Did you pay for a withdrawal roadmap? Or do you roll your own?

[superfreak]

Hi:
I am wondering how many of you have utilized a CFP, CPA, RIA to create a retirement withdrawal roadmap for you?
Or do most of you figure this out with some excel spreadsheets?
Are there any calculators that exist out there to help you figure out your best strategy that minimizes taxes paid, and avoid the negative impacts of RMD, IRMA, SS Tax torpedo?

Initial research shows that some will charge 1% of your net worth, and others will create it for a one time fee around $5k.

I've been educating myself on the perils of post retirement withdrawals, specifically RMDs and IRMA limits. I haven't found a way to avoid the SS tax torpedo income limit of $44k.

I have been working on a crude spreadsheet that models current investment account balances, estimated withdrawals from each account type to fund living expenses and roth conversions, and the estimated annual returns post withdrawal.

It uses assumptions like x% returns annually, and effective tax rate of y% on any taxable withdrawals.
It also tracks the IRMA limits and tIRA balance I need to be under by age 75, in order to avoid RMD issues.

It has help me visualize and understand major milestones like 63 (irma lookback), 65 medicare starts, 75 (RMD starts for my birth year), and I am able to try different scenarios for roth conversions in order to stay within my RMD balance by the time I hit 75. At the end of the day, it seems like I just need to keep my annual income under the IRMA limits, and make sure I have enough Roth conversions done before 75 to avoid negative RMD issues.

I realized that nobody really knows what the limits and tax brackets, let alone tax laws will be beyond the next 5 years, so I am planning on having this 40 year roadmap, but focus on the next 5 years, and really fine tuning the sources for the current year's withdrawal.

What do you all that have retired for a while think?

 

[mrfeh]

There are software products that can help you with this.

Boldin. Pralana. Many others.

 

[RetireBy90]

I have used fidelity planner first, and now I use my own spreadsheet. I started using spreadsheet before retired and expanded over the years.
I find using spreadsheet along with info for taxes really lets me better understand our finances and look at the impact of various changes. Without spending time various changes and projections I wouldn’t have the same confidence. If you use software or a pro I would suggest keep spreadsheet so you really know what is under any projections
YMMV

 

[L-5Player]

I definitely don't pay for this type of service. But I do analyze it often myself, and formally plan for each year as it comes, since there are always different circumstances to consider. 2026 is my 5th full retirement year, so the process has evolved and I have learned a lot.

The single best tool is a tax simulator that calculates federal and state tax as accurately as possible. Ultimately, I created my own in Google Sheets. It's linked to my investment worksheets so every taxable dividend, capital gain, etc. is recorded as it happens. And there are year-end projections for everything. I include a tab with all the variables that change each year.

If you can do this and study the results, you will learn how the different taxation brackets stack up and impact each other. And you can plan how to withdraw most efficiently each year.

I can often be found analyzing the isolated tax rate of an additional $1,000 if I realize LT capital gains vs. convert to Roth, take a non-qualified 529 withdrawal, and so on. It's very enlightening.

As far as longer term planning goes, I have made more attempts at the ultimate Roth conversion worksheet than I'm willing to admit. It's a very complex topic. But I think I know what to do, and I trust my work more than that of an outside party.

The big variable is a large inheritance that will land on me, an only child, hopefully still very much in the future, but realistically no later than my 70s. Between inherited IRAs with 10 year withdrawal requirements and taxable dividends, plus my own RMD, I'm going to be awash in taxes.

I would say - keep refining your analysis. Learn intimately how taxes work if you have any blind spots. It sounds like you can do a great job on this without hiring and relying on someone else.

 

[DrRoy]

I rolled my own, although I was at the max scale for Fido planner, and I ran Firecalc.

 

[sdawson]

I'm in the camp of using my own spreadsheet -- which take into account all the things mentinoed in the original post, and then some. . Fed and State tax rates, IRMAA limits, RMDs, Roth Conversion of various amounts, taxable portions of SS at Fed and State level, different ages when SS begins for my wife and I, QLAC income, (for me and my wife). Basically all I have learned from this forum.

And I have a duplicate set of rows for what happens when I pass and my wife is on her own (which is the largest motivator for me to do Roth Conversions).

But any such plan is just an outline. There are things one just can not know (stock market rise or fall), social security cuts, unplanned health costs, when I will actually pass, etc. It seems better to learn the details oneself to handle the adjustments, rather than paying someone a one time fee for a plan which will need to change over a long retirement.

