"Won the Game" Strategies

[Danmar]

+1 I knew and worked with and for people like that but never "got it". Sure, I enjoyed the game and closing a big deal but it was a means to an end and not an end in itself. I can't understand those folks who have plenty and could comfortably retire in leisure but keep pounding it anyway.... like Warren Buffett, Hank Greenberg, et al.... their makeup is different from mine.

Well said. “Means to an end” for sure. The end is not having to do what other people want you to do. Self empowerment is the ultimate luxury in my opinion. Doesn’t have to cost that much either.

 

[Danmar]

It depends on how the$10 million come from. If it comes from indexing investment, the person may have very high income and high expenses, thus game is not over.

Yes, it can be a cause vs effect question. Do I spend a lot because I have a lot or did I get a lot because I needed to spend a lot? Or is is iterative?

 

[timemoveson]

Would all the participants here with over $10 million in liquid assets care to share why you have not won the game?

Sure, I'll play. I've got the $10M and I've "won". I know it. I built it carefully over 30 years of work.

Having "won", I'm still playing but it's a different game. It includes creating an inter-generational legacy, helping people start new things, supporting causes I really believe in, and having a lot of fun with likely an encore career and ventures. This will need lubrication.

I got to this point spending at a very high level in a HCOL place but still well below our means, so this won't need to change. It certainly doesn't need to get any richer, however. The money side of it will be about balance and managing risk.

 

[RobbieB]

I got a lot (not even half of 10 mil) by not spending a lot.

But now that I've got in and also on the last third of my life it's time to spend a lot -

Still into equities a lot because they returned 20% YTD compared to bonds at 3%.

 

[mickeyd]

Been ERd for over 10 years and our income stream has always been more each month than expenses so I stash the overage in savings. Savings has grown pretty large. When RMD time came a few years ago and I had to decide what to do with that chunk of annual cash, it hit me that I had won the game and I would never be poor again.


I'm pretty sure my numbers are correct.

 

[pb4uski]

Would all the participants here with over $10 million in liquid assets care to share why you have not won the game?

Not me but it depends on your expenses... if you have $10m but a high lifestyle and need $500k a year to live on then you haven't "won the game".

That is the dilemma of having "won the game"... on one hand you no longer need to play and can derisk and still have a high success rate... but on the other hand since you have so much redundancy you can well afford to keep playing (and make life better for your heirs and charities if things work out).

 

[braumeister]

I really don't know why some have such a hard time understanding the likes of Buffett, Gates, et al.
They have no concept of winning or losing the game, because that's not why they play it. They simply love the playing of the game. Life would lose its meaning if they couldn't keep doing what they love.

I don't see any difference between them and others who keep doing what they do. Think of people like Robert Byrd, Daniel Inouye, or Strom Thurmond in the US Senate, or George Burns, Bob Hope, or Betty White among the Hollywood crowd.

 

[haha]

I thought what is the good of all those billions if they aren't buying the partners leisure time and peace of mind? It made me realize winning the game after a certain income level was really more a mental hurdle than a financial one.

If you are not driven, you do not become a billionaire. We all benefit from these creators and producers, as among other things they create charities and foundations and pay a giant share of income taxes in America. Though we would never know this if we just accept the massively biased reporting in America today.

Ha

 

[Huston55]

OP-

In your situation, I’d ask myself a few questions; the answers would determine how much I do/don’t “take off the table.”

1. How would you feel if the market tanks in <2yrs before you RE?
Answer a: Absolutely heartsick
Answer b: A bit disappointed but, no biggie

2. How much of your essential expenses are already covered by what DLDS calls ‘Matching’ resources?
Answer a: >100%
Answer b: <50%

3. Are there things (travel, legacy, etc.) that “taking assets off the table” would prevent you from having that are very, very important to you? Existentially important?
Answer a: Not really
Answer b: Absolutely! Existentially important or, several very important ones.

The sample answer pairs each represent ends of a spectrum. If you answered all three closer to the “a” side of the spectrum, I’d suggest you change your approach to be more conservative now. If you answered closer to the “b” side of the spectrum, I’d suggest you remain where you are and get your head around “playing the game” for =>2yrs longer. If your answers are mixed, it’s up to you pal.

 

[kcowan]

I understand the desire to keep on doing what you are good at. That seems to be Buffett's reason. I was good at making money too. But I guess I always had a balance. I would get up at 5:30 pm and say: "OK you guys can finish this and let me know the result."

Sometimes the results were surprisingly good. That is when I discovered the power of effective delegation. That became fun and all my direct reports loved it. Pretty soon I had spare time to mentor the ones who were having trouble.

I used to joke that I could work myself out of any job in 18 months!

 

[daylatedollarshort]

If you are not driven, you do not become a billionaire. We all benefit from these creators and producers, as among other things they create charities and foundations and pay a giant share of income taxes in America. Though we would never know this if we just accept the massively biased reporting in America today.

Ha

I should have added to my initial post that the article painted these guys were pretty stressed out and living in fear - constant fear of missing the next big deal.

 

[marko]

I should have added to my initial post that the article painted these guys were pretty stressed out and living in fear - constant fear of missing the next big deal.

Fear of missing the next big deal (Amazon, Apple) is different from the fear of going broke.

My experience with guys like this is that it is a competition between their peers and often a matter of lifelong insecurities. "I had to get two Gulf Streams just to prove (to myself) that I could".

You end up with a powerful tool (money) and it becomes intoxicating. You play the game because, like the mountain, it's there and few get to play in those heady big-leagues; you're someone.

It's often not even about 'look at me', its more about a self satisfaction.

They're just wired differently and see and value things differently.
I'd sit in a restaurant with a guy and he couldn't just enjoy the meal. He had to explain to me the owner's intricate connection to X, Y and Z and how the owner also owns A, B and C businesses and how the owner's wife's father funded the whole thing and how the old man got his money from selling leather to the military or something.

 

[RobbieB]

Me thinks the fear is watching another partner get the next big deal and all the glory.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Fear of missing the next big deal (Amazon, Apple) is different from the fear of going broke.

I don't believe I said they were the same thing. I'm also not a venture capitalist or a billionaire. But that article did influence my thinking in that I was going to stop working for the most part and invest for maximum tranquility, not worry about making more money when we already had more than most people.

 

[BeachOrCity]

Instead of asking myself if the stock market goes down by 50 percent woukd i hold the course, i recently asked myself a different question:

If the stock market went down by 50 percent would i still RE?

I adjusted my AA to the point where this question remains “Yes”!

Kind of a variation on “won the game”.

 

[Car-Guy]

Instead of asking myself if the stock market goes down by 50 percent woukd i hold the course, i recently asked myself a different question:

If the stock market went down by 50 percent would i still RE?

I adjusted my AA to the point where this question remains “Yes”!

Kind of a variation on “won the game”.

Actually that's getting "closer" to how I see it. If you can retire without the "need" for market returns, then "IMO", you have won the game. That's not saying you should get out of the market but just that you are not dependent on it to retire and maintain your chosen lifestyle and/or plans.

 

[Winemaker]

Me thinks the fear is watching another partner get the next big deal and all the glory.

I have to agree that this is the reason.

It is also the same reason we have some of the mainstream media reporters/ talking heads/celebrities/maniacs who should have retired years ago, and actually think that others sit on the edge of their sofa waiting for their news story or opinion. It goes for politicians, too.

It's a lust for the spotlight.