Spreads so easily......

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JoeWras said:
Time's up. Let's get back to N95s. I'd rather have people incompetently wear N95s than incompetently wear cloth. The N95s I had on hand are pretty hard to wear and expose your nose. They are almost impossible to wear as chin diapers. Admittedly, they are easy to wear in a way that your cheeks are not properly contacted. It is easy to not properly fit the nose piece down over your nose, and even easier to forget to do it at all. Yes. This causes a bit of leakage. But all is not lost.
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Right, I have not seen a K/N-95 mask wearer in public with the mask slipping down their face, having to be constantly adjusted, or their nose uncovered, because the way they fit doesn’t allow that.
 
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Im gonna pile on and say i wear an n95 that has not been prof fitted or leak checked and I can almost guarantee you it STILL fits better and provides more protection than almost ANY fabric mask. Saying they are worthless without fit testing is ridiculous for folks using them for quick errands/med appts. Of course I won't work a shift in the covid ward with it. But don't scare folks away from them. They come with instructions and diagrams explaining fit, donning doffing etc
Chuckanut said:
IMHO, the advice to wear an N95 is good advice. But, it also shows what was wrong and is still wrong with our public approach to corona virus protection information. The problem is the lack of easy to understand facts and procedures on how to do things right. N95 Masks are a great example.

We The Public mostly have no idea how to fit a mask and what a good fit is for a N95 mask. We don't know what makes a good fit and how to get a good fit.

I know several hospital employed people who have been fitted for N95 masks. A trained nurse or technician watches them attach the mask, and shows them how to properly adjust and tighten the straps (if that is possible). She then checks for leaks. If there is a leak, they try more adjustments, and maybe they try another brand of mask. I know this is not practical for all of us but at least offer something more than "Everybody should wear a properly fitted N95 mask". That's like PSAs telling us how safe, effective and necessary the vaccine is, but not providing a reasonable way for people to get the vaccine.
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Prestige Ameritech is a large mask manufacturer based in Texas. They have been in business for a while and were being squeezed by Chinese mask manufacturers. In the early days of the pandemic they offered to manufacture N95 masks. The N95 mask shortage was self inflicted.

"It was Jan. 22, a day after the first case of covid-19 was detected in the United States, and orders were pouring into Michael Bowen’s company outside Fort Worth, some from as far away as Hong Kong.

Bowen’s medical supply company, Prestige Ameritech, could ramp up production to make an additional 1.7 million N95 masks a week. He viewed the shrinking domestic production of medical masks as a national security issue, though, and he wanted to give the federal government first dibs."



https://www.washingtonpost.com/inve...6a821e-908a-11ea-a9c0-73b93422d691_story.html
 
audreyh1 said:
Right, I have not seen a K/N-95 mask wearer in public with the mask slipping down their face, having to be constantly adjusted, or their nose uncovered, because the way they fit doesn’t allow that.
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I'd bet it has more to do with the fact that a person who searches out N95 or K95 masks are likely to be more serious about mask wearing. If they couldn't get their hands on an N95 I bet they'd wear a cheaper mask the right way also.
 
MrsHaloFIRE said:
Im gonna pile on and say i wear an n95 that has not been prof fitted or leak checked and I can almost guarantee you it STILL fits better and provides more protection than almost ANY fabric mask. Saying they are worthless without fit testing is ridiculous for folks using them for quick errands/med appts. Of course I won't work a shift in the covid ward with it. But don't scare folks away from them. They come with instructions and diagrams explaining fit, donning doffing etc
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+1
 
garyt said:
I'd bet it has more to do with the fact that a person who searches out N95 or K95 masks are likely to be more serious about mask wearing. If they couldn't get their hands on an N95 I bet they'd wear a cheaper mask the right way also.
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I'm going to disagree here. It's OK, we can still be friends. :flowers:

The N95s are stiff and cup shaped. If you expose the nose, you are kind of looking at the cup, and it wants to dig into your lip. It is not comfortable. If you try to wear it as a chin diaper, it digs into your adam's apple (at least for a guy). Not comfortable.

This stiffness is also the downside and where all the professional fitting lessons come into play. Once on the face, you have to properly shape it over the bridge of your nose. This is all in the instructions that come with every certified N95.
 
The 3m n95s i have a definitely firm cup shaped and they have nice thick sides that lay flat against the face.

The swiss made one i ordered after reading about on this forum are more what I would call (and forgive me I cant describe the shape better than this) c*nt shaped. Its a rounded shape but also has a fold to it so they will fold down flat and they remind me of the military old school envelope/garrison/c*nt caps. I do apologize for the vocabulary, please teach me a better word for the shape.
 
retire-early said:
The one I have from a few years ago which I bought from Home Depot is definitely cup shaped and with a vent.