However, there is a case for getting someone else involved, which is when I pass (or mentally decline), someone needs to follow the basic outline and adjust the plan. If the spouse is not really up to it, an outside person could be of help there. For me, one of my daughters is whip smart and interested in this, so I'll be sharing the plan and spreadsheet and all the details with here, so she can guide my wife (or me) later in retirement.

 

[levindb]

The first IRMAA is not huge, about $1K/year for each person. You will have to balance that against the value of Roth conversions where you could prevent moving from 12% to 22% marginal tax bracket. Many of the brackets tend to move each year and your assumptions on inflation/COLA and your lumpy expenses means there will be a lot of assumptions/guessing on your part.
Try not to have the tax man manage your enjoyment of being retired...but looking toward the future will help you keep more of what you have earned.

 

[Exchme]

I started my journey doing a roll-your-own spreadsheet. But the tax code is so complicated that I had knowledge gaps and lots of bugs, so it ended up being mostly a waste of time. I moved on to the free bogleheads.org Retiree Portfolio Model spreadsheet, that was bug-free and had lots more of the tax code so was quite useful. I eventually tired of it as the interface is very quirky, it only had a static projection and everything was very manual, so I ended up writing Excel formulas and modifying the base sheet anyway (and then each year a new version would come out and I would have to re-do my modifications).

I then found Pralana, which is way more powerful and flexible, with helpful optimizers and still dirt cheap ($120 1st year, $89 renewal). It is a bit more complicated to set up than some others because of that power and flexibility. Some of the things I like in Pralana:

*Has optimizers for things like account withdrawal order in two simultaneous time periods, Roth Conversions, earliest possible retirement date, SS claim date.
*Has lots of withdrawal strategies available including some you haven't heard of.
*It's not Turbotax, but does a really good job on federal taxes and takes a shot at state taxes.
*Has excellent flexibility in specifying returns, asset allocation, various flavors of inflation in multiple different time periods.
*Has excellent flexibility in handling different types of income and expenses.
*Has static projections, Historical Analysis, Monte Carlo and even lets you pick any specific historical starting year and shows you the entire projection if you get those conditions again - which is highly useful for stress testing your asset allocation and Roth conversion plan to make sure you are not so aggressive that you may regret it.

Pralana's superpower is the ability to specify a tax efficient asset placement, where you put your bonds preferentially in tax deferred while it maintains the overall asset allocation. Most competitor products don't keep the overall asset allocation constant, so their Roth Conversion calculations can be wildly unreliable.

The learning curve in planning can be steep and you may make mistakes that are far more costly than having someone help you set up a plan. I felt like I knew what I was doing, but still made a key mistake that will cost more than a planner would have charged (I was still working part-time so had medical coverage, but since I was 63, I was only doing Roth conversions up to certain IRMAA tiers - not understanding that when I eventually went on Medicare, I would just file a form documenting the life changing event and not be subject to IRMAA on those past conversions - a professional would hopefully have told me about that and made a better plan).

Both Pralana and Boldin (and probably others) have planners available that can help you with your set up. My understanding is the advisor will then deliver the working model to you. One of the key values of hiring a one-time-fee planner is that they may help you figure out what's really important to you and walk you through how you value the inevitable trade-offs (like spending vs. security vs. legacy vs. gifts or risks vs. returns). In fact, if the planner doesn't start with an extensive interview about those kinds of things, you know you've got the wrong one.

 

[G-Man]

I was only doing Roth conversions up to certain IRMAA tiers - not understanding that when I eventually went on Medicare, I would just file a form documenting the life changing event and not be subject to IRMAA on those past conversions - a professional would hopefully have told me about that and made a better plan).

Can you please explain your comment above on getting IRMAA surcharge removed based on life event.

 

[marko]

Roll your own "with a little help from your friends" on this forum.
Couldn't resist.

 

[PaunchyPirate]

I've rolled my own since retiring in 2018. I do my own research and read a lot to help me become comfortable with that approach. Last year, I validated things some by purchasing and using Pralana as others above have done. I just renewed that for another year in case I want to freshen up my modeling over time. I'm not sure I'll keep it every year though.

 

[pb4uski]

I rolled my own. I developed a spreadsheet that projected income, spending, investment income from taxable accounts, the standard deduction, and taxable income until I'm 90. It also projects tax brackets since they increase with inflation and taxes using current tax brackets. Also projected RMDs given internal growth of tIRA that is all fixed income less Roth conversions and withdrawals.

To me, the Roth conversion decision is easy. I look at the tax bracket that I expect the last dollar of RMDs to be taxed and convert to the top of the tax bracket below that. So in my case, I project that the last dollar of RMD would be in the 22% tax bracket so I convert to the top of the 12% tax bracket. My reasoning is that I'm ok with paying 12% or less now to avoid paying 22% later.

