Car problems

[Scuba]

We retired 5.5 years ago and still have two cars. They’re both 2007’s and both needed major front end work earlier this year. Then my car needed a new alternator. Now DH’s car’s “check engine” light is on. Ugh.

Even though we could likely manage with one car, it would require less spontaneity and would be an inconvenience as it is not unusual for one of us to go somewhere without the other one. We decided we can afford the convenience and prefer to continue to be a 2-car family.

We will not consider an all electric car yet. Not willing to run out of power. Some friends who have a Tesla recently drove from So CA to Las Vegas. What is normally a 4-5 hour drive became an 8-9 hour drive when they couldn’t find an open charging station and then when they did finally get one, had to wait for their car to charge. No thanks. The infrastructure is just not there yet.

So our decisions are:
- Keep fixing our 2007 cars until the crazy inventory shortage of cars is resolved, or buy a new/newer car now and sell one of ours?
- If we buy a new or newer car, go with hybrid or gas powered? Most of the models we like are not offered as hybrids and the payout doesn’t seem to be there even with $6 gas. From an environmental perspective, I’m not convinced fossil fuels are worse than mining lithium for batteries.
- Normally we are “buy and hold” people with cars, but with the market shifting so much towards electric powered cars, maybe this is a good time to lease a vehicle for a few years and see what happens? If the infrastructure catches up and supply chain issues improve, the availability and pricing of vehicles will likely be better in time, especially if we go into a recession and people stop buying cars.

Thoughts anyone?

 

[Ian S]

I think it depends a lot on how much you drive. Fewer miles probably means the gas car may make more sense. We have not gone the all electric route because we need a vehicle that can get us 460 miles across a hot desert with one fast fillup. I don't think an electric car can do that yet. At this point, the speed of charging is a limitation. A hybrid would suffice but for us, there is little city driving so less advantage over gas powered vehicle. IMHO, $6 gas is not going to be a long term issue.

 

[W2R]

- Keep fixing our 2007 cars until the crazy inventory shortage of cars is resolved, or buy a new/newer car now and sell one of ours?

If it was me, I'd start looking for the new/newer car now. It might take some time to find one you like, given the shortage you mention.

- If we buy a new or newer car, go with hybrid or gas powered? Most of the models we like are not offered as hybrids and the payout doesn’t seem to be there even with $6 gas. From an environmental perspective, I’m not convinced fossil fuels are worse than mining lithium for batteries.

I agree with what you are saying. It sounds like you are leaning towards a gas powered car, and that seems sensible to me at this time.

- Normally we are “buy and hold” people with cars, but with the market shifting so much towards electric powered cars, maybe this is a good time to lease a vehicle for a few years and see what happens?

I have no idea on this one. I'd probably just buy it but I have never leased a car so I don't know the plusses and minuses of leasing.

 

[NW-Bound]

The difference in price between an EV and an ICE car means that you have to drive a lot for the EV to pay off, even at $6/gal. And I don't think the high price of gas will persist.

Since retiring, I don't drive as much as when I commuted 50 miles round trip to work. And when I drive a long distance, it's for a road trip and I don't want the hassle of charging. EVs make more sense for commuting workers.

People may want an EV for other reasons. To me, an EV or ICE is just transportation, and I prefer the less expensive solution.

Someday, I will get an EV if I live long enough.

 

[NomDeER]

I was planning on buying a new car this year. Supply issues and prices convinced me otherwise. So, I just put a fair amount of money into repairs for my old car and probably won't buy a new car now for a couple of years now.

The guy at Honda told me last month that they had no new cars on the lot right now and were selling for delivery at the end of the summer but wasn't sure they would get the cars then. I doubt they had cars for lease either. They can't even get enough used cars. They wanted to know if I was willing to sell mine, but then what would I do to replace it and have something to drive? The used car prices are very high right now if you can find a used car. I would guess that hybrids are more in demand than usual right now, so that might make your decision for you.

