Different thoughts on new car ownership

[Texas Proud]

In 2016 I bought my Ford Focus RS. High strung, 350HP 4 banger with AWD and all the bells and whistles. Everyone said to buy the extended warranty. So I did, for an additional two years direct from Ford. Nothing broke. When that was ready to expire I bought another extended warranty for two years. Again.... nothing broke. The d**n car is the most reliable car ever. I only put about 3,000 miles a year on it, so that certainly helps.
Now it's eight years old and the rear hatch release failed, that's been it. Luckily it still works with the key fob.
I'd like to keep it forever, but I'll be 70 years old next year. How long can I drive a six speed manual?

Forever!!!!

I had a '04 Acura TL 6 speed and if I had not totaled it would still be driving it today...

I have thought of buying a new 6 speed but not many seem to be what I want... I liked the TL as it was a luxury sport sedan and had plenty of room...

 

[jazz4cash]

I am a car guy but the older I get the more leasing looks attractive. It seems like we are entering a cycle of big incentives for leasing.

 

[Diogenes]

Aren't extended warranties a profit center for whoever is selling them?

My thoughts exactly. If one avoids fussy cars (7-series BMW etc.) or known lemons, and drives sparingly, then it's likely that even a modern whiz-bang car will last 100K+ miles without any repairs... that is, just maintenance (oil change, brake pads, tires, occasional light bulbs, battery). Problems may arise once we try to push a 2020+ car to the same mileage or longevity as we expected from 1990s cars, with amateur-mechanic skills. But one supposes that such use-case doesn't apply to the OP.

Personally I am more frustrated at the complexity of modern cars, as an abstract concept - that is, the very fact that they're so darned complex - rather than direct experience as an amateur mechanic, where I attempt to repair some component and fail.

 

[mystang52]

I did not read all of the replies so this may have already been mentioned. I only buy new cars, and each time when the extended warranty is offered I turn it down for a simple reason. The cost of that warranty is, in essence, a prepayment for one or more repairs. If I ever felt inclined to buy such a warranty, instead I would park the cost in a segregated bank account.

 

[JoeWras]

I agree it's not the mechanical stuff that causes the problems, it is all of the electronics. Which can be hard to diagnose and potentially expensive to fix since it is all mfr only parts.

Coincidence! I'm reading this post, while there's a UToob in the background discussing the touch screen on the 1985 Buick Riviera. This complaint is 40 years old!

This pointer to the YouTube segment is worth a 2 minute look. It shows what that early all electronic world looked like. Primitive, but the complaints are similar to today's.

 

[rembrandt]

Coincidence! I'm reading this post, while there's a UToob in the background discussing the touch screen on the 1985 Buick Riviera. This complaint is 40 years old!

This pointer to the YouTube segment is worth a 2 minute look. It shows what that early all electronic world looked like. Primitive, but the complaints are similar to today's.

I had that car. It was the only "fancy" car I ever had!

 

[ArmchairMillionaire]

We bought a new 2023 Buick Enclave last year and really like it. Our 2011 Tahoe was still in very good condition but it was starting to have intermittent electronic issues. You know the kind that the dealer can't figure out and just wants to start replacing $1000 parts and hope for the best.
The Buick has a 36k/3 year warranty. We're hoping for the best but after the warranty expires what to do? In the past I've kept cars 10 years but that's because I could work on most systems. Now you pop open the hood and just see plastic pieces covering everything. Most cars engine and transmissions are lasting longer than ever now but it's the computerized everything that's integrated that's the problem. I'm capable of changing out most things in older cars but on new cars these parts need to be re-calibrated by the dealer. Everything is proprietary now.
So we're thinking when the warranty expires either buying a fully extensive warranty (if we can find one that covers everything) or just leasing the next car. I'm 70 so the end of my driving days are on the horizon.
Thoughts?

