Reviewing travel stuff

[bigreader]

Lot's of great advice here. I'd add one thing: make sure that you are using your ATM card at a "real" bank, not an exchange agent or a private party. Those fees can be very high. I look for an ATM from BNP, Crédit Agricole, Sociéte Générale or HSBC (and I am sure there are others). Sometimes, a legit bank is hard to find at the airport so I try to leave with enough Euros to get me to my lodging.
BR

[braumeister]

Quote:

Originally Posted by explanade You have to get a chip and PIN card. Most of the cards issued in the US are chip and signature card, meaning the receipt will prompt the merchant to get the signature of the card holder. For kiosks, you need chip and PIN or you will be out of luck. I've used a card from First Tech Credit Union for train ticket kiosks in Amsterdam and Belgium. I've also used it at gas stations which are often unattended and you have to use the kiosk. These are old so few of them have contactless, even though contactless cards are very common in Europe. So if you insert the card, it will prompt for PIN. The last time I tried it, my First Tech Credit Union card pin no longer works. So you either have to find a mini mart type of place to fill your gas or for train tickets hope they have contactless.

That used to be the case, but most machines are "tap and pay" now, so as long as you have that symbol on your card you have a good chance of it being accepted.

[explanade]

Well I just returned from Italy and I can tell you I didn't see too many kiosks with contactless sensors.

All the autostrada toll booths required that I insert my card in and I saw one gas station with a kiosk with contactless and there were attendants there telling me not to use them because they didn't work.

Usually there are gas stations like mini marts where you fill up first and then go in and pay and they will have a contactless terminal there to pay.

[braumeister]

Quote:

Originally Posted by explanade Well I just returned from Italy and I can tell you I didn't see too many kiosks with contactless sensors.

Thanks, good to know. I've never been to Italy.

[explanade]

Quote:

Originally Posted by braumeister Thanks, good to know. I've never been to Italy.

These are mostly older gas stations.

Many of them are away from town centers and they run unattended a large portion of the time so they have these old kiosks.

They haven't bothered to update the kiosks to contactless yet.

They're also common in France and I would think other EU countries.

France autoroutes do have toll booth kiosks with contactless though, worked great to use my Apple Watch, easier to do than reaching out from the car and inserting the credit card.

[braumeister]

I obviously spoke too soon. Nearly all my travel is in the northern half of Europe, where contactless is extremely common and Apple Pay is very widely accepted. Thanks for the information.

[explanade]

Yeah in restaurants, shops, hotels, they all have these little wireless terminals which can take both chip cards or you can tap.

(which makes me wonder why US businesses and banks don't have the same things).

But it's the kiosks out somewhere else that is probably the last to get upgraded.


One of the times I visited Amsterdam, I remember I couldn't use my US credit cards at the kiosks at the airport for the train tickets.

But I did buy a tram pass once I reached Central Station from another kiosk with the same credit cards which didn't work at AMS.

There the issue wasn't contactless (it was before contactless) but whether certain kiosks would take credit cards issued outside of The Netherlands or EU.

Supposedly a problem with websites for mobile carriers in the EU, they won't take even out of country credit cards for online top ups.

[jollystomper]

For international travel we use a credit card that does not charge foreign exchange fees. When using it we always ask for the charge in the local currency, not U.S. dollars. You get a much better exchange rate for charges that way.

[braumeister]

Quote:

Originally Posted by explanade One of the times I visited Amsterdam, I remember I couldn't use my US credit cards at the kiosks at the airport for the train tickets. But I did buy a tram pass once I reached Central Station from another kiosk with the same credit cards which didn't work at AMS. There the issue wasn't contactless (it was before contactless) but whether certain kiosks would take credit cards issued outside of The Netherlands or EU.

Yes, I ran into that a few times. Non-EU issued cards were worthless at kiosks in Belgium as well. Not all of them, but a great many.

