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06-14-2018, 10:35 AM
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#1
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 977
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Surgery sticker shock
I recently had ventral hernia surgery in Florida. I thought you all might be amused to look at the hospital billing statement. Keep in mind this does not even include the surgeon fee, anesthesia doc, and followup appts. Also, it was an outpatient procedure! The hospital charged $31K for the first 30 minutes in the operating room, and $30K for additional time beyond the 30 min. I think my Tricare insurance ended up paying less than $8k, but the billing is not finalized yet.
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06-14-2018, 10:38 AM
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#2
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: NC
Posts: 21,204
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Not surprised at all. My wife had an ankle replacement a few years ago that cost $66K. The nationally reknowned surgeon charged $6K, the *@&$# hospital charged $60K for a 2-3 day stay...
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57
Target AA: 50% equity funds / 45% bonds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 1.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
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06-14-2018, 10:45 AM
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#3
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Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Flyover country
Posts: 25,199
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You didn't post the second page of that statement that detailed the gourmet meals flown in from Paris, the private executive chef who reheated them in your private penthouse suite in the hospital, the string quartet providing background music, etc., etc.
I mean, seriously? Why not show all the reasons for those charges?
__________________
I thought growing old would take longer.
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06-14-2018, 10:46 AM
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#4
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 17,205
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You want to know the most shocking thing to me is on that bill?
That they actually charged ZERO on a number of items... I am really surprised they did not charge something and get it rejected..
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06-14-2018, 10:47 AM
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#5
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 977
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas Proud
You want to know the most shocking thing to me is on that bill?
That they actually charged ZERO on a number of items... I am really surprised they did not charge something and get it rejected..
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yes, apparently there was a special on oxygen that day
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06-14-2018, 01:48 PM
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#6
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gone traveling
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Berkeley, Denver, CO, USA
Posts: 1,406
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Why I like Kaiser.
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06-14-2018, 02:34 PM
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#7
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Eastern WV Panhandle
Posts: 25,302
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It doesn't surprise me a bit. I've been doing pretty good at running up hospital bills myself lately. (All better now, at least for the time being.)
I think the "rack rate" on hospital charges is a bigger fiction than the MSRP stickers on new cars.
__________________
When I was a kid I wanted to be older. This is not what I expected.
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06-14-2018, 02:43 PM
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#8
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Conroe, Texas
Posts: 18,645
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DW's heart valve replacement was $175,000 and $15,000 of that was for the surgeon. All covered by Medicare and her Plan F.
__________________
*********Go Astros!*********
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06-14-2018, 02:52 PM
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#9
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Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 40,586
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Just curious, to members posting about their hospital charges, are these original amounts billed or final negotiated rates?
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06-14-2018, 03:00 PM
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#10
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Conroe, Texas
Posts: 18,645
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelB
Just curious, to members posting about their hospital charges, are these original amounts billed or final negotiated rates?
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DW's were original amounts, not what Medicare and the supplement paid.
__________________
*********Go Astros!*********
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06-14-2018, 03:00 PM
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#11
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 977
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelB
Just curious, to members posting about their hospital charges, are these original amounts billed or final negotiated rates?
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The bill I posted was the actual hospital bill, stating I owed over $4K. Turns out that is incorrect and my insurance is adjusting their compensation to the hospital. I just wonder if someone who chooses to self-insure would get the same bill for about $100K for an outpatient procedure.
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06-14-2018, 03:14 PM
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#12
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 953
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This is why there is such a risk for living without insurance. Many bankruptcies are related to medical expenses like these. In some cases, people could have paid there way out of a bill if it represented what insurance companies negotiated rates were.
This is a great example of the fallacy of asking patients to be better consumers and pay attention to what procedures cost, and to shop around for more economical choices. There is no way to understand what the costs are up front, and in the end, there is no visibility to what the agreements are between the insurance companies and the providers.
__________________
Well it's all right, we're heading to the end of the line...
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06-14-2018, 03:24 PM
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#13
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 12,598
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I just had an endoscopy. Was charged $200 co-pay for "surgery" - the biopsies.
Mr. A.'s skin cancer removals are $200.00 co-pay each. The surgeon charges about 10x that.
__________________
If you understood everything I say, you'd be me ~ Miles Davis
'There is only one success – to be able to spend your life in your own way.’ Christopher Morley.
Even a blind clock finds an acorn twice a day.
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06-14-2018, 04:30 PM
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#14
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: West of the Mississippi
Posts: 17,173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clone
This is a great example of the fallacy of asking patients to be better consumers and pay attention to what procedures cost, and to shop around for more economical choices. There is no way to understand what the costs are up front, and in the end, there is no visibility to what the agreements are between the insurance companies and the providers.
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I think you have hit on something here.
Medical costs and pricing reminds me of those commercials for
Kitchen gadgets...... The Zapomatic Food Cruncher is normally $79, but for the next 5000 people who call you can get it and a complete set of Seal-a-Mighty canisters, a $49 value, all for $29.95!!!!!!!!!
What in the world is the actual costs of the product and the actual prices in this mess? What are true prices and what are come-ons for those who do't know better? How can a product or service cost $200 'normally', but be sold to me/insurance for on a regular basis for $93?
Truly it is a mess.
__________________
Comparison is the thief of joy
The worst decisions are usually made in times of anger and impatience.
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06-14-2018, 04:41 PM
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#15
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sarasota, FL & Vermont
Posts: 36,266
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I would favor regulations that would limit a provider's "rack-rate" to no more an 3x the lowest insurer negotiated cost for that service/code as a first step towards something more sensible.
__________________
If something cannot endure laughter.... it cannot endure.
Patience is the art of concealing your impatience.
Slow and steady wins the race.
Retired Jan 2012 at age 56
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06-14-2018, 04:49 PM
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#16
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Collin County, TX
Posts: 9,294
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I have a rough estimate of the expenses when DH was diagnosed with cancer. From the diagnosis, a few procedures and radiation treatments, the total was approximately $145k. Our insurance paid $45k and we paid $8k ($8k was our max out of pocket expenses). ...and this was seven years ago.
The good news is, everything is fine thus far.
__________________
There's no need to complicate, our time is short..
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06-14-2018, 05:10 PM
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#17
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Texas: No Country for Old Men
Posts: 50,004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbamI
The good news is, everything is fine thus far.
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You should celebrate - maybe buy a sports car.
__________________
Numbers is hard
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06-14-2018, 05:15 PM
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#18
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 12,598
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__________________
If you understood everything I say, you'd be me ~ Miles Davis
'There is only one success – to be able to spend your life in your own way.’ Christopher Morley.
Even a blind clock finds an acorn twice a day.
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06-14-2018, 05:28 PM
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#19
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 2,232
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My step-son cut his leg skateboarding. 12 stitches in OR...bill....$27,000.
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06-14-2018, 05:31 PM
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#20
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Limerick
Posts: 5,638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbamI
I have a rough estimate of the expenses when DH was diagnosed with cancer. From the diagnosis, a few procedures and radiation treatments, the total was approximately $145k. Our insurance paid $45k and we paid $8k ($8k was our max out of pocket expenses). ...and this was seven years ago.
The good news is, everything is fine thus far.
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Glad to hear everything is okay!
DW also had cancer, back in 2004. Insurance paid about $60k for that, and we paid about $600.
Everything is good with her too (knock on wood).
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