We bought our 2024 Chevrolet Trax LS almost a year ago, and it came with the WarrantyForever™ lifetime powertrain warranty at no cost to us. (There weren't any incentives on the 2nd generation Trax when they first came out, so we paid sticker price - just under $23K out the door, including tax, registration, fees, etc.)
That warranty covers the powertrain from the turbo all the way down to the wheel bearings but it doesn't include seals and gaskets.
From the brochure:

ENGINE Engine block and all internally-lubricated parts including the crankshaft, rod and main bearings, cam bearings, expansion (freeze) plugs, connecting rods, engine mounts, torque strut, wrist pins, pistons, piston rings, camshaft, cam tower, lifters, cylinder head, valves, guides and seats, valve springs, rocker arms (cam followers), pushrods, timing chain housing (cover), timing chain and sprockets, timing belt and pulleys, timing belt tensioner, intake and exhaust manifolds, eccentric shaft, flywheel/flex plate, balance shafts, harmonic balancer and retainer bolt, crankshaft pulley, valve covers, oil pan, oil pump and pressure relief valve, engine oil cooler hoses, oil filter adapter/housing, fuel supply pump, vacuum pump, dipstick and tube, and fasteners. Seals and gaskets are only covered in conjunction with the repair of a component listed above.
Turbocharged/Supercharged/Enhanced Engines – In addition the parts listed above, the turbo-charger, waste gate controller, intercooler, hard lines, compressor, clutch and pulley, bypass valve, injection pump, lines, and nozzles.

TRANSMISSION Automatic – Case and all internally-lubricated parts including the oil pump, valve body, torque converter, vacuum modulator, governor, main shaft, clutches, bands, drums, gear sets, bearings, bushings, sealing rings, TV cable, solenoids and electronic shift control unit (internal only), transmission mounts, cooler, cooler hoses and hard lines, dipstick and tube, and fasteners. Seals and gaskets are only covered in conjunction with the repair of a component listed above.

FRONT WHEEL DRIVE Final drive housing and all internally-lubricated parts including the carrier case, gear sets, chain and sprockets, bearings, bushings, axle shafts, axle hub bearings, propeller shafts, universal joints, drive shaft support, front axle hub bearings, and fasteners. Seals and gaskets are only covered in conjunction with the repair of a component listed above.

Car Rental expenses are not covered under the Warranty Forever® agreement. Towing and roadside assistance expenses are not covered under the Warranty Forever® agreement.

But, that warranty also comes with restrictions.
If I have all service done at my local GM dealership, they claim they will take care of all the required paperwork for the warranty. (see below) If the vehicle needs service while we’re out of town, there’s a pretty specific notification process we have to go through to keep the warranty from being voided.

MAINTENANCE REQUIREMENTS You are required to change your vehicle’s engine oil, check and maintain the transmission fluid level (if applicable), top off all powertrain fluid levels and check and maintain the proper level of coolant as follows: Manufacturer Required Synthetic or Synthetic Blend Oil: Every 12 months OR 10,000 miles, whichever comes first. Conventional Oil: Every 6 months OR 7,500 miles, whichever comes first.
MAINTENANCE NOTIFICATION Routine maintenance is critical to ensure optimum performance of your vehicle. You have the option of servicing your vehicle at the repair facility of your choice. Remember, you must notify the administrator in advance of any maintenance performed outside the selling dealer’s facilities so they can keep records of all work you have performed. Failure to notify the administrator will result in a denial of coverage.
THE CHOICE IS YOURS All service records must be filed with the Warranty Forever® administrator to maintain coverage. When service is performed at your selling dealer’s facilities, your dealer will notify the administrator. You may also have maintenance and repairs performed at any other licensed facility, but you must notify the administrator first. Failure to do so will result in a denial of coverage.
HOW TO CONTACT THE ADMINISTRATOR FOR MAINTENANCE NOTIFICATION 1. Choose a licensed repair facility to perform your maintenance. We do not provide a list of authorized dealers, so the choice is yours. 2. Call the administrator at (800) 810-8458 to notify them of the maintenance you are having performed.
YOU WILL NEED THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION DURING THE CALL: Warranty Forever agreement number or last 8 digits of VIN Date of scheduled maintenance appointment Name of the licensed repair facility where you are having maintenance performed Maintenance you are going to have performed Current mileage on odometer Any additional questions you may have 3. Follow all customary maintenance instructions outlined in your Warranty Forever® agreement. You can call our service facility or the Warranty Forever® toll free number with questions or for additional guidance at any time.

