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-   -   Annuities Investigation on Dateline this Sunday (https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f28/annuities-investigation-on-dateline-this-sunday-34768.html)

WanderALot 04-11-2008 03:34 PM

Annuities Investigation on Dateline this Sunday
 
It's up on their website:

Investigation uses hidden cameras -- and Aunt Alice - Inside Dateline - msnbc.com

mickeyd 04-13-2008 06:23 PM

They mentioned Financial Playbook magazine in the piece. Here is their web site making mention of the "magazine"~Financial Playbook Magazine - Home

Pretty good expose of EIAs and all of the tricks that they include, including a 16% commission for that scumbag, sonofabitch, sleazebag, douchebag, guy agent representing Allianz Insurance in the yellow, then red, shirt. I almost thought that they would arrest the agent like they do outside the house on "To catch a Predator".


Quote:

We recently have discovered that Chris Hansen from Dateline NBC has attempted to create his own unique publication through us, posing as a financial professional. Our team caught on to this and promptly canceled his order, refunding Dateline's money 100%. We have NOT shipped any product to him, so what you may have seen on Dateline is actually just a mock-up proof of an order that was never completed, nor paid for (they won't ever mention this to you because it doesn't help their ratings). It is apparent that Dateline's purpose of an upcoming episode is to smear our good name just as they would like to smear the good names of our clients.

73ss454 04-13-2008 06:52 PM

ArtG should be along tomorrow to tell us what wonderful folks these salespeople are.

I think selling annuities must be easy because there's even people on this forum that want to buy them.

Maybe I'll do it part time. NOT!

REWahoo 04-13-2008 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 73ss454 (Post 642815)
ArtG should be along tomorrow to tell us what wonderful folks these salespeople are.

I saw the TV program. From what I saw the sales guys were just well meaning folks who were terribly misunderstood. As each carefully pointed out, Dateline didn't allow them to complete their sales pitch. Before being interrupted they were going to fully explain the details of how the annuity worked, including the fees, 16% surrender penalty, etc. :)

aaronc879 04-13-2008 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mickeyd (Post 642793)
They mentioned Financial Playbook magazine in the piece. Here is their web site making mention of the "magazine"~Financial Playbook Magazine - Home

Pretty good expose of EIAs and all of the tricks that they include, including a 16% commission for that scumbag, sonofabitch, sleazebag, douchebag, guy agent representing Allianz Insurance in the yellow, then red, shirt. I almost thought that they would arrest the agent like they do outside the house on "To catch a Predator".

Arrest them for what. They did nothing wrong. Seems like a non-story to me.

saluki9 04-13-2008 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 73ss454 (Post 642815)
ArtG should be along tomorrow to tell us what wonderful folks these salespeople are.

I think selling annuities must be easy because there's even people on this forum that want to buy them.

\!

Perhaps it's because not all of them are bad? I know it might be hard for you to imagine but for many people there are annuity products that make sense.

FinanceDude 04-13-2008 08:21 PM

I don't know where to begin...........:( All I can say is that an EIA makes a VA look good by comparison...........:)

FinanceDude 04-13-2008 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 73ss454 (Post 642815)
ArtG should be along tomorrow to tell us what wonderful folks these salespeople are.

I think selling annuities must be easy because there's even people on this forum that want to buy them.

Maybe I'll do it part time. NOT!

Interesting that guys like Art G and I have VILLIFIED EIAs but noone seems to notice........:rolleyes::rolleyes::D:D

73ss454 04-13-2008 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FinanceDude (Post 642847)
Interesting that guys like Art G and I have VILLIFIED EIAs but noone seems to notice........:rolleyes::rolleyes::D:D

Good work, it's a start. ;D

Texas Proud 04-13-2008 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FinanceDude (Post 642847)
Interesting that guys like Art G and I have VILLIFIED EIAs but noone seems to notice........:rolleyes::rolleyes::D:D

EIAs are killers.... and anybody who would sell some 70 yo an investment product that would tie up your money for 16 years SHOULD be arrested...

Now... they actually DID have a guy on the show who said HE would not recommend this product at all... and they did point out that there were many reputable sales people...

