Need Rec's for Lowering Medical Insurance Costs

[LuvSouth]

I also think this is how it works and why it's cheaper for Canadian snowbirds to get top up insurance for 6 months, say.

Because Canada already has a good health care system as a foundation, when a visitor is admitted to hospital in the US, the top up insurance will pay for the cost beyond Canada covers. Once the patient is stabalized after a few days (for argument sake), he/she will be flown back to Canada to receive care which is cheaper.

So the top up insurance company does NOT have to pay for extended period of stay in US hospital for double/ridiculous US hospital charges.

That's why top up insurance quoted me CAD$280-350/6 months (no pre ex conditions), and CAD$500-800/6 months with increased age (older), again no pre ex conditions.

This CAN'T be done in the US if you are Americans as you Americans will have to stay in the US hospitals no matter what, and get charged ridiculously, hence you pay US$17,000/year to get insurance. It's ridiculous to Canadians ...

 

[LuvSouth]

This is in response to: Medical tourism or private hospitals in Canada

First of all, I agree no system is perfect including the health care system in Canada. Canada is notorious for it's long wait time. I don't know how long but occasionally it's like 8 week wait time to see a specialist, some times 4 weeks, 2 weeks ... depending on where and who and what ...

Having said that, if it's emergency, you will get treatment in Canada. Just to to ER of any hospitals in Canada.

Medical tourism: Well, we have the Canada Health Act which will punish ANY PROVINCE, Alberta in this case, for charging patient. Alberta learned a lesson from the federal government

In order to allow private clinics (which charge the patient directly), the federal government will have to change the Canada Health Act. Do you think it's so easy to change it ? Canadians highly value their own health care system and feel proud because they are protected by the Canada Health Act: Every one can access health care regardless how poor or rich they are, no queue jumping.

Whether you are Comrad Black or a common, you get the same treatment, that's the beauty of Canada !

 

[kevink]

Here at Lake Chapala in Mexico about half of the snow bird visitors are Canadian, and they seem to share LuvSouth's astonishment that we U.S. citizens put up with our broken health care system. One of the problems, clearly, for we ER types is that the vast majority of the population still has employer-based group health insurance and so doesn't feel the pain of sky-high private insurance rates that are going up at ~20-50% per year.

You can get a sense of just how unique the U.S. is if you look for travel insurance from any number of sites. There are always two rates: one for "entire world excluding U.S." and another much higher rate for including the U.S. assuming your home country is elsewhere. When we return to the U.S. we usually buy insurance from World Nomads (.com) and that cost is one of the biggest factors that limits our time back home. A quick trip to the E.R. could easily cost 20 grand or more without insurance - enough to cover major surgery or cancer treatment down here.

Sadly the media in the U.S. seems to almost never report on this being a uniquely American problem that no other civilized country in the world will put up with. As the old bumper sticker says, "if you're not outraged, you're not paying attention."

 

[CoolChange]

I would add from my long experience practicing in the US that during a more serious illness or those with numerous complications, nonroutine surgery, many expats choose to return to the US, mainly to be nearer to family and support systems. Practicing in both Fla and AZ, we saw many from Mexico, Central and South America. I don't know if that was because they felt the care here was superior, or rather for other reasons.

Be wary of those who assume that care is superior (better outcomes) in North America relative to other developed countries or in developing countries in local centers of excellence. The US no longer has a monopoly on quality or results.

This works in reverse as well: I have a friend who is from the UK and has told me his Plan B for cancer or other major illness is to return to the UK not just because of the cost but also for the family support system even though he thinks the quality of care could be slightly lower in the UK.

I have done no research myself nor do I have any personal experience with health care in the UK (which is more than a little surprising considering some of my adventures in the UK).

 

[LuvSouth]

Here at Lake Chapala in Mexico about half of the snow bird visitors are Canadian, and they seem to share LuvSouth's astonishment that we U.S. citizens put up with our broken health care system. One of the problems, clearly, for we ER types is that the vast majority of the population still has employer-based group health insurance and so doesn't feel the pain of sky-high private insurance rates that are going up at ~20-50% per year.