The ones I bought from Primis Medical which are branded PHG also made in USA are not cup shaped
https://primismedical.com/products/...e-health-gear-usa-made?variant=32741972967503

.
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Cool. Seen some of those and wondered what they were. Do you think the odd shape would dissuade nose bypass or chin diapering? My gut feel is it would, but not having worn one, I dunno.
 
from the article: "California scientists have discovered a homegrown coronavirus strain that appears to be propagating faster than any other variant on the loose in the Golden State.

California scientists have discovered a homegrown coronavirus strain that appears to be propagating faster than any other variant on the loose in the Golden State....

...“There was a homegrown variant under our noses,” said Dr. Charles Chiu, a laboratory medicine specialist at UC San Francisco who examined the samples from the northern part of the state with collaborators from the California Department of Public Health. Were they not on the hunt for the U.K. strain and other viral variants, he said, “we could have missed this at every level.”.....

..To clarify B.1.426’s role in the surge, investigators will need to determine just how much devastation it is capable of producing. That inquiry will focus on its transmissibility as well as its ability to circumvent the tools — including masks, drugs and vaccines — that can be used to bring the pandemic under control.

For now, both sets of researchers doubt they have found a lone actor. But they may have caught an accomplice."

https://www.latimes.com/science/sto...strain-homegrown&utm_id=22300&sfmc_id=2422978

So with these variants popping up everywhere, I think I might start double masking like the big shots on TV do. That is, I would put a cloth mask over a KN95.

From the article "Almost since the beginning of the pandemic, experts have told the public about the importance of three things: washing your hands, maintaining a social or physical distance of at least six feet and wearing a mask.

Now, researchers say that doubling up on the last step is key as COVID-19 cases and deaths surge in Georgia and around the nation.

“It has been backed up by research that two masks are, in fact, better than one,” CBS Denver’s medical director Dr. Dave Hnida told CBSN Denver. “Specifically what we’re saying is that two masks may actually equal the protection you would get from N-95 masks, which is considered the best mask there is short of a complete respirator-type unit.”


https://www.ajc.com/life/if-you-hav...FMNxu5i_MMdr-YKbKohs2RvEfwPOvRC8Ys5qWhhlBFlek
 
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The 3M Aura N95 masks we are using are folded in three sections and cover most of your face and seal very well. The Optrel Masks are wedge shaped (better choice of words) and a bit easier to use. When I flew to Florida from LAX a few months ago I used the 3M Aura mask and it's not that pleasant to wear continuously for about eight hours straight from airport to airport. However, they do provide a degree of protection when flying with people coughing in the aircraft cabin.
 

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garyt said:
I'd bet it has more to do with the fact that a person who searches out N95 or K95 masks are likely to be more serious about mask wearing. If they couldn't get their hands on an N95 I bet they'd wear a cheaper mask the right way also.
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You really can’t wear one under your nose comfortably.
 
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JoeWras said:
Cool. Seen some of those and wondered what they were. Do you think the odd shape would dissuade nose bypass or chin diapering? My gut feel is it would, but not having worn one, I dunno.
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The PHG brand N95 do not have the ear loops so chin diapering is not easy to do although still doable. :)

MASK_EXPLODED_VIEW_copy_900x.jpg


While of different brand, the concept of how they should be worn is shown below.
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N95-green-1.jpg


N95-green-2.jpg
 
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I salute the idea of finding the best masks and wearing them properly.

But I have to say that the proliferation of cases amid widespread masking suggests one of two things:

1. Masks not as effective as believed or
2. People are over-relying on masks and getting too close to people

I continue to believe that maintaining distance at all times is critical to remaining healthy.
 
Montecfo said:
I salute the idea of finding the best masks and wearing them properly.

But I have to say that the proliferation of cases amid widespread masking suggests one of two things:

1. Masks not as effective as believed or
2. People are over-relying on masks and getting too close to people

I continue to believe that maintaining distance at all times is critical to remaining healthy.
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+1 on avoiding people.
Cloth Masks were only about 60% effective anyway, which is better than not wearing one. And with the more contagious variants popping up, that might go down? That could be why double masking and the KF94 are getting a lot of press.
 
MrsHaloFIRE said:
Im gonna pile on and say i wear an n95 that has not been prof fitted or leak checked and I can almost guarantee you it STILL fits better and provides more protection than almost ANY fabric mask. Saying they are worthless without fit testing is ridiculous for folks using them for quick errands/med appts. Of course I won't work a shift in the covid ward with it. But don't scare folks away from them. They come with instructions and diagrams explaining fit, donning doffing etc
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Pile on! That's what these forums are for. Vigorous discussion of all the angles.

