Are all contractors really incompetent? (I doubt it)

[disneysteve]

Apologies to any contractors here. My title was purposely hyperbolic. I have great respect for skilled contractors.

We've owned our home for 32 years. Every single time we've have had any significant work done, the contractor doing the job has taken the time to point out the things that the previous contractor did wrong. Every time.

We've now been in the house long enough to do some jobs 2 or 3 times and on each subsequent job, same thing. Contractor #2 pointed out the errors made by #1. Ten or fifteen years later, #3 pointed out the errors made by #2. Now another 15 years later, #4 is showing us the errors made by #3.

Are they all correct? Did all of the previous contractors really do all of those things wrong? I have to wonder how many of the "errors" being pointed out are just differences of opinion where both options are acceptable. Also, how much of it is because codes and materials and standards have changed over time?

We just had our water heater replaced. The contractor (a firm we've used several times for both electrical and HVAC work) showed us how the old one wasn't done correctly. While in the basement, he also pointed out that the condensate pump from the AC was improperly hooked up to the drain. The old water heater was 15 years old and still working so clearly whatever they did "wrong" didn't seem to give us any trouble. And the condensate pump is older than that and also has never caused any issues. I can't help but wonder how much of what they point out is purely intended to sell themselves as the preferred company to go with to "fix" the identified issues. It's annoying because you know sales is a much bigger part of their job than it ought to be, like so many other jobs. It would be nice if they could focus purely on doing great work but they can't.

 

[Lewis Clark]

I've had the same experience with contractors. I think at least some of it is just difference of opinion.

 

[JoeWras]

Some is true, some is bucking themselves up, some is due to code changes and "generally accepted practices" changes.

Decks are a great example of code changes. Take a 25 year old deck and a contractor could point out all kinds of errors that are nothing more than a change in the code and way things are done.

 

[Al18]

I haven't experienced this behavior with any of the contractors I've used over the years.

 

[target2019]

It's a known tactic. Look at these other flaws, I am smarter and worth every penny I charge you.

It was also very common in the consulting field.

 

[disneysteve]

It's a known tactic. Look at these other flaws, I am smarter and worth every penny I charge you.

It's tough to get away with it though when the item they are pointing out has been working flawlessly for 15 years. Clearly, what the previous guy did was just fine even if it isn't the way you would do it today.

 

[Kings over Queens]

Given your examples @disneysteve I'm willing to bet its a combination of personal preference as to technique, changes in codes and updated process due to new materials...and some simple mistakes.

I remember building my house, the electrician drilled trough a joist at the maximum allowable diameter. The code inspector said "he just made it" and another contractor said "that was wrong, it should have been smaller." They are both correct.

 

[disneysteve]

Some is true, some is bucking themselves up, some is due to code changes and "generally accepted practices" changes.

Decks are a great example of code changes. Take a 25 year old deck and a contractor could point out all kinds of errors that are nothing more than a change in the code and way things are done.

I'm fine with them saying, "this doesn't meet current code". That totally makes sense and if you're replacing something, you need to follow today's guidelines. But just randomly pointing out something done "wrong" that isn't a code issue seems suspicious.

 

[Chuckanut]

Are all contractors incompetent?

Only most of the ones who spend a fortune advertising

Some is true, some is bucking themselves up, some is due to code changes and "generally accepted practices" changes.

Decks are a great example of code changes. Take a 25 year old deck and a contractor could point out all kinds of errors that are nothing more than a change in the code and way things are done.

Very true for many things. I had a new dishwasher installed a while back. That old one was well over a decade old. Among the extra work that needed to be done to meet new code requirements were: new GFI outlet to replace old hard wired power, and a new drain overflow gizmo.

I try to find local family bushiness. They are cheaper and so far have done a good job for me. The Big Name ones that advertise constantly on the radio and TV, usually with endorsements from a local pro athlete, don't impress me.

 

[rk911]

We've remodeled every room in our home since 1988. We also demolished a rickety old backyard shed and built a new backyard shed on a proper concrete foundation. We just finished widening a staircase and installing a pair of stairlifts for my wife. We pulled a permit for every job that required a building permit and all jobs passed inspection by the city building dept.