I've always changed the oil in all our vehicles, so bringing this one in for maintenance will take some getting used to. I had the first oil change and tire rotation done at 2655 miles, since that's the mileage that was on it when we wanted to put it away for the winter. The technician at the dealership came out and asked if I was sure I wanted it done because the computer still showed 56% oil life expectancy. The vehicle came with one free oil change and tire rotation, but they had to be done within one year of purchase so I told him that was why I was there.

So there's my 2¢ worth concerning extended warranties.
Hope this helps.

 

[donheff]

I'm 76 now and feel the same about cars. I used to fix a lot of stuff but not anymore. In 2018 I made the decision to lease for the first time, with the idea that I would always drive a new car with the latest tech. I got a Lexus Nx Hybrid. When the lease finished with about 12K miles on the odometer, I learned that the new features I wanted wouldn't be out for at least another year and the pandemic supply chain issues were not encouraging. I also saw that I could sell the car for far more than the buyout cost. I bought out of the lease and still have the car. It has 32,000 miles on it and may end up lasting until I can't drive anymore.

My current dilemma is what new tires to buy. Feel free to chime in on that if you have an opinion.

 

[ArmchairMillionaire]

I'm 76 now and feel the same about cars. I used to fix a lot of stuff but not anymore. In 2018 I made the decision to lease for the first time, with the idea that I would always drive a new car with the latest tech. I got a Lexus Nx Hybrid. When the lease finished with about 12K miles on the odometer, I learned that the new features I wanted wouldn't be out for at least another year and the pandemic supply chain issues were not encouraging. I also saw that I could sell the car for far more than the buyout cost. I bought out of the lease and still have the car. It has 32,000 miles on it and may end up lasting until I can't drive anymore.

My current dilemma is what new tires to buy. Feel free to chime in on that if you have an opinion.

As far as tires go, do you prioritize traction in snow, or are you more concerned about MPG?
I replaced the Continental tires that were on our 2003 GMC Envoy when we got it with General Grabber all-weather tires. They're a million times better in deep snow and slush, but we went from getting 18 mpg to 11-12 mpg. But since we pretty much only keep that vehicle around for an emergency winter vehicle, it's worth it to us. Of course, filling up the tank and only seeing 200 miles of range on a full tank is somewhat saddening, but it's nice knowing that if we have to go out in 8" of unplowed snow in an emergency, we're all set. (we had to do that last year to go and rescue DMIL when she got stuck in the snow on her way to w*rk. We were able to bring her to her j*b, then go back and use the tow strap to yank her fwd car out of the snow, bring it to where she w*rked, and give her the keys)
Personally, I get my tires at Wal-Mart, and pay a little extra for the lifetime rotation and road-hazard warranty. If you ever run over a nail and get a flat tire, they'll fix it for free at any Wal-Mart in the country, provided the tire is repairable. The only bad side to that is that you have to wait at Wal-Mart while they repair it.

 

[street]

I believe cars today are built so complex, so the vehicle has to be taken in for the work to be done at a dealership.
I so told lately that dealerships make their money with shop work not selling cars. The cash flow comes from the shop.

 

[Jerry1]

My current dilemma is what new tires to buy. Feel free to chime in on that if you have an opinion.

I just never felt I could go wrong buying a new set of Michelins.

 

[rembrandt]

I believe cars today are built so complex, so the vehicle has to be taken in for the work to be done at a dealership.
I so told lately that dealerships make their money with shop work not selling cars. The cash flow comes from the shop.

Yes! The shark fin antenna broke off on my Elantra. They charged me $500 to replace that little piece of plastic.

 

[WhenIsItTime]

On '97-'00 Corvette's, first model with traction control and ABS, an EBCM (circuit board) is commonly failing. No new replacement parts exist. Can pay >$1k for a 24 yr old used part and hope it works or continue driving without those features and looking at warning lights. Due to demand, some folks are trying to learn how to repair, but proving very difficult.

