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08-20-2021, 01:15 AM
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#101
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 4,661
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Where I live, pharmacies are advertising that they have boosters available for walk-ins, so I imagine there is plenty of supply. I got my vaccine in March, but it was J&J. One thing I find a bit puzzling about all of this is that Pfizer and Moderna were supposed to be more effective than J&J, yet there is no booster for J&J vax recipients at this time. Not sure if they’ll eventually recommend mixing the J&J vax with am mRNA booster or not. Guess I’ll wait and see.
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08-20-2021, 09:15 AM
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#102
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: West of the Mississippi
Posts: 17,173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba
Where I live, pharmacies are advertising that they have boosters available for walk-ins, so I imagine there is plenty of supply. I got my vaccine in March, but it was J&J. One thing I find a bit puzzling about all of this is that Pfizer and Moderna were supposed to be more effective than J&J, yet there is no booster for J&J vax recipients at this time. Not sure if they’ll eventually recommend mixing the J&J vax with am mRNA booster or not. Guess I’ll wait and see.
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I believe they are still studying the long term strength of the JnJ vaccine. It did come along a few months later than the mRNA vaccines so they need to wait to get more data in the 6+ month range.
__________________
Comparison is the thief of joy
The worst decisions are usually made in times of anger and impatience.
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08-20-2021, 01:08 PM
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#103
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Red Rock Country
Posts: 1,915
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba
Where I live, pharmacies are advertising that they have boosters available for walk-ins, so I imagine there is plenty of supply. I got my vaccine in March, but it was J&J. One thing I find a bit puzzling about all of this is that Pfizer and Moderna were supposed to be more effective than J&J, yet there is no booster for J&J vax recipients at this time. Not sure if they’ll eventually recommend mixing the J&J vax with am mRNA booster or not. Guess I’ll wait and see.
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I'd be very surprised if a booster isn't needed for the J&J vaccine. According to https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/covid-19-booster the J&J needs more real world US data which should start to come within a month or so. The company claims its vaccine is effective against Delta but a recent study suggests otherwise. Also, because the J&J vaccine relies on a harmless adenovirus to get it into cells, there's the possibility that the body may generate antibodies against that adenovirus which could lessen the effectiveness of a booster using the same J&J vaccine. So maybe the recommendation will be to get one of the mRNA vaccines as a booster for the J&J. Who knows, the jury is still out.
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08-20-2021, 02:45 PM
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#104
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Texas: No Country for Old Men
Posts: 50,004
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Interesting NPR article today.
Highly Vaccinated Israel Is Seeing A Dramatic Surge In New COVID Cases. Here's Why
Summary:
1. Immunity from the vaccine dips over time.
2. The delta variant broke through the vaccine's waning protection.
3. If you get infected, being vaccinated helps.
4. Israel's high vaccination rate isn't high enough.
5. Vaccinations are key, but they are not enough.
6. Booster shots offer more protection — if you are one of the world's lucky few to get them.
__________________
Numbers is hard
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08-20-2021, 08:19 PM
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#105
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 861
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba
Where I live, pharmacies are advertising that they have boosters available for walk-ins, so I imagine there is plenty of supply. I got my vaccine in March, but it was J&J. One thing I find a bit puzzling about all of this is that Pfizer and Moderna were supposed to be more effective than J&J, yet there is no booster for J&J vax recipients at this time. Not sure if they’ll eventually recommend mixing the J&J vax with am mRNA booster or not. Guess I’ll wait and see.
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San Francisco is giving supplemental (not booster heh) vaccinations to J&J recipients. I went and got a shot of Moderna (went with Moderna over Pfizer because of studies showing it performing better against Delta, though obv hard to extrapolate two dose mRNA dosing treatments vs my relatively unstudied J&J followed much later by M) today, 4.5 months after my J&J shot was administered. Super happy because my original desire in 2020 when they announced the various vaccines was to get one each of an mRNA and an adenovirus vaccine since supposedly (anecdotal articles research only) the mRNA have better antibody response and the adenovirus ones have better B and T-cell response.
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08-20-2021, 08:22 PM
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#106
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 8,968
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Kaiser will email me when my booster is available.
