Early Retirement & Financial Independence Community

Early Retirement & Financial Independence Community (https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/)
-   FIRE and Money (https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f28/)
-   -   Why you might want to disinherit your kids (https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f28/why-you-might-want-to-disinherit-your-kids-87616.html)

NW-Bound 07-20-2017 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redduck (Post 1912433)
Unlike my good friend NW-Bound, my adult kids do know how much money I have. However, I'm not sure it was a wise decision to let them know. They always seem disappointed when I answer the telephone in the morning. I guess that's OK. It's not like I haven't disappointed them before. Yet, somehow this feels different...

One of these days, I will tell them. I think your adult children are older than mine.

Anyway, I encouraged them to save so they can retire early like I did and do not have to work till they die. I asked them how much they thought our lifestyle cost, which was not extravagant, but we could buy what we needed or wanted without consternation, had plenty of travel and gift/charity donation, etc...

Their guess came out to be significantly less than we actually spent, and we told them. I once told them that the SWR should be around 3.5%. I don't know if they remember the details to put 2 and 2 together to deduce what we have. However, I also told them that the market might tank, and I might lose a lot. :)

NW-Bound 07-20-2017 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blueskies123 (Post 1912434)
... A lot more good would be done by donating the money to a worthy charity.

Ah, the keyword is "worthy".

I am not religious, and do not tithe. However, I make significant donations to charity organizations that I have personal knowledge of, and can vet.

aja8888 07-20-2017 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redduck (Post 1912433)
Unlike my good friend NW-Bound, my adult kids do know how much money I have. However, I'm not sure it was a wise decision to let them know. They always seem disappointed when I answer the telephone in the morning. I guess that's OK. It's not like I haven't disappointed them before. Yet, somehow this feels different...

Have you received any invites to go on a "duck hunting" trip with them recently? :laugh:

Blue Collar Guy 07-20-2017 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redduck (Post 1912433)
. They always seem disappointed when I answer the telephone in the morning. I guess that's OK. It's not like I haven't disappointed them before. Yet, somehow this feels different...

Hahahahahahah

kcowan 07-21-2017 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blue Collar Guy (Post 1912338)
Maybe he is the victim of foul play?

No he was found by a skip-tracer when MIL died. We had a few good years with him before he died. He was a trans and died from kidney failure partly due to the meds he was given to "fix" him.

Blue Collar Guy 07-21-2017 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kcowan (Post 1912793)
No he was found by a skip-tracer when MIL died. We had a few good years with him before he died. He was a trans and died from kidney failure partly due to the meds he was given to "fix" him.

OK, glad you had a few good years before he passed.

redduck 07-21-2017 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kcowan (Post 1912181)
What do you posters think about kids that reject their parents. BIL left home in 1990 and never had any contact with his parents after leaving. No cards, no calls, no forwarding addresses.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kcowan (Post 1912793)
No he was found by a skip-tracer when MIL died. We had a few good years with him before he died. He was a trans and died from kidney failure partly due to the meds he was given to "fix" him.

Why did he break contact with his parents? Sounds a bit more complicated than the BIL simply severing (perhaps a poor choice of words) contact with the parents. Maybe there were some very valid reasons for his behavior.

SpinDr 07-22-2017 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redduck (Post 1912433)
Unlike my good friend NW-Bound, my adult kids do know how much money I have. However, I'm not sure it was a wise decision to let them know. They always seem disappointed when I answer the telephone in the morning. I guess that's OK. It's not like I haven't disappointed them before. Yet, somehow this feels different...


:laugh::laugh::laugh:

kcowan 07-22-2017 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redduck (Post 1912915)
Maybe there were some very valid reasons for his behavior.

Yes his mother had no time for "unnatural" behaviour. That lack of sympathy was a contributor to his leaving.

Blue Collar Guy 07-22-2017 10:19 AM

I know a reason to disinherit children or unequal splits. Say you have 5 kids. A doctor making millions, a garbage man making 60k a year, a nurse making 85k, a Priest who took the vow of poverty, and a career criminal spending most of his time in prison for violent crimes, pick any you like, rape, murder, robbery. My prison guy gets less than the rest. Is he insulted? Do I need to sit down and explain this? No, Im not. Everyone doesnt get a trophy in my world. Extreme example? Maybe, but arent most families very complicated.

Ben808 07-25-2017 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Music Lover (Post 1910725)
There is a big difference between thinking you are entitled to your parent's money compared to thinking that it is unfair if one child is being rewarded for their life of poor decisions. It has nothing to with being "owed" money...it's about fairness.

I agree with this. I also think it also plays out at a macro level wrt how the "successful" people are saddled with higher taxes and reduced benefits (means tests) to pay for entitlements for the less successful, some of whom are in their circumstances for genuine reasons beyond their control but I'm pretty sure there is a substantial proportion who are gaming the system.