But the one guy had a huge 3 ring binder of all his 'certificates'... certified senior adviser, certified IRA distribution adviser... etc. etc. etc... made me sick...

clifp 04-14-2008 12:41 AM

My next career goal was to become a marketing executive for a tobacco company, but now I am thinking that annuity salesman, maybe a better way of expressing my evil Catbert side.

mathjak107 04-14-2008 03:41 AM

please dont tell my mom im an annuity salesman,,,,, she thinks im a piano player in a whorehouse

Dawg52 04-14-2008 06:47 AM

I missed the show.:( Usually Dateline runs it again on msnbc. Anyone know when this might be?

Gworker 04-14-2008 07:50 AM

I got bored with the show quickly.

It basically showed insurance salesman looking like the stereotypical used car salesman. It does seem that the industry needs a little bit of regulation. I doubt that would ever happen though.

REWahoo 04-14-2008 08:00 AM

I hear Dateline NBC has a blockbuster expose in the works, tentatively titled "To Catch an Annuity Predator". They plan to lure internet child sexual predators who work as insurance salesmen and catch them in the nude, attempting to sell an EIA to a 10 year old.

EDIT to add disclaimer: FinanceDude is NOT acting as a consultant in the filming of this expose.

73ss454 04-14-2008 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dawg52 (Post 642948)
I missed the show.:( Usually Dateline runs it again on msnbc. Anyone know when this might be?


Try MSNBC.COM, they may have a video or you can read the story.

brewer12345 04-14-2008 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 73ss454 (Post 642815)
I think selling annuities must be easy because there's even people on this forum that want to buy them.

Maybe I'll do it part time. NOT!

Hey, you weren't using that soul, anyway.

>:D

kombat 04-14-2008 08:41 AM

So let me get this straight. These salesmen are using fear to sell a product, while focusing on the positive aspects and downplaying the negatives?

Uhm..... so what?

How is this any different from any other salesman? Does a new car salesman ask me if I really need a new car, or if I should maybe stick with the one I already have for a few more years? Does a clothing salesman tell me my current t-shirt looks fine, and I probably don't really need that $200 Armani shirt I'm looking at?

In the end, the salesmen did all divulge the information. Both verbally, and in the brochures. Anyone would would hand over hundreds of thousands of dollars without doing at least a little reading is ... well, just how far are we supposed to go to protect people from themselves?

This seems like a real non-story to me. The entire theme of the article was "Your money is locked in for years. That's bad." So what? That's what an annuity is. They also hand it over to you over a period of several years, giving you a guaranteed income stream. Some people are willing to pay a little extra for that kind of piece of mind.

If you're worried you might need access to a large lump-sum for some reason down the road, then why would you put your entire nest egg into a locked-in investment like this? Why wouldn't you keep some set aside for big, one-time expenses?

I found it an extremely poorly-balanced article.

maddythebeagle 04-14-2008 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by REWahoo (Post 642960)
I hear Dateline NBC has a blockbuster expose in the works, tentatively titled "To Catch an Annuity Predator". They plan to lure internet child sexual predators who work as insurance salesmen and catch them in the nude, attempting to sell an EIA to a 10 year old.

EDIT to add disclaimer: FinanceDude is NOT acting as a consultant in the filming of this expose.

I hear that they both bring wine and condoms:p That might be enough to bring Stoned Phillips out of FIRE...:angel:

JustCurious 04-14-2008 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kombat (Post 642982)
In the end, the salesmen did all divulge the information. Both verbally, and in the brochures. Anyone would would hand over hundreds of thousands of dollars without doing at least a little reading is ... well, just how far are we supposed to go to protect people from themselves?

This seems like a real non-story to me. The entire theme of the article was "Your money is locked in for years. That's bad." So what? That's what an annuity is. They also hand it over to you over a period of several years, giving you a guaranteed income stream. Some people are willing to pay a little extra for that kind of piece of mind.

If you're worried you might need access to a large lump-sum for some reason down the road, then why would you put your entire nest egg into a locked-in investment like this? Why wouldn't you keep some set aside for big, one-time expenses?

Kombat, it's not about protecting people from themselves, it's about protecting vulnerable people from over-reaching and unethical salespeople who will go as far as the law allows them (and sometimes farther) to rip people off.

Consider this....what if a salesperson sold a variable annunity to a senior citizen that had a 50% surrender charge in the first year, would you say that was ok, so long as the surrender charge was printed somewhere on the document? What if it was 90%? Is there some point at which you would say the terms are just plain overreaching and wrong, regardless if it is disclosed? If your answer is no, then we simply disagree as a matter of public policy. If your answer is yes, then we agree that there should be some regulation to protect the more vulnerable and less sophisticated members of our society.


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