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-   -   Has the wealth effect changed your spending? (https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f28/has-the-wealth-effect-changed-your-spending-89626.html)

foxfirev5 12-04-2017 06:37 PM

No increase. The higher the market goes the more nervous I get.

audreyh1 12-04-2017 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintnational (Post 1974349)
From Wikipedia, "The wealth effect is the change in spending that accompanies a change in perceived wealth"

Has the rising stock market changed your spending? We have not altered our basic budget, but we set up a Donor Advised Fund for charitable giving and will gift the DS and DD money for their Roth IRAs. Okay, I also bought a few nice bottles of wine and the whole Serrano ham mentioned in the Costco thread. :angel:

How about you?

Yes, because we take a set % of our portfolio every year, our income has grown in a big way the last few years. We don't spend all of it, but we are definitely spending and gifting more than we used to.

W2R 12-04-2017 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintnational (Post 1974428)
You have your dream home. Will this be your dream car? I bought my dream car when I was 45. Something about a midlife crisis or who knows what? But we still have it 12 years later. So, it has turned out to be cost effective transportation, almost LBYM style. :greetings10:

I don't really have a dream car right now; just haven't "fallen in love" with one lately. Maybe I should search online more while I am waiting for things to coalesce. So far, my thinking has not gone beyond the idea that something shiny and new would be fun. :laugh:

I had a model in mind, but Consumer Reports said that it had good, not great, reliability. :(

hesperus 12-04-2017 06:46 PM

Almost, maybe...? We reached eight figures NW recently, and the only thing I can say is that we are feeling somewhat flush, with a bit less attention paid to previous spending inhibitions. Still holding about 3+ years of spending in cash, so that helps buffer the worry about near term corrections in the market.

Ask me again when we go through a 25% correction :laugh:

RobbieB 12-04-2017 06:49 PM

I am spending more dough now than I've ever spent before. And loving it - :)

Porches, decks, concrete, hot tubs, diamonds for my lady.

And I haven't even started on the inside of the house. That ought to be 3X the cost of the outside.

jollystomper 12-04-2017 06:50 PM

Our spending has gone up primarily because we are happy with our "string of singles" market returns and do not feel the need to increase our investment amounts. For example, in the past when I received bonuses we would probably have fun with 10-20% of the amount and save/invest the rest. This year the bonus amounts surprisingly more than doubled from 2105, so we are having fun (spending and giving) with about a third of the amount and putting the rest into cash savings for more spending fun next year, without having to be dependent on near-term market returns.

W2R 12-04-2017 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobbieB (Post 1974438)
I am spending more dough now than I've ever spent before. And loving it - :)

Porches, decks, concrete, hot tubs, diamonds for my lady.

And I haven't even started on the inside of the house. That ought to be 3X the cost of the outside.

One of these days your house will be perfect and exactly what you always wanted. Then what? Oh well, you could always throw parties for 300 people serving that fabulous king crab you got a while back, and lots of expensive champagne.

NW-Bound 12-04-2017 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HFWR (Post 1974353)
The market giveth, the market taketh away...

It sure does, or did today. A 5-figure sum, equivalent to 3 months of living expenses, just got deducted from my Quicken total.

Quote:

Originally Posted by athena53 (Post 1974374)
Heck, no. Like most people here I've had years of negative returns. I kept my withdrawal rate at 3% this year so I don't have to cut back in bad years.

Some people have short memory. Not me. Don't I always brag about having a "superior memory"? I still remember 2008-2009 as yesterday. Even the tech melt-down in 2000-2001.

I have no "dream" anything, car, house, or vacation. If I can maintain the status quo, it's already plenty good for me. In order for me to spend significantly more, I need to see my stash doubled. Fat chance of that in the years ahead.

Freedom56 12-04-2017 07:01 PM

I live on fixed income investments. I own bonds and notes in S&P 500 companies (industrial, telecom, financial). I am content with a 7% annual return, although I have been doing much better than that over the last four years. I am more interested in preservation of capital. However, even though I'm in my 50's and my wife in her late 40's, we have calculated that with our spending habits, we will never draw down our funds. We are in the third year of our retirement, and we continue to save significant a significant amount of money. So we made the following changes that impact spending:

1- We do not fly coach traveling from coast to coast but I do look for deals on first/business class fares and will never pay full price. We highly recommend JetBlue Mint business class.

2- Overseas flights are exclusively on business or first class but I never pay full price and buy non-refundable business/first class fares.

- Traveling in comfort will mitigate back problems and in the end save medical bills. Plus you can't take your money with you so enjoy it.

3- No eating at dives at home or when on travel

- No reason to get sick and pay additional medical bills.