MarieIG 07-25-2017 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben808 (Post 1914496)
I agree with this. I also think it also plays out at a macro level wrt how the "successful" people are saddled with higher taxes and reduced benefits (means tests) to pay for entitlements for the less successful, some of whom are in their circumstances for genuine reasons beyond their control but I'm pretty sure there is a substantial proportion who are gaming the system.

Yes, agree with both.

Ben808 07-25-2017 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bamaman (Post 1911077)
We feel about the same way about our 29 year old bipolar daughter. .

Bamaman--very sorry to hear about your daughter. You are absolutely doing the right thing. I know from personal experience that if you don't put your foot down things will continue to go south until there's nothing left.

Case in point is my brother in law. He was the favorite son. In laws handed him the thriving family business out of school and bought him a fancy house in the same prestigious gated community in which they lived. Flash forward 25 years and everything is gone. All pissed away due to gambling debts. In laws remortgaged their home numerous times to bail him out. In the end there was just under $1M balance. BIL was always borrowing money from us, always claiming some business related misfortune. After MIL passed away, it all came to a head and FIL had to sell the house to pay off debts. He eventually moved in with us to get away from BIL. Very sad and wasteful. Meanwhile my wife (only other child) got next to nothing since inlaws house was supposed to go to her.

samclem 07-25-2017 09:26 PM

I suppose if a parent were also an economist, he might seek to split the inheritance among his kids so as to maximize the net happiness.
-- Leaving any money at all to an addict, etc is likely to decrease that child's happiness in the long term, and will certainly not increase the happiness of the other children, so that is out.
-- A child who has a low net worth is likely to get more utility (and happiness) from each dollar received than a child who has a high net worth, all other things being equal. The rich child might enjoy the $1000 ermine seatcover for his Lamborghini purchased with Dad's gift, but it's very likely that more net happiness is purchased if the poorer daughter uses the same $1000 to keep the heat on through a couple of winters. The counterargument is that stepping in to "subsidize underperformance" just encourages more of the same. But as far as extending this whole argument to government social programs, I'd offer:
1) Parents are probably better at making judgements as to the reason a child has "done well" or not. Governments seldom even try.
2) With an inheritance, the money is the personal property of the decedent, and they have complete discretion as to what to do with it. The money was not taken from one group to be given to another, no person or group who doesn't get the money is made objectively worse off than they otherwise would have been.
-- What if the unequal gifting itself results in unhappiness-- If the rich son with the Lamborghini resents the fact that Dad gave more money to his poorer sis than he got, and this resentment decreases his own happiness? That's a possibility. Maybe our economist decedent applies a weighting factor: unhappiness resulting from envy or a misplaced sense of entitlement counts less. After all, Mr Moneybags could have chosen to be happy that his sis now had enough wintertime heat, instead of fixating on the fact that he didn't get an even share of the loot.

kombat 07-26-2017 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haha (Post 1911020)
Until very recently, normal people recognized inter-generational duties.

What "inter-generational duties?" I would submit that parents have automatic obligations to their children, but children don't automatically owe anything to their parents.

Parents choose to have kids. The kids didn't choose to be born.

Now, through their virtuous actions, parents can culture a positive relationship between them and their children, forging a bond that evokes a desire for their children to support their parents, but I disagree that the children are born already burdened with that obligation. Parents have to earn it.

kombat 07-26-2017 06:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Music Lover (Post 1912316)
I think you're seeing something that isn't there. No one has said that you have to leave your kids money to prove that you love them, but several have said that leaving unequal amounts without explanation can be taken the wrong way

+1

I think some people in this thread might be projecting a little bit. If my parents spent down their entire estate, or left it all to a charity, or burned it on the beach, I wouldn't care a whit. But if they left more to a sibling than me, or left me more than a sibling, I can easily see how that could provoke hurt feelings.

If they leave more to a sibling who's not as well off financially, could that be interpreted as "punishing" me for making better choices or choosing a better career or working harder or living more frugally?

It's not about how much money they leave, or what they do with their own money while they have it - it's about playing favorites with kids they spent a lifetime professing to all love equally.

kombat 07-26-2017 06:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpeirce (Post 1912328)
>Isn't honoring your parents one of the big 10?

According to the dusty old rule book of just one of the world's 1,000's of religions? I suppose it might be, I haven't seen them in a while.

A quote I saw recently online, "You don't need religion to have morals. If you can't determine right from wrong then you lack empathy, not religion."

Danmar 07-26-2017 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kombat (Post 1914592)
What "inter-generational duties?" I would submit that parents have automatic obligations to their children, but children don't automatically owe anything to their parents.

Parents choose to have kids. The kids didn't choose to be born.

Now, through their virtuous actions, parents can culture a positive relationship between them and their children, forging a bond that evokes a desire for their children to support their parents, but I disagree that the children are born already burdened with that obligation. Parents have to earn it.

This is my view as well. I believe parents do indeed have some responsibilities to their kids but certainly not including leaving a legacy. A safe, nurturing, loving home until they are adults surely? Also, thanks for responding to the dubious comment re "one of the big ten".


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:27 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.