Abolish Cash?

imoldernu

Gone but not forgotten
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Maybe a way to avoid negative interest rates:

http://etfdailynews.com/2015/04/22/war-on-cash-intensifies-jpmorgan-chase-to-prohibit-the-storage-of-cash-in-safety-deposit-boxes/
My mother has a SDB at a Chase branch with one of my siblings as co-signers. Last week they got a letter outlining a number of changes to the lease agreement, including this:

“Contents of the box: You agree not to store any cash or coins other than those found to have a collectible value.”

Another change is that signatures will no longer be accepted to access the box. The next time they go in they have to bring two forms of ID and they will be issued a four-digit pin number that will be used to access the box then and in the future.

Much to think through on this....
... and who determines collectible value?

How will the Fed deal with this?
Suppose your local grocery sstore stops accepting cash?
Good deal for who... whom?
 
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Move to the First Bank of Serta.

They can't add fees to cash so they are trying to get rid of it. Negative interest rates, bail ins, the total surveillance state, end of all liberty is on the horizon.
 
WHy do banks care if you store cash? Is this some sort of drug war deal?
 
There have been a bunch of news stories lately about getting rid of cash.
They want to impose negative interest rates as a monetary policy but they can't as long as people can pull their cash out of the bank. They want to close the last way people can protect themselves against monetary debasement.
 
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WHy do banks care if you store cash? Is this some sort of drug war deal?

Pretty much. It's a regulation thing likely. Most governments think that lots of cash = criminal activity (not just drugs).

Now, if you store cash in a box in a bank authorities can seize it and your bank can point to their regulations.
 
No, the reason for abolishing cash by the banks is to insure all transactions are electronic from which they can elicit a fee. Furthermore, governments are realizing that if interest rates go negative people will withdraw cash from banks blocking the negative rates. By making it unsafe to hold cash by not allowing into safe deposit boxes, and minimizing the amount of cash to hold this will enable the establishment of negative rates on basic cash accounts. This is already being put into place in France which has negative interest rates up to 4 year securities.

The criminal implications is just a cover story, governments are driven by financing needs
 
This is not new. In '07 we were looking for a new bank with SDB option here in South Florida. The "no cash" clause was common, and made it difficult for us to find an acceptable option.
 
France (and many other European countries) has negative interest rates only for bondholders and large corporate accounts. For those two holding large amounts of cash was never an option.

Retail savings accounts - what this refers to - all have positive or zero interest rates. Negative rates won't happen either in the near future, banks fall over each other making that statement all the time here. Many countries even forbid banks charging negative interest rates.
 
My real concern, how to pay the strippers without cash??
Think the whole idea is dead on arrival.
 
As a practical matter the banks have no control over what you store in a safe deposit box and, in fact, they don't want to know for fear of liability. I'm sure this is an attempt to relieve themselves of any potential liability for criminal activity.
Bruce
 
If this were simple, it could be explained in a paragraph or two. When things get complicated one of two things happen.

1.The propositions get shaken down into terms that most people can a understand and accept. This makes the subject controllable and a matter of passing interest.

2. Details are studied and understood by those most directly affected, who usually go on to benefit the most.

#2 could have this kind of benefit. Here's one possibility:

http://www.acting-man.com/?p=4833

My thinking is that Running_Man was very close to being right.
No, the reason for abolishing cash by the banks is to insure all transactions are electronic from which they can elicit a fee. Furthermore, governments are realizing that if interest rates go negative people will withdraw cash from banks blocking the negative rates. By making it unsafe to hold cash by not allowing into safe deposit boxes, and minimizing the amount of cash to hold this will enable the establishment of negative rates on basic cash accounts. This is already being put into place in France which has negative interest rates up to 4 year securities.

The criminal implications is just a cover story, governments are driven by financing needs

Central Banks... and money leverage.
 
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Time to go to the mattresses!!! Out of context but it still applies.
 
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You can't tuck a credit card?:dance:
Bruce

I'll bite: you could try swiping it, but where?...

Incidentally, I just read this week (please don't ask where) that people who use cash instead of credit or debit cards tend pay less and have less debt. It interested me because I pay cash for everything.
 
If the gov't gets rid of cash, some other under the table form of exchange will take it's place. Jewelry, booze, clamshells, glass beads, cigarettes, something. Prohibition never works.
 
Who is getting rid of, or abolishing cash?

It just says you can't store it in a Safe Deposit Box. As others said, probably a money laundering or liability issue.

Nothing to keep you from using cash as much as you want (I loathe the stuff).

-ERD50
 
Who is getting rid of, or abolishing cash?

It just says you can't store it in a Safe Deposit Box. As others said, probably a money laundering or liability issue.

Nothing to keep you from using cash as much as you want (I loathe the stuff).

-ERD50
From the article:

The news arrives on the back of comments by Citi’s Willem Buiter, who recently advocated abolishing cash altogether in order to “solve the world’s central banks’ problem with negative interest rates”.
Banks in the U.S. are also making it harder for customers to withdraw and deposit cash, with Chase imposing new capital controls that mandate identification for cash deposits and ban cash being deposited into another person’s account.
Not to mention the first part of the title of the article - "War on Cash Continues".