Our contractors...the general/carpenter, plumbing and electrical, were, with two exceptions, the same contractors for each job. When you find an individual or a company that does excellent work you stick with them. The inspectors know them and the quality of their work. No surprises, no finger-pointing. There will always be differences of opinion between contractors...sometime genuine, sometime out of a desire to be hired by badmouthing the previous contractor.

Our next project is to replace the aging carpeting throughout the house with hardwood.

 

[djsander]

We’ve been hit and miss with contractors the last couple of years. Trades like plumbing have gone from time and material to a unit price on each item they work on. It seems they are incentivized to sell more and get in and out as quickly as possible. The conspiracy theorist in me says instead of just getting that hourly rate they now get an hourly rate plus commission for each item they fix or replace. More items in less time gets the salesman i mean technician and the company more money. So, now they've overpriced it all and pushing sales. What used to be $125 to $150/hour plus materials with a mark up now becomes a job that is $500/hr+ or even alot morewhen broken down on an hourly basis. Ridiculous pricing to sell more. So, the techs are rushing to do more to make more. Many are just in it to make as much as possible without a concern about the quality of their work.

 

[TripleLindy]

It has definitely become more difficult to find a good contractor. We’ve had some very good ones and some that were absolutely awful. We just had our foundation repaired and that crew did a great job. I don’t think I’ve ever had a contractor point out the flaws of anyone else’s work, though.

We have a bathroom remodel and whole house paint job that needs to be done, but I keep putting both off because I dread the process of trying to find a good contractor.

 

[TripleLindy]

We’ve been hit and miss with contractors the last couple of years. Trades like plumbing have gone from time and material to a unit price on each item they work on. It seems they are incentivized to sell more and get in and out as quickly as possible. The conspiracy theorist in me says instead of just getting that hourly rate they now get an hourly rate plus commission for each item they fix or replace. More items in less time gets the salesman i mean technician and the company more money. So, now they've overpriced it all and pushing sales. What used to be $125 to $150/hour plus materials with a mark up now becomes a job that is $500/hr+ or even alot morewhen broken down on an hourly basis. Ridiculous pricing to sell more. So, the techs are rushing to do more to make more. Many are just in it to make as much as possible without a concern about the quality of their work.

Exactly my experience. And they want you to join their “club” for a monthly fee, Who needs to pay a plumber or electrician monthly?! Such a scam.

 

[djsander]

Exactly my experience. And they want you to join their “club” for a monthly fee, Who needs to pay a plumber or electrician monthly?! Such a scam.

We found a decent plumber we think. He made repairs from a previous companies botched job. The problems he pointed out were obvious as the reason we called him. A couple leaky joints that leaked after the warranty period. It seems like a large portion of the companies now are combination HVAC, plumbing and electrical. We did join their “club” as it was the same cost as we've had in the past for twice annual HVAC checks and cleaning. So, we figured we would give them a shot.

 

[Lorenzo]

I'm fine with them saying, "this doesn't meet current code". That totally makes sense and if you're replacing something, you need to follow today's guidelines. But just randomly pointing out something done "wrong" that isn't a code issue seems suspicious.

Maybe the contractor is just inarticulate or verbally lazy in explaining the basis for what they know is the current way of doing it, and they just want to get on with the job rather than trying to be more specific as to whether it is now done that way due to a change in a code section or just a change in best practices that has worked its way through the industry. They may not be absolutely sure of the basis, yet they may be sure that is the way it is currently done.

 

[Spock]

My BIL, brother, and myself can't get a contractor to return a phone call to even start a project.
I'd be happy to get somebody (competent) to do a project and complain about the previous work while doing it.

 

[disneysteve]

Only most of the ones who spend a fortune advertising

The Big Name ones that advertise constantly on the radio and TV, usually with endorsements from a local pro athlete, don't impress me.