They did seem to last 15+ years before failing. Not so bad?

This will only become more common given the number of these circuit boards in modern cars must be growing exponentially.

 

[Music Lover]

We've been leasing two luxury cars for the past 30+ years.

Yes, the payback isn't there but you get more car than buying it outright and you also are getting a brand new car (and warranty) every three years complete with the latest safety features. In the end, the car is someone else's problem.

For us, it's more about the value than the cost. KISS.

Each to their own. For me, there's no value in new technology that isn't already existing in my 10-year old Acura.

IMO, some of the accident avoidance features of new cars are worth it. Blind Side Monitoring is great not only when driving on the road, but when backing out of a parking place with poor visibility. And adaptive cruise control makes road trip driving a lot easier and less stressful.

With correctly adjusted side mirrors and shoulder checks, blind spot monitoring isn't needed.

To avoid backing out of parking spots I back in to them so I can drive out.

 

[RetiredHappy]

My husband is a young 76 yo and we just traded in our 40K miles 4-year old Subaru Ascent to a brand new Cadillac Lyriq Luxury 3 all electric vehicle. We were going to buy a Tesla Model X but our salesperson had an emergency and his "backup" pissed us off so badly we left and went over to the Cadillac dealership. We are already talking about keeping this car about 5 years and getting another electric vehicle, either a Tesla or a newer generation of something. He will be 81 in 5 years' time and I don't think he is going to slow down by then. Golfing 4 to 5 days a week and working out the rest of the week keep both of us young.

 

[Sunset]

There are cars with longer warranties. Or just buy a Toyota / Lexus. We've had 3 from 2002 until now and so little work on any of them. 2 Avalons, 2005-19 & 2018 - now and a 2012 - now Sienna.

I bought a Hyundai Sonata some time ago. It came with a standard 10 year warranty !

 

[JoeWras]

We currently have 3 vehicles aged 16,15 and 14 years old. I can and do work on them. I've saved thousands doing simple repairs like brakes, ignition coils, etc. The basics are still there, and fairly accessible, and these models are all before the big screen integration happened.

DW will soon buy a new vehicle. My plan is to start giving it up with this new one and just Blow That Dough on having someone else do it.

 

[brett]

We currently have 3 vehicles aged 16,15 and 14 years old. I can and do work on them. I've saved thousands doing simple repairs like brakes, ignition coils, etc. The basics are still there, and fairly accessible, and these models are all before the big screen integration happened.

DW will soon buy a new vehicle. My plan is to start giving it up with this new one and just Blow That Dough on having someone else do it.

That is exactly why we keep our 2006 and 2007 vehicles. We like them both. We do regular scheduled mtce through an independent repair shop. Not one major repair on either. Just the usual. Our mechanic will give us a heads up as to when to strart thinking about replacing either.

Last time, about five years ago, on a lark, we went into an Acura store with the intent of buying. Walked out after 40 minutes.

Told DW that I liked my current vehicle as much as the new Acuras....and it ran like a top. So why bother? Plus there was a slight disagreement over color!

For my last ten working years I had a new company car every year. That may be why the new car experience is not a big draw for me.

 

[Texas Proud]

I just never felt I could go wrong buying a new set of Michelins.

I can!!!

I bought some for my car... supposed to be 60K miles... I got a whopping 30K... sure, I got 'some' off my next set but still had to pay full price on mounting/balance/installation....

I bought my sister's car at 12K miles with OEM Michelin... supposed to last 35K miles if I bought them after market.... were worn out at 18K... they did not want to do anything as they do not have a mileage warranty on OEM... got lucky and got a credit for new tires if in their brand family... still full price for mounting etc...

The best I have had were Yokahama or Kuhmo... but even they have bad tires if you look at reviews..

 

[frank]

Those who bought extended warranties were they OEM or aftermarket warranties?

I always buy the manufacturers oem warranty. I did not buy it from the dealer where I purchased the vehicle though. I got my toyota platinum extended warranty at 10 years and 125k miles for 1725 dollars compared to the 4000 my dealer wanted. you don't have to buy the oem warranty from the dealer that sells you the car, there are dealers that specialize in car warranties and are actual factory warranty.

