internal organs, which seems most likely.

Congrats!

 

[Momcpa]

I'm interested in any discussion about IF. I do a 'modified' version of it and have found it's a good way to maintain even if I'm not losing anything substantial.

 

[Rianne]

I've been IF or better said restrictive eating going on 3 years. The benefits are clear and have changed my life and health. This article from Harvard Medical School goes in depth of the benefits of fasting, being intermittent or long term. It lead me to the next article in this post below. I know clicking on links is a pain, but if you're interested in medical research and studies, there's no way anyone could summarize the extent of the article in a post.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/intermittent-fasting-surprising-update-2018062914156

I also signed in for 3 free articles from The New England Journal of Medicine. The article is mostly for doctors who understand medical jargon. I copied the summary and posted the article. You may have to sign in for full access.

"Preclinical studies and clinical trials have shown that intermittent fasting has broad-spectrum benefits for many health conditions, such as obesity, diabetes mellitus, cardiovascular disease, cancers, and neurologic disorders. Animal models show that intermittent fasting improves health throughout the life span, whereas clinical studies have mainly involved relatively short-term interventions, over a period of months. It remains to be determined whether people can maintain intermittent fasting for years and potentially accrue the benefits seen in animal models. Furthermore, clinical studies have focused mainly on overweight young and middle-age adults, and we cannot generalize to other age groups the benefits and safety of intermittent fasting that have been observed in these studies."

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMra1905136

 

[harley]

I've been having some issues, and I'm not sure what the problem or solution might be.

We've been doing IF/LCHF for a couple of years now. I've lost about 50 lbs, but been stabilized at ~205 for the past 6 months. I'm not making any attempt to lose any more, since I'm feeling pretty healthy at this weight (at 6'1"). I know I'm still in the overweight range, but after 35 years as obese I'm not that worried about it.

We've mostly do 18/6, although sometimes there's some cheating if we stay up too late. Mostly some nuts or popcorn. But for the most part we stick with it pretty well.

My problem is that I've started checking my blood sugar again off and on after having it drop into the pre-diabetic range about a year and a half ago, and having stopped taking insulin about the same time. I was pretty stable for a long time. My FBS level now is much higher, in the 170s or so. I'm not sure why. I'm going to continue testing and be even more careful, but we don't eat hardly any non-vegetable carbs, so I'm just not sure what's going on.

I'm not going to a doctor any time soon, but after all this Covid stuff is over I think I'm going to try to find an Endocrinologist that is open minded about IF and such. I'd be curious to see if any of y'all have any thoughts about it too.

 

[braumeister]

What has been your A1C trend?

 

[harley]

My A1c has been always been pretty good, even when I was considered diabetic. Usually 6-ish or below. After the changes caused by IF/LCHF, it's been excellent, 5.2 range. My issue has always been high to sky high FBS. Nobody I've ever worked with has been able to explain it, other than shrugging and saying "dawn phenomenon". I only ever took insulin to lower the fasting numbers.

I've always wondered if I've got something going on that results in lower A1c's than I should have. I'm a little anemic, and have read that anemia can throw off the A1c. Even when my fasting numbers were over 200 on a daily basis my A1c was barely into the pre-diabetic range.

I know that what I really need to do (again) is to track my BGL all day for a period of a few months, through post prandial and other times, then see how that compares to the A1c. I'll give that a try whenever I get my next blood work done, using those results as a baseline. It's just annoying seeing the FBS level go up for no reason that I can think of.

 

[braumeister]

I googled "high glucose low a1c" and got a lot of suggested sites.

Here's one:

What Does Normal A1c and High Blood Sugar mean?

 

[saydiver]

I have been doing Keto/LCHF since late July last year and DH joined me about two weeks later. We were both obese at the time. I went on keto, because I was in severe pain at the time from a pinched nerve in my neck and wanted to reduce the stain on my back. He joined me on the program, not because he wanted to try Keto, in fact he was quite skepical about it, but because it was much easier for him to cook one type of meal for us rather than two different meals. He's a Type 2 diabetic and has been since 2000 and is also a leukemia survivor. My bs is normal. I practice IF and eat two meals a day and he doesn't do IF at all and eats three meals a day along with Keto snacks around four or five most afternoons. Within a couple of weeks of being on Keto he was off both diabetes meds and his A1c at last check several months ago was 5.8. I expect it has lowered even more and might be back in the normal range. I count carbs and use a carb manager and he doesn't count carbs at all. He also exercises 45 mins. a day on a rowing machine. To date he's lost 51 lbs and I've lost 37 lbs and although we're both considered overweight, neither of us is obese anymore. He's now a convert and says he'll continue eating Keto/LCHF for the rest of his life, but I doubt he will ever try IF.