What is the "SS tax torpedo income limit of $44k"?

 

[imjustawarrior]

We are pre-59.5. Our spending comes from taxable. We do Roth conversions up to NIIT. We have a rough idea of how much we will spend each year until we pass, but there are just too many unknowns to put much effort into much else.

 

[RetiredHappy]

I did it all on my own with the use of spreadsheets. My husband doesn't even look at my spreadsheets and follows what I tell him to do. I think in our case it is not about whether SS gets taxed, but rather how much IRMAA and NIIT that we are willing to pay each year.

 

[COcheesehead]

Self managed via spreadsheet. Educate yourself and you’ll be better off.

 

[G-Man]

I use a number of retirement planning tools; however, I do maintain my own spreadsheet to confirm/validate the accuracy of the retirement planning tools.

My spreadsheet has been growing as I learn new things from the members in this community.

 

[RunningBum]

What is the "SS tax torpedo income limit of $44k"?

If your SS benefit isn't fully taxed, incremental income pushes more of your SS into being taxed, and both the incremental income and the additional SS income push more of your LTCGs/QDivs into being taxed, for a marginal rate of up to something like 49.5%. I don't recall if that % is based on old tax brackets or new.

Usually the window is narrow, which can lead to a decision to take extra one year and blow through the SS tax torpedo back into lower marginal rates and another year to stay short of the torpedo.

I've seen people here misuse the term tax torpedo to mean when you simply have more income and higher taxes due to SS and RMDs. What it means is that you have a range of income where your marginal rate graphed with income on the X axis and marginal rate on the Y axis juts out for a short run of income and then goes back in, to look somewhat like a torpedo on the graph. The worst is if you hit that high rate and have no more income beyond that where the marginal rate settles back down.

 

[COcheesehead]

One more thing…do your own taxes. It’s a great learning tool.

 

[Fotodog]

I also have a spreadsheet but it’s pretty simple. Columns show our sources that count as income each year; Social Security, pension, future RMD’s, and Roth conversions. So far I haven’t included interest and dividends because they end up being pretty much a wash against other deductions. The last columns show total income and AGI after the standard deduction, and notes for that year. I have separate tables showing the current year’s tax brackets and IRMAA limits. We make our Roth conversions to stay under the first IRMAA increase.

Many of you have made more complex spreadsheets than mine. If you would be willing to share yours, without showing your personal information, I’m sure many people (including me) would love to see it.

 

[G-Man]

One more thing…do your own taxes. It’s a great learning tool.

Agree. 100%. Been doing my taxes in TurboTax for the last 15 years. In addition, for me, understanding the source for each line on the 1040 form was very helpful and educational for me. Understanding what AGI, Total Taxable Income, Ordinary Taxable Income and how it is taxed, Standard Deduction, Marginal Tax Brackets, Marginal Tax Rate vs Effective Tax Rate, LTGC/Qualified Dividend and how it is taxed, etc. is very helpful in understanding our tax system.

It has taken me years to understand this and my education is ongoing. Learn new stuff about taxes all the time.

 

[L-5Player]

the incremental income and the additional SS income push more of your LTCGs/QDivs into being taxed

This is actually one of the most overlooked phenomena when analyzing how to liquidate income. It's not just SS income; it's any regular income, including wages, tIRA withdrawals, and Roth conversions.

For example, let's say you start by withdrawing from a traditional IRA up to the top of the 10% bracket inclusive of the standard deduction, which is $57,000 for MFJ in 2026. You only owe 10% tax on $24,800 of that.

Next you liquidate stock in order to realize long term capital gains up to the 0% LTCG ceiling of $98,900.

The next dollar of LTCG will be taxed at 15%, so you look to the 12% bracket since that's a lower number, right?

However, the next dollar of regular income, which falls into the 12% bracket, will also push a dollar of LTCG past the 0% ceiling into 15%. So you are taxed 27% on that dollar.

Therefore the more efficient approach is to fill up the 0% LTCG ceiling entirely with regular income, comprising the 10% and 12% brackets. Then pull LTCG at 15%.

This is just one of the light bulbs that can go off when you have a flexible tool to simulate taxes.

 

[RetiredHappy]

This is actually one of the most overlooked phenomena when analyzing how to liquidate income. It's not just SS income; it's any regular income, including wages, tIRA withdrawals, and Roth conversions.

For example, let's say you start by withdrawing from a traditional IRA up to the top of the 10% bracket inclusive of the standard deduction, which is $57,000 for MFJ in 2026. You only owe 10% tax on $24,800 of that.