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08-20-2021, 08:55 PM
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#107
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 4,661
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Retch The Grate
San Francisco is giving supplemental (not booster heh) vaccinations to J&J recipients. I went and got a shot of Moderna (went with Moderna over Pfizer because of studies showing it performing better against Delta, though obv hard to extrapolate two dose mRNA dosing treatments vs my relatively unstudied J&J followed much later by M) today, 4.5 months after my J&J shot was administered. Super happy because my original desire in 2020 when they announced the various vaccines was to get one each of an mRNA and an adenovirus vaccine since supposedly (anecdotal articles research only) the mRNA have better antibody response and the adenovirus ones have better B and T-cell response.
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Interesting. Is that happening at pharmacies or public health departments or all of the above?
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08-20-2021, 11:25 PM
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#108
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 861
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba
Interesting. Is that happening at pharmacies or public health departments or all of the above?
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I got it at Zuckerberg SF General, AITC was also giving appointments for it. Not sure if pharmacies were doing it or not.
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08-23-2021, 01:37 AM
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#109
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Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: N. Yorkshire
Posts: 34,056
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The UK is starting on a new survey this week to collect data to help decide how “deep” they should go with their booster program. They have already announced that boosters will be offered to the clinically vulnerable plus everyone over age 50.
We are seeing over 30k PCR positive cases every day and have been for the past few weeks. They are going to offer 2 antibody test kits and recruit 8k volunteers per day from those that test positive for Covid. They will be asked to do the first antibodies test immediately and the 2nd 28 days later. The aim is to measure the increase in antibodies over that time frame after testing positive. They should capture a whole range of scenarios because the current situation is as follows.
94% of the adult population already have Covid antibodies in their system.
88% of over 16s have had 1 vaccine dose
76% have had 2 doses
Over 200k doses are being administered per day so some of the volunteers will receive their first or 2nd dose after testing positive.
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Enough private pension and SS income to cover all needs
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08-23-2021, 04:29 AM
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#110
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Chapel Hill, NC
Posts: 5,297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan
The UK is starting on a new survey this week to collect data to help decide how “deep” they should go with their booster program. They have already announced that boosters will be offered to the clinically vulnerable plus everyone over age 50.
We are seeing over 30k PCR positive cases every day and have been for the past few weeks. They are going to offer 2 antibody test kits and recruit 8k volunteers per day from those that test positive for Covid. They will be asked to do the first antibodies test immediately and the 2nd 28 days later. The aim is to measure the increase in antibodies over that time frame after testing positive. They should capture a whole range of scenarios because the current situation is as follows.
94% of the adult population already have Covid antibodies in their system.
88% of over 16s have had 1 vaccine dose
76% have had 2 doses
Over 200k doses are being administered per day so some of the volunteers will receive their first or 2nd dose after testing positive.
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Alan, so in the UK 94% of adults already have Covid antibodies but you are still getting a lot of new Covid cases. Does this mean there is no "herd immunity" for Covid?
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08-23-2021, 05:07 AM
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#111
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Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: N. Yorkshire
Posts: 34,056
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harllee
Alan, so in the UK 94% of adults already have Covid antibodies but you are still getting a lot of new Covid cases. Does this mean there is no "herd immunity" for Covid?
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Possibly no absolute herd immunity. This is one of the fact finding targets that the new testing survey will be looking to answer. How many of the newly infected people already have antibodies in their blood, and what levels and what types are there? Remember that antibodies are only 1 aspect of immunity.
When I was randomly selected and did my home antibody test a couple of months back it showed the levels of 2 types of antibodies with 2 horizontal lines, the brightness of the line indicating how much of each type was present (short-lived and long-lasting antibodies).
Thousands of NHS staff that are taking part in the "Siren" trial give blood samples every 2 weeks. The Siren trial has been running over a year, since June 2020, and has been looking at 50,000 healthcare workers who have had Covid.
Quote:
One of the biggest questions SIREN sought to answer was whether individuals who had previously been infected with COVID-19 enjoyed protection from the virus in future. Two groups of participants were studies – those with evidence of a previous COVID-19 infection and those without. When SIREN reported its first analysis, the study showed that 83% of people infected with COVID-19 had some protection against reinfection and this was part of the evidence demonstrating that individuals with a previous COVID-19 infection are likely to be protected against reinfection for several months.
And then vaccines came
As the rollout of vaccines began, the was study rapidly updated to include information about whether the participant had been vaccinated. By expanding the protocol of the study to include vaccine information, SIREN has been able to assess the effectiveness of vaccines. In February 2021, SIREN published findings that healthcare workers were 72% less likely to develop infection after one dose of the vaccine, rising to 86% after the second dose.
