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01-30-2021, 04:06 PM
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#1
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 98
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FBAR
Considering staying for a couple of years outside the good old USA so contemplating filing for temporary residency in our current location. Will have to fund a bank account down here to do this.
Anyone on here that lives outside the US and has to file FBAR?
Just looking for a general take on it, issues etc. Have read a lot of the IRS info so looking from someone else's experience.
Thanks in advance.
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01-30-2021, 05:57 PM
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#2
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Thailand countryside, Sisaket province
Posts: 1,331
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I live in Thailand and have filed an FBAR for the past three years. It is an online form. I don’t recall that there was anything difficult about it. Thanks for reminding me about it for this year though
https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small...-accounts-fbar
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Happy, Wild, and Free
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01-31-2021, 08:39 AM
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#3
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martyp
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Thank you sir. Appreciate the input. I have scrolled thru the form and there are a few things I not sure of but obviously have some time to figure it out since next year would be the first time I would need to report.
I sent an email to my accountant back in the states to see if he has any clients he does this for and if he has any opinions.
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01-31-2021, 09:11 AM
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#4
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: On a hill in the Pine Barrens
Posts: 9,682
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When you have over $10,000 overseas (total) in banks, institutions, etc., you complete Form 8938 Statement of Specified Foreign Financial Assets, breaking out each account.
After filing your 1040, complete the FinCEN Form 114, Report of Foreign Bank and Financial Accounts and submit that online.
I've been doing the 8938's for a while. The FinCEN looks like the same information you've included on Form 8938. Of course there's no certainty in anything so follow all the research on IRS and FinCEN sites.
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01-31-2021, 09:21 AM
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#5
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by target2019
When you have over $10,000 overseas (total) in banks, institutions, etc., you complete Form 8938 Statement of Specified Foreign Financial Assets, breaking out each account.
After filing your 1040, complete the FinCEN Form 114, Report of Foreign Bank and Financial Accounts and submit that online.
I've been doing the 8938's for a while. The FinCEN looks like the same information you've included on Form 8938. Of course there's no certainty in anything so follow all the research on IRS and FinCEN sites.
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Thank you. I knew about FBAR Form 114, wasn't aware of form 8938. Appreciate the heads up.
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01-31-2021, 09:41 AM
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#6
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Thailand countryside, Sisaket province
Posts: 1,331
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rt-texas
Thank you sir. Appreciate the input. I have scrolled thru the form and there are a few things I not sure of but obviously have some time to figure it out since next year would be the first time I would need to report.
I sent an email to my accountant back in the states to see if he has any clients he does this for and if he has any opinions.
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I did my FBAR this morning. I have one bank account that applies. My financial life is pretty simple.
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Happy, Wild, and Free
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01-31-2021, 09:55 AM
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#7
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Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: N. Yorkshire
Posts: 34,050
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I have been doing FBARs for many years, they are easy to do.
Form 8938 is not usually needed for someone residing overseas as the reporting limits are much, much higher than the $10k FBAR limit. For a married couple the limit for IRS 8938 reporting is $400k in accounts on Dec 31st or $600k at any point during the year.
We’ve only had to file 8938 forms once, and that is because of the dumb math the IRS uses. The year we bought our house I transferred the money over from the USA and then put it in a savings account until needed. Even though we never actually exceeded the limit the same money is counted twice as it was in different accounts at different times during the year. FBAR calculations are the same flakey arithmetic.
https://www.irs.gov/businesses/corpo...r-us-taxpayers
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Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Enough private pension and SS income to cover all needs
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01-31-2021, 10:16 AM
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#8
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 98
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Thank you both martyp and Alan.
We will have to have two bank accounts. Initial deposit of 60k into one account and every month $2500 has to transfer to a "spending" bank account. So we will have to report both accounts as I understand it.
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01-31-2021, 12:38 PM
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#9
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Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: N. Yorkshire
Posts: 34,050
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rt-texas
Thank you both martyp and Alan.
We will have to have two bank accounts. Initial deposit of 60k into one account and every month $2500 has to transfer to a "spending" bank account. So we will have to report both accounts as I understand it.
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Yes. I keep a spreadsheet recording the highest balance of each account as per my monthly statements. On the FBAR report list every account and its highest balance during the year. The treasury issues the exchange rate to be used.
https://www.irs.gov/individuals/inte...exchange-rates
Note that once the $10k threshold is reached then ALL foreign bank accounts should be reported including those with small balances.