Next you liquidate stock in order to realize long term capital gains up to the 0% LTCG ceiling of $98,900.

The next dollar of LTCG will be taxed at 15%, so you look to the 12% bracket since that's a lower number, right?

However, the next dollar of regular income, which falls into the 12% bracket, will also push a dollar of LTCG past the 0% ceiling into 15%. So you are taxed 27% on that dollar.

Therefore the more efficient approach is to fill up the 0% LTCG ceiling entirely with regular income, comprising the 10% and 12% brackets. Then pull LTCG at 15%.

This is just one of the light bulbs that can go off when you have a flexible tool to simulate taxes.

But you will also need to weigh whether you need to drain IRA sooner because it will keep growing. We avoided higher taxes by using taxable first for many years and paying the full capital gains (our income is over $200K a year so there is no $0 tax for anything) but the IRA keeps growing and now we have another issue and we are trying to get some out and pay IRMAA and NIIT before it gets worse when one of us passes away.

 

[G-Man]

This is actually one of the most overlooked phenomena when analyzing how to liquidate income. It's not just SS income; it's any regular income, including wages, tIRA withdrawals, and Roth conversions.

For example, let's say you start by withdrawing from a traditional IRA up to the top of the 10% bracket inclusive of the standard deduction, which is $57,000 for MFJ in 2026. You only owe 10% tax on $24,800 of that.

Next you liquidate stock in order to realize long term capital gains up to the 0% LTCG ceiling of $98,900.

The next dollar of LTCG will be taxed at 15%, so you look to the 12% bracket since that's a lower number, right?

However, the next dollar of regular income, which falls into the 12% bracket, will also push a dollar of LTCG past the 0% ceiling into 15%. So you are taxed 27% on that dollar.

Therefore the more efficient approach is to fill up the 0% LTCG ceiling entirely with regular income, comprising the 10% and 12% brackets. Then pull LTCG at 15%.

This is just one of the light bulbs that can go off when you have a flexible tool to simulate taxes.

So, what flexible tool would you use to simulate this tax scenario? A lot of CPAs and tax professionals use a tax software called Holistiplan to simulate tax scenarios. However, the software is very expensive.

 

[pb4uski]

My spreadsheet adjusts tax brackets, standard deductions, etc for inflation at the Fed target of 2%. My columns are Year, Age, Interest on taxable accounts, Dividends on Taxable accounts, Pension, My SS, DW SS, AGI, Standard deduction, Taxable income subtotal, Roth conversion, RMD, Taxable income, Ordinary income, Preferenced income, 10% tax bracket, 12% tax bracket, 22% tax bracket, Tax with rows for each year. There are also columns for taxable account balances, tax-deferred account balances and tax-free account balances that increase for investment results and Roth conversions and decrease for withdrawals for spending, Roth conversions and RMDs. The devli is in the details and it can get complicated if you try to get too precise... a reasonable approximation is fine for me.

 

[pb4uski]

If your SS benefit isn't fully taxed, incremental income pushes more of your SS into being taxed, and both the incremental income and the additional SS income push more of your LTCGs/QDivs into being taxed, for a marginal rate of up to something like 49.5%. I don't recall if that % is based on old tax brackets or new.

Usually the window is narrow, which can lead to a decision to take extra one year and blow through the SS tax torpedo back into lower marginal rates and another year to stay short of the torpedo.

I've seen people here misuse the term tax torpedo to mean when you simply have more income and higher taxes due to SS and RMDs. What it means is that you have a range of income where your marginal rate graphed with income on the X axis and marginal rate on the Y axis juts out for a short run of income and then goes back in, to look somewhat like a torpedo on the graph. The worst is if you hit that high rate and have no more income beyond that where the marginal rate settles back down.

I figured that is what was meant, but its not a tax torpedo... RMDs are a tax torpedo.

In 2025 and prior years our SS was low because DW was collecting SS but I as the higher earner was not... so 85% of SS was taxable even if we did NO Roth conversions or tIRA withdrawals.

However, we do run into this in 2026 since it is the first full year of SS for me. Before any Roth conversions only 68% of our SS will be taxed. If I add Roth conversions or tIRA withdrawals to the top of the 0% preferenced tax bracket then 85% of our SS becomes taxable and our effective tax rate on conversions/withdrawals is a hair lower than 22.2%, which is 12% * (1+85%).

What is wierd, and I think coincidental is that the mix of our income is such that with Roth conversions/tIRA withdrawals to the top of the 0% preferenced tax bracket is right about where our taxable SS hits 85%.

I'm thinking about it but I think that I'm still ok with converting since I expect RMDs to be in the 22% bracket.