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__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Enough private pension and SS income to cover all needs
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08-23-2021, 05:24 AM
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#112
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 845
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A booster Pfizer dose significantly lowers risk of infection in seniors, according to new Israeli data.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...-live-updates/ (a free article)
"A study by the Israeli Health Ministry found that a third dose of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine provided four times as much protection against infection as two doses in people 60 and older."
"The level of protection was five to six times higher against serious illness and hospitalization, according to the study published Sunday, which looked at protection provided 10 days after a third dose."
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08-23-2021, 05:58 AM
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#113
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Northern Illinois
Posts: 16,543
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SIL has had covid and vaccine, and has been recently diagnosed with early stage Chronic Lymphocytic Leukemia. People with CLL have a lesser chance of having Covid antibodies.
Not sure if SIL has been checked for antibodies yet, but she has cut all contact with people - especially those not vaccinated.
She is being monitored without any cancer treatment at this time, and it will be interesting to see what her antibodies are if any, and when/whether she gets a covid vaccine booster.
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08-23-2021, 08:14 AM
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#114
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Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: N. Yorkshire
Posts: 34,056
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronstar
SIL has had covid and vaccine, and has been recently diagnosed with early stage Chronic Lymphocytic Leukemia. People with CLL have a lesser chance of having Covid antibodies.
Not sure if SIL has been checked for antibodies yet, but she has cut all contact with people - especially those not vaccinated.
She is being monitored without any cancer treatment at this time, and it will be interesting to see what her antibodies are if any, and when/whether she gets a covid vaccine booster.
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So sorry to hear about your SIL.
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Enough private pension and SS income to cover all needs
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08-23-2021, 10:13 AM
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#115
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Rio Grande Valley
Posts: 38,008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harllee
Alan, so in the UK 94% of adults already have Covid antibodies but you are still getting a lot of new Covid cases. Does this mean there is no "herd immunity" for Covid?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan
Possibly no absolute herd immunity. This is one of the fact finding targets that the new testing survey will be looking to answer. How many of the newly infected people already have antibodies in their blood, and what levels and what types are there? Remember that antibodies are only 1 aspect of immunity.
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Don’t forget about children. They are a large part of a population, and in the UK under 16 not eligible for vax either.
So looking at just the % of adults with antibodies does not give you a good enough picture. It has to be everybody.
Still possible that herd immunity is elusive.
__________________
Retired since summer 1999.
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08-23-2021, 11:43 AM
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#116
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Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: N. Yorkshire
Posts: 34,056
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audreyh1
Don’t forget about children. They are a large part of a population, and in the UK under 16 not eligible for vax either.
So looking at just the % of adults with antibodies does not give you a good enough picture. It has to be everybody.
Still possible that herd immunity is elusive.
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I only mentioned the 94% of adults having antibodies to illustrate how interesting the antibodies tests are going to be in this new survey as the antibody tests will be almost 100% on people over age 16 since that is where the vast majority of new infections are.
Someone else asked the question about herd immunity and that term is not being discussed at any of the scientific briefings here.
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Enough private pension and SS income to cover all needs
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08-23-2021, 12:01 PM
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#117
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Rio Grande Valley
Posts: 38,008
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I was mainly responding to harllee who was asking whether that meant herd immunity.
__________________
Retired since summer 1999.
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08-23-2021, 12:08 PM
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#118
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Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: N. Yorkshire
Posts: 34,056
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audreyh1
I was mainly responding to harllee who was asking whether that meant herd immunity.
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So I see - thanks.
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Enough private pension and SS income to cover all needs
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08-25-2021, 10:04 AM
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#119
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: West of the Mississippi
Posts: 17,173
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Some news on the J&J shot as a booster. A decision on this seems to be getting close.
https://www.jnj.com/johnson-johnson-...vid-19-vaccine
Quote:
New interim data from these studies demonstrate that a booster dose of the Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 vaccine generated a rapid and robust increase in spike-binding antibodies, nine-fold higher than 28 days after the primary single-dose vaccination. Significant increases in binding antibody responses were observed in participants between ages 18 and 55, and in those 65 years and older who received a lower booster dose. The study summaries were submitted to medRxiv on August 24.
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__________________
Comparison is the thief of joy
The worst decisions are usually made in times of anger and impatience.
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