The dealership employee told me that he has over 350 k miles on his car but is holding out for a few years for a new one because Honda (and GM?) are coming out with electric cars in the next two or three years and they will be much more affordable than the electric vehicles available right now. So, I think we are going to see more electric cars and more infrastructure to go with it. It's just not clear when.

My friends are considering an electric vehicle for the spouse who has a long commute, but they will have a non-electric vehicle as well, which they will use for road trips, which they frequently take. Makes sense.

 

[Out of Steam]

The hybrid will pay off easily for someone who drives mostly in cities, potentially cutting fuel expenses by close to half. Savings evaporate almost completely at 75 mph or higher .

Though there are vehicles where the hybrid is simply the best and most reliable choice. Example, the standard engine on a Ford Escape is a 1.5 liter, 3 cylinder turbo. Too much car for the engine, I’ll pass. In that case, the hybrid, proven over 15 years, is a no-brainer.

 

[Scuba]

DH and I only put 3K-5K miles per year on each car. Most of our driving is just errands around town. We may eventually do more road trips, but we have prioritized international destinations for most vacations.

I researched more about whether now is a good time to lease cars and apparently it is a really bad time. With so little inventory, lease terms are far less attractive than they used to be.

 

[harllee]

My sister recently wanted a new Lexus SUV because someone ran into her old Lexus and did a bunch of damage. She searched all over the Southeastern U.S. and could not find one. She could have ordered one but it would be months to get it and no guarantee. So she just had the old one fixed (other guy's insurance paid). She is now driving a car with a salvage title but it looks and runs fine.

 

[arcyallen]

If you're not sure about having just one car, do the test run now: Drive just one car. Cars cost us more than we think they do (in many ways), and at a minimum it'd be educational.

As for buying an EV, I share your concerns but ask yourself how you generally drive and if it would be a good fit. Your friends trip didn't work out very well, but I'd ask myself "How often would I make trips like this?" and "Was their experience of not finding an open charger common?"

Whatever you do, just realize it's a great time to sell (any) car and a crummy time to buy one. Actually, you may even consider selling the first car now and then buying the second when things get a little more normal.

Oh, and think of leasing as renting. It's not a bad choice. But it's generally the opposite of what you've been doing, and will be much more expensive.

 

[Mr._Graybeard]

If your cars have less than 150k miles on them, I'd fix what you have. Assuming they aren't rusted out and they haven't been badly neglected/abused.

 

[harllee]

If your cars have less than 150k miles on them, I'd fix what you have. Assuming they aren't rusted out and they haven't been badly neglected/abused.

Agree.

 

[jollystomper]

I am in a simliar position, though we are looking at going back to a 3rd card (DW's car was totaled the end of last year). Next week I will be test driving a 2019 model year used car next week that seems reasonable, but is still selling at just $2K less than its original MSRP. My interactions so far are making me lean towards waiting a bit. Perhaps if we do go deep into a recession demand will lesson and prices will fall in 6 months, or maybe inflation will not be tamed by then and will still make it more expensive to purchase. We'll see.

 

[RetiredAndLovingIt]

At this point you don't even know what's wrong with his car, so hopefully it's something as simple as you didn't screw the gas cap on tightly or the gas cap is bad which is very common apparently.
Drive the car to to OReilly Auto Parts or any other parts store. They will scan for codes for free and you can research from there.
I mentioned OReilly because they did mine last year and it turned out to be the gas cap, a $13 fix.
Good luck and sorry to hear of more problems piling on when you're already dealing with your husbands illness.

 

[easysurfer]

My strategy is fix unless car needs new engine or transmission. If the latter, car was fun while it lasted but time to look for a successor .

 

[freedomatlast]

In my world, one car having an alternator replaced and another that has a check engine light on would not be reason alone to go into 'I need a new car' mode. At least get a scan done to see what code is causing the check engine light. Some auto parts stores will scan the code for free. Might be something easy and inexpensive to fix.