[Chuckanut]

I use an old fashioned Garmin gps. I check for new map updates a week before I go and I’m off to the races.

[explanade]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jollystomper For international travel we use a credit card that does not charge foreign exchange fees. When using it we always ask for the charge in the local currency, not U.S. dollars. You get a much better exchange rate for charges that way.

I tried 3 different cards during my 2 week trip. They are all suppose to have no FX fees.

But they all charged me at a rate 1-2 cents higher than the wholesale rate shown on XE.com.

I think my debit card also did that as well.

For about half of my trip, the Euro was like 99 cents.

But when I look at my credit card transactions, maybe a half dozen of them reflect an FX rate where the dollar is higher than the Euro.

[SecondAttempt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldShooter For that reason, though DW and I each carry a debit card issued by a different bank and we each carry a credit card from a different issuer.

I got burned in Tahiti this summer. We arrived late at night and had a little cash from a previous trip. The next day we found an ATM and I made two withdrawals, one on my Ally ATM card and the other on my ATM card from my bank here in Hawaii. Both withdrawals were for the same amount.

Ally charged me nothing but did not refund the ~$4 charge that the French ATM charged me. My local bank also did not refund the French ATM fee, they also charged me a $6 fee for using a foreign ATM and about $15 in unexplained "international service charge" plus gave me a crappy exchange rate. So it cost me about $25 to withdraw a little under $500 plus the extra few dollars I lost on the exchange rate. That is a pretty steep price.

As I said, I have done this dozens of times over the years in Europe, Japan, Canada, Australia, and a few other places and never expected the extra fees. So if you use a small or unsophisticated bank be forewarned! I blame myself for not checking! My partner did the same thing on her local credit union card but was not charged nearly as much as I was, I think $3 for foreign ATM+$4 by the French ATM but no international service charge. I don't know but doubt she got a good exchange rate.

[SecondAttempt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by explanade I used to try to learn a few phrases in the local language but everyone in tourism or even retail speak a little English now.

I am reasonably fluent in Spanish after living in Arizona most of my life and taking 2 years of Spanish in college. I found that in Spain a couple of years ago that I could get by fairly well and I have no doubt if I stayed there for a month or two I would be fluent. And Spanish gives me a pretty good leg up on at least reading French, Italian, Portuguese, Catalan, and even Romanian.

I speak Swedish almost fluently which lets me mostly understand written Norwegian, Danish, and to some extent Icelandic. Spoken Danish and Icelandic are tougher but if I speak Swedish to them then understand and usually modulate their own spoken language to mimic Swedish and it works.
Plus I took German in high school and, while it is not that close to Swedish, especially the grammar, I can mostly read German and get my point across because there are a huge number of cognates. And Swedish+German=Dutch (almost). So I do pretty good in western Europe.

But I always try to learn a few words when I go somewhere - please, thank you, I'm sorry, excuse me, I need help, etc. I try very hard not to be an ugly American and expect others to deal with me in English. Google translate has become an enormous help recently!

I have had some interesting experiences trying to get things done in various countries including finding tools and special hardware in Japan when working on a project there. It never ceases to amaze me how well humans can communicate without language by miming, sketching, and pointing.

[athena53]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SecondAttempt So if you use a small or unsophisticated bank be forewarned! I blame myself for not checking!

Our guide in E. Europe pointed out a few "generic" ATMS that were not associated with any particular bank, and said they charged really steep fees. You may have encountered those. She told us to look for the ones with the name and logo of an actual bank on them. I'd never heard that before.

[braumeister]

Quote:

Originally Posted by athena53 Our guide in E. Europe pointed out a few "generic" ATMS that were not associated with any particular bank, and said they charged really steep fees. You may have encountered those. She told us to look for the ones with the name and logo of an actual bank on them. I'd never heard that before.

I've heard about that particular scam, so I try to only use ATMs that are actually inside a bank.