 

[wrigley]

We bought a new 2023 Buick Enclave last year and really like it. Our 2011 Tahoe was still in very good condition but it was starting to have intermittent electronic issues. You know the kind that the dealer can't figure out and just wants to start replacing $1000 parts and hope for the best.
The Buick has a 36k/3 year warranty. We're hoping for the best but after the warranty expires what to do? In the past I've kept cars 10 years but that's because I could work on most systems. Now you pop open the hood and just see plastic pieces covering everything. Most cars engine and transmissions are lasting longer than ever now but it's the computerized everything that's integrated that's the problem. I'm capable of changing out most things in older cars but on new cars these parts need to be re-calibrated by the dealer. Everything is proprietary now.
So we're thinking when the warranty expires either buying a fully extensive warranty (if we can find one that covers everything) or just leasing the next car. I'm 70 so the end of my driving days are on the horizon.
Thoughts?

My FIL drove until he was 92. My MIL took his license away from him because he kept bringing the car home with dents and dings he couldn't explain. He lived until 95.

 

[VanWinkle]

I don't buy extended warranties on cars. I do regular maintenance and do not have service problems. Some of that is luck and some is buying the most reliable cars(Toyota and Honda). We own a Buick also, but it hardly gets driven as a second car. DW already likes the Honda better.

 

[Mr._Graybeard]

I can!!!

I bought some for my car... supposed to be 60K miles... I got a whopping 30K... sure, I got 'some' off my next set but still had to pay full price on mounting/balance/installation....

I bought my sister's car at 12K miles with OEM Michelin... supposed to last 35K miles if I bought them after market.... were worn out at 18K... they did not want to do anything as they do not have a mileage warranty on OEM... got lucky and got a credit for new tires if in their brand family... still full price for mounting etc...

The best I have had were Yokahama or Kuhmo... but even they have bad tires if you look at reviews..

My problem with Michelin is that the rubber seems to harden more than other brands as the tire ages. A set of Primacy MX4 tires I had developed cracking where the tread meets the sidewall, and wet traction fell off dramatically. Contis and Generals are usually my choice, although I'm not attached to any one brand.

As for new vs. used, The concern I have buying a used car these days is the maintenance history. Did the direct-injection turbocharged engine get regular oil changes? What type of gasoline did the previous owner use? Did he/she get the 10-speed transmission serviced, or just buy into Ford's 150k-mile maintenance recommendation? Drivetrain components are maxxed out these days, and new engines and transmissions aren't cheap.

One problem some GDI engines have is low-speed preignition. That can damage pistons over time. I often shift into sport mode if I feel the engine lugging a bit around town -- keep the revs moderately high for the engine's sake. I also burn midgrade gas even though the manual says Regular is OK. Oil rated SP by the American Petroleum Institute is supposedly formulated to minimize knocking. Motorcraft synthetic blend oil that my local dealership routinely uses for oil changes is only rated SN. Go figure. I DiY with Kirkland's SP rated 5w30.

When I bought my Ford Ranger in 2021, I special-ordered it to avoid the advanced infotainment, climate control, lane-deviation, etc. Keep it simple. It also kept the cost down around $30k, even with 4wd, tow package and locking differential.

 

[Teacher Terry]

When my friend couldn’t drive because of Alzheimer’s I bought her Toyota Corolla that 8 years old with 27k miles. It now is 17 years old and has 72k miles. It’s only needed tires and brakes. I’m guessing at 70 this will be my last car. My mechanic said it doesn’t have leaks and is in great shape.

 

[Mr._Graybeard]

When my friend couldn’t drive because of Alzheimer’s I bought her Toyota Corolla that 8 years old with 27k miles. It now is 17 years old and has 72k miles. It’s only needed tires and brakes. I’m guessing at 70 this will be my last car. My mechanic said it doesn’t have leaks and is in great shape.

We have a 2007 Toyota as well, a Prius. It has needed a little work but is fundamentally a very reliable car. DW loves it and will drive it until it can't go anymore.