Personally, I've been waiting to buy a new car until it becomes a buyer's market instead of a seller's market, and the recession may be just the ticket to make that happen. It's just incredible that people are willing to pay close to original MSRP for two and three year old cars. Not me.

I'm also expecting the large trucks and SUVs everyone had to have for years now, will be selling cheap sooner than later as people get sick of spending the better part of $100 for a tank of gas....just like 2008 all over again.

 

[OldShooter]

The way I try to think about situations like this is to start by saying: The repairs to my car are $xxx and if I sell it, I'm going to get $yyy. Add those two numbers and ask: Knowing everything I know about this car, would it be a good deal for me to buy it at $xxx + $yyy? Would I buy it?

Lots of other moving parts, though. The biggest one is "Don't bother me with numbers; I want a new car." There also arguments made that newer cars have better safety features. Sure, but going forward and considering my historical accident frequency, what is the probability that I will have an accident where some specific new safety feature is critical to my health? I think that probability is near zero, so I discount the value of new safety features to near zero.

I think the second biggest moving part is this crazy car market. My old 2007 Nissan pickup is now showing enough rust that I would normally be getting rid of it out of embarrassment. But not this year. Maybe next year. Maybe the following year. My delay is simply because I can't stand the thought of this market ripping me off on a replacement. YMMV.

 

[Montecfo]

I think the common view of not doing repairs on a car that are a significant chunk of its value is the wrong analysis. The value of the car itself is not particularly relevant as you already own it. All cars depreciate and all need repairs. Older cars have less value to depreciate whereas a new car will depreciate rapidly eveb wirh zero repairs.

A better analysis in my view is what are my alternatives and their costs, including convenience?

I assume Scuba has done that analysis which brought her to this point. So what to do?

I too have been in the market and have decided to wait (but not facing big repair costs).

If I were looking to buy right now, I would look at sedans (much lower cost these days than SUVs) and a pretty basic vehicle that figures to be reliable. Then when market improves replace second car with SUV if desired or a nicer vehicle so you have some diversity.

Just some ideas.

 

[Car-Guy]

Types of cars?
Current total mileage?
Are you mechanically inclined?

 

[travelover]

If your cars have less than 150k miles on them, I'd fix what you have. Assuming they aren't rusted out and they haven't been badly neglected/abused.

My thought too. A check engine light could be as simple as a bad or loose gas cap and may well just be an oxygen sensor or cracked vacuum hose. I'd get the code read and the car diagnosed before making any major decision.

Right now is a terrible time to buy a car, especially given that you hardly drive and have two cars to cover any immediate need. Even longer term, given your low miles, I wouldn't spend a lot extra for a hybrid or electric vehicle as you'll never see the savings.

 

[Jeffman52]

I was sitting on the fence with replacing my 2002 F150 but its only got 148K miles on it... and with the prices of cars right now, I think I will just spend some money and fix the few issues this one has. I may also get it painted. The clear coat is starting to come off in areas.

 

[nico08]

I was sitting on the fence with replacing my 2002 F150 but its only got 148K miles on it... and with the prices of cars right now, I think I will just spend some money and fix the few issues this one has. I may also get it painted. The clear coat is starting to come off in areas.

I was thinking about getting my 2007 Honda Accord v6 with about 185,000 miles painted too. The clear coat is has dulled in sections. I got multipe estimates. The lowest was about 1,900 and the highest was over 2,500. I decided to leave it alone, it seemed like too much money to put into the car for a paint job.

The check engine light has only come on twice in the 15 years I have owned it. Once it was due to bad gas, the other time the gas pedal acelerator sensor needed to be replaced. Neither was an expensive repair. I bought an inexpensive onboard diagnostic OBD II sensor and I can check for codes myself if the need arises. It is good to have one if you have an older model car.

I'm hoping the car will last a couple of more years, until prices for new and used car are more attractive for buyers.