Same here. I will not hire any contractor that advertises. If they sponsor the local sports teams, have bus wraps driving around town, billboards at the ball field, commercials on TV and radio, etc., I want nothing to do with them. Who do you think pays for all of that advertising?

 

[bjl584]

Combination of factors. A big one is ever changing building codes and methodologies. What someone did 15 years ago is probably not done anymore due to new materials or methods, and it may not even be up to code with today's standards. That, and everyone wants you to believe that they are the best at what they do.

 

[Handymike]

Apologies to any contractors here. My title was purposely hyperbolic. I have great respect for skilled contractors.

We've owned our home for 32 years. Every single time we've have had any significant work done, the contractor doing the job has taken the time to point out the things that the previous contractor did wrong. Every time.

We've now been in the house long enough to do some jobs 2 or 3 times and on each subsequent job, same thing. Contractor #2 pointed out the errors made by #1. Ten or fifteen years later, #3 pointed out the errors made by #2. Now another 15 years later, #4 is showing us the errors made by #3.

Are they all correct? Did all of the previous contractors really do all of those things wrong? I have to wonder how many of the "errors" being pointed out are just differences of opinion where both options are acceptable. Also, how much of it is because codes and materials and standards have changed over time?

We just had our water heater replaced. The contractor (a firm we've used several times for both electrical and HVAC work) showed us how the old one wasn't done correctly. While in the basement, he also pointed out that the condensate pump from the AC was improperly hooked up to the drain. The old water heater was 15 years old and still working so clearly whatever they did "wrong" didn't seem to give us any trouble. And the condensate pump is older than that and also has never caused any issues. I can't help but wonder how much of what they point out is purely intended to sell themselves as the preferred company to go with to "fix" the identified issues. It's annoying because you know sales is a much bigger part of their job than it ought to be, like so many other jobs. It would be nice if they could focus purely on doing great work but they can't.

Many of the residential work is permitted so inspectors will find bad work . The comments of current contractors will be because sometimes over time procedures or requirements change or are upgraded

 

[disneysteve]

The comments of current contractors will be because sometimes over time procedures or requirements change or are upgraded

I totally get that. So say, “This isn’t how it’s done today” rather than “Let me show you why this was done wrong last time”.

 

[djsander]

Just removed two coax wall plates and put on blanks. Both were next to electrical outlets. Both only had wood screws in the dry wall and were not really holding. One of them was so close to the electrical outlet the side of it partially overlapped the electric outlet. I guess the installer was some random fly by night contractor that just slaps the stuff on with no concern about it.

 

[Sorcerer]

Why did you replace your water heater if it was still working?

Water heaters should never go bad. The problem is, homeowners take zero precautions to maintain anything. There is a sacrificial rod in your water heater called an anode rod. It should have been replaced after a couple years. Or splurge and buy an anode rod that has a electric current running through it. Those last forever.

Such a simple fix and I have never heard of a single person doing this. You have to replace the anode rod or your hot water heater will destroy itself.

 

[Healthy Lifestyle]

Why did you replace your water heater if it was still working?

Water heaters should never go bad. The problem is, homeowners take zero precautions to maintain anything. There is a sacrificial rod in your water heater called an anode rod. It should have been replaced after a couple years. Or splurge and buy an anode rod that has a electric current running through it. Those last forever.

Such a simple fix and I have never heard of a single person doing this. You have to replace the anode rod or your hot water heater will destroy itself.

My Anode rod in my hot water heater was never replaced.
I just replaced my 22 year old working Bradford hot water heater and it never needed any parts or repair.
I changed mine when I upgraded my HVAC system.

 

[Koolau]

My experience: All contractors bad-mouth all other contractors - and they're all right! One contractor takes short cuts. Another takes a different short cut. They're both against code or "standard" though their short cuts are rarely fatal. Been through this many times.

 

[frank05]

Never had any issue with any contractor hired for work on my house or my parents. Some of the repair work, I had to have done makes me wonder why my taxes support building inspectors. When I was having my deck replaced the contractor discovered that it looked like the builder ran out of house wrap and a door was installed with the jam having no support on one side.