You can get a sense of just how unique the U.S. is if you look for travel insurance from any number of sites. There are always two rates: one for "entire world excluding U.S." and another much higher rate for including the U.S. assuming your home country is elsewhere. When we return to the U.S. we usually buy insurance from World Nomads (.com) and that cost is one of the biggest factors that limits our time back home. A quick trip to the E.R. could easily cost 20 grand or more without insurance - enough to cover major surgery or cancer treatment down here.

Sadly the media in the U.S. seems to almost never report on this being a uniquely American problem that no other civilized country in the world will put up with. As the old bumper sticker says, "if you're not outraged, you're not paying attention."

As said, private health insurance in the US is ridiculous ! And I express my sympathy to those who paid US$17,000/year and are facing a 10 or 15 or 20% rate hike every year.

I agee, as you said, it's a broken health care system in the US.

I can only suggest Americans talk to their congressmen/women when comes election time.

I suggest the following (I think it can be done):
- Put a cap on MDs, make it the law !
- Set guidelines to rule out UNNECESSARY procedures (so that Canadians are not treated like KINGS in US hospitals). This will scale back the costs in ER, in turn will reduce the private insurance rates.
- Introduce punishment to MDs who perform UNNECESSARY procedures. If caught, they will be fined heavily. This will stop them from milking the insurance companies, hence reduce the RIDICULOUS rate of US$17,000/year.
- Expand more public hospitals. This will slowly reduce the number of private hospitals as there are only a fixed number of patients/year.
- Scale back the salary of MDs. Introduce more ethic courses to MDs. MDs are to help patients, not to milk the insurance companies. I am sure a lot of MDs are not one of those bad apples who milk the insurance companies, hence a ridiculously high rate !

Why do Americans put up with this ridiculously high private insurance rate is beyond my and most Canadians' belief !

Good luck !

 

[REWahoo]

Why do Americans put up with this ridiculously high private insurance rate...

So we can keep the street lights on in our National Forests.

 

[RonBoyd]

So we can keep the street lights on in our National Forests.

 

[Retch The Grate]

From all reports care and costs in Thailand are exponentially better than here, but that's a very long trip.

My uncle retired to Thailand, and despite having Type 2 diabetes (controlled by diet), he pays under $2000 a year for medical insurance and is happy with the quality of care, though I've not intensively questioned him about it. He spent a lot of time in his career working and traveling in SE Asia and South America, so he may have a different set of standards than somebody who has lived in the US their entire life, but it is interesting to see for sure. Fits into some of my retirement scenarios.

 

[Meadbh]

Message to LuvSouth: cool it, eh?

just edited ignore list.....

 

[ERD50]

...
I can only suggest Americans talk to their congressmen/women when comes election time.

I suggest the following (I think it can be done):
- Put a cap on MDs, make it the law !

I agree it needs fixin'. But...

Show me a case where price controls worked (in the long run, big picture view).

- Set guidelines to rule out UNNECESSARY procedures (so that Canadians are not treated like KINGS in US hospitals). This will scale back the costs in ER, in turn will reduce the private insurance rates.

Define 'UNNECESSARY'.

- Introduce punishment to MDs who perform UNNECESSARY procedures. If caught, they will be fined heavily. This will stop them from milking the insurance companies, hence reduce the RIDICULOUS rate of US$17,000/year.

See above.

- Expand more public hospitals. This will slowly reduce the number of private hospitals as there are only a fixed number of patients/year.

And replace them with a monopoly? No thanks.

- Scale back the salary of MDs. Introduce more ethic courses to MDs. MDs are to help patients, not to milk the insurance companies. I am sure a lot of MDs are not one of those bad apples who milk the insurance companies, hence a ridiculously high rate !

See comment on price controls above. Sure, some ethics courses will solve the problem, we should have sent Bernie Madoff to one, Everything solved.

Why do Americans put up with this ridiculously high private insurance rate is beyond my and most Canadians' belief !

These ridiculously high private insurance rates are largely a RESULT of government intervention. Why be surprised when the group that was responsible for much of the problem isn't welcomed with open arms when they say "Hi! I'm from the Government and I'm here to help you"!.

Good luck !

It'll take more than that. From what I understand, the Canadian govt system has some significant differences (not just two dominant parties - a HUGE difference, IMO) that make getting real solutions a bit more of a reality.

-ERD50