 

[Walt34]

It's a tough decision for many. With so many moving parts to the choices there is no "one size fits all". We have a 2003 GMC 4WD pickup whose major use is hauling radio control model airplanes once or twice a week and if DW has the Honda I'll use it for a grocery run or something. It has 109k miles on it. If anything cheaper than a transmission breaks I'll get it fixed, and I'd think hard about the transmission too.

The Honda is a 2014 model with about the same miles on it, and the same applies as to repairs. We really hope we don't have to buy any vehicles soon. If it comes to pass that we need to replace one of them we'll just have to make the best choice we can with the information available then.

 

[CRLLS]

Agreed that a check engine light or alternator alone do not justify trading up. both are generally inexpensive fixes, especially for someone who is a DIYer. We recently purchased a new Hyundai Kona with all the bells and whistles. This one replaced a 10 year old Hyundai that was low mileage and pretty reliable. We decided we wanted AWD for winter driving and modern safety features as we age. It was sort of a mini-BTD decision. We didn't have to pay a "market adjustment" for it. We did get to pay sticker price though. We got a great deal on the trade in that made up for the usual of ~10% below sticker give or take.

I looked at Hybrids which would have been nice. Decided on conventional ICE technology.

In addition, I don't think the mass change to electric vehicles will be as fast as some predict. I can't imagine the impact of all the cars needing to be charged overnight. Today's electric generation and grid simply will not support them all. I don't see any appreciable upgrades to the electric grid. That aside, US drivers are used to long road trips, and are generally impatient. These things do not go well with EV's. Other countries will change over more rapidly I think.

 

[Scuba]

Types of cars?
Current total mileage?
Are you mechanically inclined?

2007 Lexus ES350 with 177K miles. Put in a new alternator last week, thought it was fixed and today it died and had to be towed in again. Waiting on diagnosis.

2007 Toyota Solara convertible with 129K miles. Check Engine light came on a few days ago so it’s been sitting in the garage and we’ve been using the Lexus until it died today. Taking it in on Monday for diagnosis.

Neither of us is able to fix cars. We are the original owners of both of these cars. They’ve been well maintained, garaged indoors, and had hoped to have them a few more years. However neither of us is willing to risk breaking down regularly on busy streets. It’s dangerous and inconvenient. We aren’t in college anymore.

 

[Scuba]

I think the common view of not doing repairs on a car that are a significant chunk of its value is the wrong analysis. The value of the car itself is not particularly relevant as you already own it. All cars depreciate and all need repairs. Older cars have less value to depreciate whereas a new car will depreciate rapidly eveb wirh zero repairs.

A better analysis in my view is what are my alternatives and their costs, including convenience?

I assume Scuba has done that analysis which brought her to this point. So what to do?

I too have been in the market and have decided to wait (but not facing big repair costs).

If I were looking to buy right now, I would look at sedans (much lower cost these days than SUVs) and a pretty basic vehicle that figures to be reliable. Then when market improves replace second car with SUV if desired or a nicer vehicle so you have some diversity.

Just some ideas.

I agree with the value comment. That’s why in January, we spent around $5K on each of our cars to completely rebuild their front ends. It was expensive but we thought we’d be keeping both for a few more years and wanted to avoid buying a car in today’s market.

Now that the Lexus has broken down twice on busy roadways and had to be towed in, we are rethinking whether we should continue to fix a car with 177K miles on it, even though it still looks very nice and until this year, it had no major problems. We’ll see what the new diagnosis is after having to have it towed in again today.

The Solara has only 129K miles, but the Lexus is a nicer car so we had decided we preferred to keep the Lexus if we have to cut down to one car. Good to know the “check engine” light isn’t necessarily an expensive fix. We will get a diagnosis of that next week.

In the meantime we may have to rent a car so we have some kind of transportation until both cars are diagnosed and we can make an informed decision. Looking online, the inventory situation is indeed dire so we may not have much choice if we have to buy something soon.