4- Won't shop at Walmart, Target, K-Mart, JC Penny, but Safeway, Publix, Costco and Home Depot are okay.

- Just kidding, I let my wife go to Walmart, Target, JC Penny

As far as "wealth effect", from June 2000 to now, the vast majority of stocks have under-performed cash stuffed in a mattress. The Dow Jones 30 back in 2000 are the the same as today. Remember the "blue chip" Dow components Eastman Kodak or Sears. Where are they now? Financial and technology stocks look good over the last few years but just go back 9 years and see why the term "Zombie Banks" applies to many financial stocks. Citibank is a $75 stock after a 10 for 1 reverse split and has to go up to $680 for people to break even after 10 years. Intel was a $74 dollar stock in 2000 and its $44 today. GE was a $48 stock and its is $17 and change today. This is after 17 1/2 years. Other have fared much worse.

I will say that the vast majority of our wealth was created slowly through real estate investments, fixed income investments, living 100% debt free, and disciplined spending habits. I don't own common stocks, mutual funds, or ETFs.

flintnational 12-04-2017 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hesperus (Post 1974436)
Almost, maybe...? We reached eight figures NW recently

If you didn't start spending, all the young dreamers would leave the forum. It's your duty. :)

Meadbh 12-04-2017 07:06 PM

No.

rodi 12-04-2017 07:08 PM

The gain this year has been beyond what I could have expected... And, yes, I feel wealthier, because I am.

That said, I can't expand my spending too much... or I run into issues with ACA tax credits and hurt my FAFSA EFC... Oldest son is a junior - so this year counts towards the FAFSA thing.

About half of our spending is covered by DH's SS, my micro pensions and rental income... the other half is withdrawn from the nest egg... We live pretty darn comfortable on a <3% withdrawal rate. Perhaps I'll bump it all the way up to 3% of our starting portfolio value.... heck, maybe I'll even figure out what the inflation adjustments should be, also... Either way I could give us a raise... But I don't see myself pulling out extra unless there is a need/want to justify it. I'm only a few years in and SOR risk is still on my brain.

W2R 12-04-2017 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NW-Bound (Post 1974443)
I have no "dream" anything, car, house, or vacation. If I can maintain the status quo, it's already plenty good for me. In order for me to spend significantly more, I need to see my stash doubled. Fat chance of that in the years ahead.

You never know what life may bring to you. It could happen. :)

USGrant1962 12-04-2017 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintnational (Post 1974349)
From Wikipedia, "The wealth effect is the change in spending that accompanies a change in perceived wealth"

Has the rising stock market changed your spending?

No but it has made me a lot more comfortable with my WR. When I decided to pull the plug last year I was over 100% in FIRECalc. Now I'm well over 100% ;D.

flintnational 12-04-2017 07:23 PM

Darn, this thread is being out paced by the Colonoscopy thread! I feel so inadequate. :rofl::rofl:

FIREd 12-04-2017 07:28 PM

Spending is still what it was in the mid 2000’s (not even adjusted for inflation). Net worth is up 15x since then. So no...

Car-Guy 12-04-2017 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintnational (Post 1974349)
Has the rising stock market changed your spending?

How about you?

Absolutely not. About a year after I retired, (five + years ago) I realized that we had more than enough. These days we just buy what we want, go where we want and do what we want regardless of what the market does. (no jets or yachts) The money I have in the market is strictly gambling money that I don't really expect I'll ever need.

NW-Bound 12-04-2017 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NW-Bound (Post 1974443)
... In order for me to spend significantly more, I need to see my stash doubled. Fat chance of that in the years ahead.

Quote:

Originally Posted by W2R (Post 1974452)
You never know what life may bring to you. It could happen. :)

I do not mind getting pleasantly surprised. But until that happens, I do not spend time thinking how I will up my spending.

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintnational (Post 1974459)
Darn, this thread is being out paced by the Colonoscopy thread! I feel so inadequate. :rofl::rofl:

See how geezers worry mostly about their health than about their money?

Health first, money second. I'd rather have good health and be living in an RV under the open sky of NM, than being bedridden with beaucoup money. Of course we want to have both, but have neither under our total control.

Nature Lover 12-04-2017 07:52 PM

I'm with the majority here. Only retired 2 years, now 57, so the recent gains are a good buffer against sequence of returns risk....but they haven't resulted in an increase in spending.

2017ish 12-04-2017 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by audreyh1 (Post 1974433)
Yes, because we take a set % of our portfolio every year ....

+1. But, we are only 5 months into retirement and our spending changes/increases were of the type and magnitude that we long planned. So take my response with an extra few grains of salt.


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