 

[rkser]

Another happy story here, a retired 64 yr old egg eating, diabetic vegetarian male, started skipping breakfast around the start of the year, did 16/8 initially & then now doing 18/6 with having lunch at 1 & get done with supper before 7.

Walk a few miles most days of the week & some gardening at home.

Started at 162lbs, now am at 139lbs, 5'5" tall, BMI is in normal range, A1C was around 6 now at 5.1. Fasting Blood Glucose is 78, LDL is 62.

Doc says if the lab results show continued improvement, may decrease Meds.

Keep log on & off at My Fitness Pal app, try to keep daily carbs around 100 gms

 

[tulak]

I’m having interesting results with my BP. I measured my BP for the first time in over six months and it was 105/67. I was very surprised at this number and didn’t believe it at first. I’ve been tracking it more diligently over the last few days and have confirmed that my BP is lower overall (yay!), but there are still some inconsistencies I need to figure out.

For example, I measured this afternoon and had a reading of 143/84 and five minutes later, 122/82. But over the last few days, I’ve been consistently under 120/80. That’s never happened to me before.

I’ve also confirmed these results with two different BP monitors and both are in the same range. It’s not a device issue.

A little bit of history. I’ve historically had a BP in the range of 130-150/80-90 without meds. I’ve taken Lisinopril/HCTZ, which worked for me. I never cared for it though and when initial reports of COVID potentially having negative interactions with this drug, I decided to take a break. That’s not sustainable though and I decided it’s time to track my BP again and make sure it’s in a safe range. That’s what led me to the current round of measuring.

So what has changed?

Two things: IF and Whole30.

I’ve been doing IF almost daily for the last 4-5 months. I started based on this thread, but not for any real health benefits. My weight was fine and I exercise regularly. I was mostly curious to see how I’d feel and in this regard, I didn’t notice much of a difference. Prior to Whole30, I didn’t watch what I ate, but I’ve always ate very little processed foods. I would still eat breads, chocolate, ice creams and such, but high quality products (fresh bread/baked goods from the local bakery, quality ice cream, etc).

As for Whole30, I did this on a fluke because my girlfriend was doing this with her friends for the month of June. I’m always up for trying something new, so I tagged along. Oh, we have one (big) modification to Whole30: we can drink wine/beer. I haven’t restricted myself in this regard at all. Otherwise, full Whole30 and eating between 12-8pm (usually less, but that’s my window).

So now I’m trying to figure out why my BP is lower. I tried to lower it in the past with diet and with no luck. But I’ve never had this strict of a diet. I also never did IF in the past.

This post turned out to be longer than I planned, mostly because I’m still trying to figure out why my BP is lower. I have another week of Whole30, at which point I’ll reintroduce foods. I’m also measuring my BP daily at various times so hopefully that will clear up any inconsistencies in my measurements.

Regardless, I’m very (very) happy. If I can somehow maintain a low BP without meds and still enjoy beer/wine, then I’m more than happy to give up all the other stuff.

 

[audreyh1]

Eating low carb and/or intermittent fasting lowers BP because your kidneys retain less sodium due to lower blood insulin.

Losing weight also lowers BP.

 

[tulak]

Eating low carb and/or intermittent fasting lowers BP because your kidneys retain less sodium due to lower blood insulin.

Losing weight also lowers BP.

I’m really not low carb because I’m consuming a lot of fruit.

I have lost about 4-5 lbs, but that’s from 170 to 165 and I’m 6’ tall. Not a big difference.

I most likely am consuming a lot less sodium. I rarely add salt and I’m not eating anything that has added salt, at least for the most part.

I’m interested to see what happens when I introduce certain foods back into my diet.

 

[audreyh1]

Intermittent fasting major effect is to lower blood insulin. That’s why Dr. Fung recommends it for diabetes and obesity although he also recommends avoiding high carb foods and definitely junk foods. Less blood insulin, lower sodium retention by the kidneys, lower BP. Note that I didn’t say anything about ingested sodium.

Whole30 eliminates grains and legumes. That would definitely drop the daily carbs big time compared to the standard Americans diet or the USDA promoted food pyramid.

A loss of 5 pounds may seem tiny, but small weight losses can also help reduce BP. It may not be a major factor in your case. Who knows?

But maybe you should investigate your fasting blood insulin, A1C, etc. instead of arguing how it couldn’t be working that way. If you really want to understand what happens physiologically, you need to read material by Dr Fung, etc.