Another thing I've noticed is that ATMs in airports give worse exchange rates than ones downtown.

[Sunset]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SecondAttempt I got burned in Tahiti this summer. We arrived late at night and had a little cash from a previous trip. The next day we found an ATM and I made two withdrawals, one on my Ally ATM card and the other on my ATM card from my bank here in Hawaii. Both withdrawals were for the same amount. Ally charged me nothing but did not refund the ~$4 charge that the French ATM charged me. My local bank also did not refund the French ATM fee, they also charged me a $6 fee for using a foreign ATM and about $15 in unexplained "international service charge" plus gave me a crappy exchange rate. So it cost me about $25 to withdraw a little under $500 plus the extra few dollars I lost on the exchange rate. That is a pretty steep price. As I said, I have done this dozens of times over the years in Europe, Japan, Canada, Australia, and a few other places and never expected the extra fees. So if you use a small or unsophisticated bank be forewarned! I blame myself for not checking! My partner did the same thing on her local credit union card but was not charged nearly as much as I was, I think $3 for foreign ATM+$4 by the French ATM but no international service charge. I don't know but doubt she got a good exchange rate.

This is why I opened a Schwab bank account, and put a few extra thousand $$ in it when we travel, so I don't get charged all the extra fees. Of course due to Covid, I've barely used it

[Chuckanut]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SecondAttempt I got burned in Tahiti this summer. We arrived late at night and had a little cash from a previous trip. The next day we found an ATM and I made two withdrawals, one on my Ally ATM card and the other on my ATM card from my bank here in Hawaii. Both withdrawals were for the same amount. Ally charged me nothing but did not refund the ~$4 charge that the French ATM charged me. My local bank also did not refund the French ATM fee, they also charged me a $6 fee for using a foreign ATM and about $15 in unexplained "international service charge" plus gave me a crappy exchange rate. So it cost me about $25 to withdraw a little under $500 plus the extra few dollars I lost on the exchange rate. That is a pretty steep price. As I said, I have done this dozens of times over the years in Europe, Japan, Canada, Australia, and a few other places and never expected the extra fees. So if you use a small or unsophisticated bank be forewarned! I blame myself for not checking! My partner did the same thing on her local credit union card but was not charged nearly as much as I was, I think $3 for foreign ATM+$4 by the French ATM but no international service charge. I don't know but doubt she got a good exchange rate.

They hit you with what Clark Howard calls ‘junk fees’. Ugh!

[SecondAttempt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by athena53 Our guide in E. Europe pointed out a few "generic" ATMS that were not associated with any particular bank, and said they charged really steep fees. You may have encountered those. She told us to look for the ones with the name and logo of an actual bank on them. I'd never heard that before.

Nope. The fees from the ATM bank were pretty low. It was my American bank thaat gouged me and I coincidentally found out why today!

There is something called the Visa International Service Assessment. I was charged 3% in addition to ATM fees by MY bank. They disclosed they would be charging 3% on debit card transactions outsside the US in 2020. I just missed it.

My Ally debit card has a Mastercard logo and did not charge any international fee although I understand Mastercard allows banks to charge a similar fee.

I would strongly suggest anyone traveling internationally to find out what their bank will charge for an ATM withdrawal because I paid no such fee in 2019 just before covid. It is not a new thing in terms of banks being allowed to charge this fee but I think it is relatively new that many have started doing so.

[SecondAttempt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by braumeister I've heard about that particular scam, so I try to only use ATMs that are actually inside a bank. Another thing I've noticed is that ATMs in airports give worse exchange rates than ones downtown.

Yes, I am careful about that even at home. This was a Bank of Polynesia ATM which is a subsidiary of SocGen. We all know that big does not equal kind on fees but it was not the ATM operator that charged me so much. It was my own bank!

[DrRoy]

We were on a Danube cruise this spring, followed by a week and a half in Italy. Used the card for most everything, plus maybe 150 euros in cash.