And it's not a money laundering or drug trade issue, it's clearly (if you read the article) about stopping people from withdrawing cash in the face a possible negative interest rates to help as
financial institutions are positioning themselves to handle the fallout of the next economic crash – at the expense of customers.
 
Maybe it's time to withdraw and store a stack of portable, oh-so-handy cash while it can still be done. With increasingly tight and interconnected
records of charge/debit transactions, I would not like to give up the freedom of buying things with cash. I've got nothing to hide--that's not the point.
 
Maybe it's time to withdraw and store a stack of portable, oh-so-handy cash while it can still be done. With increasingly tight and interconnected
records of charge/debit transactions, I would not like to give up the freedom of buying things with cash. I've got nothing to hide--that's not the point.

I suspect the not keeping cash in a safe deposit box is a lot of sound and fury signifying nothing. The banks don't know what's in there, and wrapping it paper or a box pretty much negates their ever figuring out when you put it in or take it out. It's more an effort to control the sheeple than to absolutely forbid it. The actual abolition of cash is more if an issue, although pretty far fetched at this point. There's still time to consider your options, IMO.
 
If it were as simple as it sounds, then savvy bankers would be taking the less obvious contrarian side of the issue. Instead, they are backing off with defensive tactics, hoping to stall the elephant in the room... fiat money.

If you've been watching the trading of ETF's the obvious should be clear. No longer is the world on an upward path of production and wealth, but it's into a period of consolidation to balance high expectation and wild optimism with the reality that we're dealing with today's dollars, but spending tomorrow's dollars.

One has but to look at emerging markets, to see that the bets placed on economies that are moving into the world economy... that these bets are now facing the true rate of expansion. that the bonds that were issued in expectation of high returns, have now reached junk bond status. Can anyone rationalize bond rates of 10% to 20%... with real growth? Look at Russia, Venezeula, Brazil, Ukaine and Columbia... and see the risk growth over the past several years. Then look at investment advisors... to see the recommendations. Instead of buy and hold, a frantic drive into the possibilities of ETF profits.

Follow up on that with where the value of the trading sits. The actual dollars, and not the marginal rates. Naturally, in the banks... and more specifically the central banks.

With profits being made on the basis of infinitesimal changes in relative currency valuations, the strength of a shaky structure inevitably rests with propping up the underlying structure. With true value resting anywhere but in the banks themselves, structural stability is endangered.

A simplistic view of the reasons for the possible or proposed changes to the free flow of actual currency. A possible time bomb in the financial structure of the US.

Ultra simple... Why do you suppose truckloads of dollar bills are not allowed transit between countries?

My take from reading the 2010 article in my last post. Excerpt:
As far as we know the 'main users of currency' are not only shady criminal types. Certainly both governments and banking cartels everywhere would love nothing more than to implement this crypto-fascist proposal under the guise of 'hampering criminal activity'. In reality it would destroy all vestiges of financial privacy, by making every financial transaction traceable for the bureaucrats. In addition it would deprive citizens of an important right – the right to remove their savings from the banking system.

It would mean that in the event of a financial crisis like the one in 2008 that nearly crashed the system, people would no longer have the choice of withdrawing their money from the system. They would sink or swim with the banks. We would recommend saying 'thanks, but no thanks' to that idea, even though it is quite clear that the government will bail out the big banks no matter what. The problem is that people relying on government promises to this effect have been left stranded with their savings utterly destroyed too many times in history to make such an approach even remotely acceptable. Just ask the citizens of Argentina, who were subjected to a grueling confiscatory deflation when push came to shove.
 
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Banks have hated dealing with cash for many years. It costs them money to keep it on hand and most bank branches built in the last decade have comparatively tiny vaults versus the branches of yore. Since our gubmint wishes to ever tighten the screws on the populace, it is very easy for the banks to go along with gubmint/regulator pressure and discourage customers from handling cash (after all, doing so helps minimize cash-related losses).


Outside of the banking system, it isn't clear that cash is trash. I still see a cash register at most every retail business I frequent. Lots of people prefer to receive cash over other forms of payment. Lots of people outside the US must prefer cash as well, because 5 years or so ago I was told by an executive of the NY Fed in charge of the operation that distributed the actual bills and coin that roughly 50% of all US currency is overseas. If anyone would know, I presume it would be him.


A modest stash of cash is something I have always thought would be a prudent preparation against messy circumstances (big power outage, storm, whatever), along with food, water, booze, ammunition, etc. Nothing new.
 
I'll bite: you could try swiping it, but where?...

Incidentally, I just read this week (please don't ask where) that people who use cash instead of credit or debit cards tend pay less and have less debt. It interested me because I pay cash for everything.

I also like to use cash wherever I can, simply to not have my cc number floating around. But I never see the "cash discount" anymore. Seems like the incentive is to use cc to get "points" or "cash back", etc. Gas has been the same price for cash or credit for years now. Don't stores still have to pay a fee when a customer uses a credit card?
 

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