I will add that the 'properly fitted' part was taken from the advice I have heard from several 'experts' who appear on various news shows. However, I do agree that a so-so N95 is better than the cheapo fake medical masks I first bought last year. Never let the perfect become the enemy of the good.
 
Freedom56 said:
Prestige Ameritech is a large mask manufacturer based in Texas. They have been in business for a while and were being squeezed by Chinese mask manufacturers. In the early days of the pandemic they offered to manufacture N95 masks. The N95 mask shortage was self inflicted.

"It was Jan. 22, a day after the first case of covid-19 was detected in the United States, and orders were pouring into Michael Bowen’s company outside Fort Worth, some from as far away as Hong Kong.

Bowen’s medical supply company, Prestige Ameritech, could ramp up production to make an additional 1.7 million N95 masks a week. He viewed the shrinking domestic production of medical masks as a national security issue, though, and he wanted to give the federal government first dibs."



https://www.washingtonpost.com/inve...6a821e-908a-11ea-a9c0-73b93422d691_story.html
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Interesting. Looks like he was only interested in a govt. contract. With a shortage of high quality masks, one would think he could have ramped up production, and made a fortune in the open market.

Maybe he did. The article was published in May.
 
Montecfo said:
2. People are over-relying on masks and getting too close to people
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I was in Kohl's last week.
And for some reason there was a slowup at the cash register.
We tried waiting a bit to the side hoping that the one line would dwindle in number, but more people got in line.
We walked out.
Being withing a shopping cart of someone makes me nervous.

.
 
Montecfo said:
I salute the idea of finding the best masks and wearing them properly.

But I have to say that the proliferation of cases amid widespread masking suggests one of two things:

1. Masks not as effective as believed or
2. People are over-relying on masks and getting too close to people

I continue to believe that maintaining distance at all times is critical to remaining healthy.
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Or:
3. People are not wearing their masks correctly or
4. People are lying. They say they wear a mask all the time when out but this is just not so.

I agee that maintaining distance AND wearing a mask correctly is the best thing to do --but sometimes that is just not possible. Sometimes you just have to go to a doctor's appointment or to the dentist or to the post office or to fill up your car with gas or to a job and sometimes you just cannot social distance at those places.
 
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harllee said:
Or:
3. People are not wearing their masks correctly or
4. People are lying. They say they wear a mask all the time when out but this is just not so.

I agee that maintaining distance AND wearing a mask correctly is the best thing to do --but sometimes that is just not possible. Sometimes you just have to go to a doctor's appointment or to the dentist or to the post office or to fill up your car with gas or to a job and sometimes you just cannot social distance at those places.
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Number 3 is just repeating #1. You can't eliminate human factors from mass wearing really.

I don't think number four really comes into play, as my observation is that overwhelmingly people are wearing masks indoors. The reason for that is because of business requirements primarily.I think unmasked people are rare enough that most people are able to avoid them.

But it comes back to my original point which is distancing is key, whether you are masked or not. If someone is not wearing a mask, you can't force them to put on a mask. But you can keep yourself safe by staying at distance.
 
harllee said:
Or:
3. People are not wearing their masks correctly
4. People are lying. They say they wear a mask all the time when out but this is just not so.

I agee that maintaining distance AND wearing a mask correctly is the best thing to do --but sometimes that is just not possible. Sometimes you just have to go to a doctor's appointment or to the dentist or to the post office or to fill up your car with gas or to a job and sometimes you just cannot social distance at those places.
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People always lie, to themselves as much as to others. For example, based on telephone conversations with family, they'll say they're social distancing and masking, but then they tell me about the places they've gone and the gatherings they hosted for Thanksgiving and New Years. From one side of the family "Oh, its just the people who belong here - you know, the adult grandsons and their girlfriends (none of whom actually live in that house)." From the other "Oh, Just my son, DIL, grandson and my husband's parents." (again, all people who don't live in the house). And in both of those cases, the hostesses were cancer survivors with compromised immune systems. Everyone has an exemption from the rules because they're so special. Sometimes they drive me crazy with their magical thinking and lack of self discipline.
 
Montecfo said:
Number 3 is just repeating #1. You can't eliminate human factors from mass wearing really.

I don't think number four really comes into play, as my observation is that overwhelmingly people are wearing masks indoors. The reason for that is because of business requirements primarily.I think unmasked people are rare enough that most people are able to avoid them.

But it comes back to my original point which is distancing is key, whether you are masked or not. If someone is not wearing a mask, you can't force them to put on a mask. But you can keep yourself safe by staying at distance.
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There are large areas in rural North Carolina where hardly anyone is wearing a mask.
 
To stay safe you have to assume everyone has it. If you make that assumption you will distance.
 
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