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Enough private pension and SS income to cover all needs
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01-31-2021, 01:01 PM
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#10
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Posts: 1,979
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As a newbie, I was unfamiliar with acronym "FBAR". Looked in forum's list of abbreviations and did not find it. First, it reminded me of a military abbreviation with just one additional letter in it.
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Dreams Worth Dreaming are Dreams Worth Planning For. I Spent a Career Planning for Early Retirement.
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01-31-2021, 01:06 PM
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#11
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Spending the Kids Inheritance and living in Chicago
Posts: 17,008
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Fortune favors the prepared mind. ... Louis Pasteur
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01-31-2021, 01:09 PM
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#12
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Spending the Kids Inheritance and living in Chicago
Posts: 17,008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan
Yes. I keep a spreadsheet recording the highest balance of each account as per my monthly statements. On the FBAR report list every account and its highest balance during the year. The treasury issues the exchange rate to be used.
https://www.irs.gov/individuals/inte...exchange-rates
Note that once the $10k threshold is reached then ALL foreign bank accounts should be reported including those with small balances.
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Yes - I report one account that has $0.05 in it. Due to laws in that country I cannot close the account, which I've tried to do just to not have to bother with it.
I really hate the dumb math , move $30,000 between 4 accounts and suddenly it looks like I have $120,000 in a foreign account
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Fortune favors the prepared mind. ... Louis Pasteur
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01-31-2021, 01:12 PM
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#13
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Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Flyover country
Posts: 25,198
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RetireeRobert
As a newbie, I was unfamiliar with acronym "FBAR". Looked in forum's list of abbreviations and did not find it.
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A full explanation was linked in post #2, so one might wonder why you had to look elsewhere.
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I thought growing old would take longer.
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01-31-2021, 01:14 PM
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#14
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan
Yes. I keep a spreadsheet recording the highest balance of each account as per my monthly statements. On the FBAR report list every account and its highest balance during the year. The treasury issues the exchange rate to be used.
https://www.irs.gov/individuals/inte...exchange-rates
Note that once the $10k threshold is reached then ALL foreign bank accounts should be reported including those with small balances.
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Great idea Alan. I love to spreadsheet everything anyway. I'll do that and maybe some screenshots just to keep for my records.
Appreciate all the help everyone.
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01-31-2021, 01:15 PM
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#15
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Posts: 1,979
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Quote:
Originally Posted by braumeister
A full explanation was linked in post #2, so one might wonder why you had to look elsewhere.
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I did not go elsewhere like clicking on the link given in the post, as I was leary of naked links. You mean maybe the link had the explanation? I should have gone to the link? Otherwise I saw no explanation in the language of the post itself.
Just wondering?
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Dreams Worth Dreaming are Dreams Worth Planning For. I Spent a Career Planning for Early Retirement.
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01-31-2021, 01:26 PM
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#16
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RetireeRobert
I did not go elsewhere like clicking on the link given in the post, as I was leary of naked links. You mean maybe the link had the explanation? I should have gone to the link? Otherwise I saw no explanation in the language of the post itself.
Just wondering?
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Report of Foreign Bank and Financial Accounts (FBAR)
You are required to fill out FBAR form if at anytime in the year you have over 10k total value in any foreign corp, bank account(s), trusts, retirement accounts etc. Due April 15, but you do not file with your income tax. Totally separate.
As I stated above we are looking to open a 60k "trust" bank account to qualify for temporary residency. Each month $2,500 get transferred to a separate account for spending purposes. So I would have to report both accounts since we would have over 10k total.
Also, this is required if you have over 10k at any point in the year. Penalties are high as I read them.
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01-31-2021, 01:33 PM
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#17
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Posts: 1,979
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Thanks so much rt-texas. Your kind explanation much appreciated, as is your taking the time for something might otherwise seem so obvious. Now it is all very clear.
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Dreams Worth Dreaming are Dreams Worth Planning For. I Spent a Career Planning for Early Retirement.
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01-31-2021, 02:10 PM
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#18
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Northern California
Posts: 326
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Just a quick note to add that this applies even before or without having established residency. I must do so for the account I maintain for a 2nd home overseas.
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01-31-2021, 02:46 PM
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#19
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oiseux
Just a quick note to add that this applies even before or without having established residency. I must do so for the account I maintain for a 2nd home overseas.
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Thanks for the heads up. Actually learned about FBAR from an American friend who bought a house inside a corporation outside the US. He knew nothing about FBAR and was only using it as a getaway place. Got his hand slapped for several years of no FBAR reporting.
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