Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) Habit; an After-Action Report.

[PatrickA5]

I also have been taking what I call a "blue pill" most nights. I used to take the Tylenol PM, but switched over once I found the pills without the Tylenol.

Some nights I forget and I don't recall having problems getting to sleep, but I should probably quit altogether.

 

[Koolau]

I also have been taking what I call a "blue pill" most nights. I used to take the Tylenol PM, but switched over once I found the pills without the Tylenol.

Some nights I forget and I don't recall having problems getting to sleep, but I should probably quit altogether.

I don't think I'd take anything unless and until I couldn't sleep during a particular night. "Planning" that I would need something to sleep seems like a "habit" which I don't want to have for sleeping. BUT as mentioned, I don't usually have issues with sleeping, so I'm probably sharing my ignorance rather than helping.

 

[GenXguy]

I've been taking Magnesium Glycinate at bedtime with good results.

This was one of the many supplements I tried. Took up to 400 mg with zero effect on sleep. It was as worthless as melatonin, OTC sleep meds, Hydroxyzine, and Trazodone for me. Ambien worked nicely to knock me out, though, and Quviviq seems to help for about half the night. Personally, based on the Ashton equivalency scale, Ambien had more effectiveness for getting me to sleep than equivant potency benzo meds Xanax and Ativan, but Ambien has a shorter half life, which was fine since I was taking it past the half way point of my sleep sublingually and didn't want morning grogginess.

Someone on here mentioned a while back they were prescribed Gabapentin and that it worked better than anything else they had tried (not sure what they had tried). My doctor didn't want to prescribe it for me for sleep, even though it commonly is used off-label for sleep.

 

[aja8888]

I just go to bed and sleep well without drugs. been lucky, I guess. In the last 5 years of my sleep monitoring, I am averaging right at 7 hours of sleep per night.

 

[reneeh63]

How exactly does one prove something to be non-causal when it is correlated.

There are any number of ways - what's key is that credible, good quality studies are undertaken - here are a few ways to test:

1. Temporal Precedence: Ensure that the cause precedes the effect in time. This can often be established through longitudinal studies or time-series analysis.
2. Control for Confounding Variables: Identify and control for potential confounding variables that may influence both the independent and dependent variables. This can be done through experimental design (randomized controlled trials), statistical controls (regression analysis), or matching techniques.
3. Manipulation of the Independent Variable: In experimental research, manipulate the independent variable to observe changes in the dependent variable. This is a strong method of establishing causation, as it helps to rule out other factors.
4. Strength of the Association: Examine the strength of the correlation. A strong correlation may suggest a causal relationship, but it is not definitive on its own.
5. Dose-Response Relationship: Look for a dose-response relationship, where changes in the independent variable lead to changes in the dependent variable. If increasing the cause leads to a greater effect, this supports causality.

If good quality studies attempting the above are done and fail, that is at least an indication that there's not a causal relationship. Of course you can't utterly prove a negative but it's all about the probability and what is plausible vs. not.

 

[GrayHare]

Ambien and Gabapentin operate via gaba receptors. So does OTC valerian.

 

[GenXguy]

Ambien and Gabapentin operate via gaba receptors. So does OTC valerian.

That is NOT true for Gabapentin, although the name may cause confusion about that.

 

[GrayHare]

That is NOT true for Gabapentin, although the name may cause confusion about that.

You are correct. I should have said both have CNS depressant effects though via very different mechanisms. Valerian is more like Ambien in its action on the GABA A receptor.

 

[Texas Proud]

I have problems getting enough sleep... but do go to sleep OK..

But do have to nap during the day more than I wish...

I do take benadryl mostly for allergies... I get clogged nose often... not horrible allergies like when I was young, but where I cannot breath easily...

 

[folivier]

For those with severe allergies do a bit of research with your doctor about taking Singulair daily. It has helped me quite a bit. Started taking about 3 years ago and while I still might get the crud it is less of a problem and much less frequentliy.

 

[stepford]

If good quality studies attempting the above are done and fail, that is at least an indication that there's not a causal relationship. Of course you can't utterly prove a negative but it's all about the probability and what is plausible vs. not.

I don't mean to beat a dead horse here, but if the correlation is strong it's hard for me to think of a proof of non-causality that would satisfy these criteria.

 

[stepford]

Someone on here mentioned a while back they were prescribed Gabapentin and that it worked better than anything else they had tried (not sure what they had tried). My doctor didn't want to prescribe it for me for sleep, even though it commonly is used off-label for sleep.

Both DW and I have been prescribed 300mg Gabapentin as a sleep aid. We find it effective (though not as much as 12.5mg extended release Ambien). I try never to use either for more than two nights in a row to avoid habituation.

 

[GenXguy]

Both DW and I have been prescribed 300mg Gabapentin as a sleep aid. We find it effective (though not as much as 12.5mg extended release Ambien). I try never to use either for more than two nights in a row to avoid habituation.

12.5 mg is a pretty big dose for Ambien, so I can see tolerance building, but I can see the need for the bigger dose if you are taking it at bedtime hoping it helps all night. My typical overnight (early morning) sublingual dose of Ambien is about 1.4 mg with some variation because I break a 10 mg pill into 6 to 8 pieces. Occasionally I took 2 pieces. But now, I'm down to my saved stash of about 100 pills, so I'm taking it infrequently to make it last. I don't know if my doctor would prescribe again, especially since he prescribed Quviviq in its place, and I'm not sure whether I want to give it up.

It's kinda ironic that my doctor wouldn't prescribe Gabapentin despite it being used off-label for insomnia, yet he had no problem prescribing Quviviq from a one page advertisement I showed him when he had never heard of it.

Quviviq supposedly doesn't build tolerance, but I'm not even sure how much it's helping me since I'm still having trouble sleeping that last hour or two and still average close to 6 hours rather than 7+ that I would prefer. One of these days, I'll try to skip it a few times and see what happens. It's meant to be taken every night to be effective.

Here's a little chart I recently put together with the "assistance" of ChatGPT of OTC and pharmaceutical medications (not supplements/herbs/vitamins). It's not entirely complete, like I don't list every benzodiazepine available, don't break down Ambien into the extended release version, don't list another older DORA med, etc., plus some specific conditions can lead to insomnia that could benefit from other meds not listed. Of course, no one should make a decision on this chart alone and should look into anything of interest more carefully and talk to their doctor.

Medication	Drug Class	Effectiveness	Sedation	Half-Life (hours)	Tolerance Potential	Notes
Amitriptyline	Antidepressant	Sedating at low doses, good for pain/insomnia	High	~10-50	Low	Often used for insomnia related to pain or depression.
Doxepin	Antidepressant	Sleep maintenance; minimal grogginess	Moderate to High	~15	Very Low	FDA-approved for insomnia (low doses: 3-6 mg).
Trazodone	Antidepressant	Common off-label insomnia treatment	Moderate to High	~7-9	Low	Can cause morning grogginess.
Mirtazapine	Antidepressant	Sedating at low doses	Very High	~20-40	Low	May cause weight gain and daytime drowsiness.
Promethazine	Antihistamine	Sedating; strong antihistamine	High	~10-14	Low	More sedating than hydroxyzine; anticholinergic effects.
Hydroxyzine	Antihistamine	Sedating; useful for anxiety/insomnia	Moderate	~20-25	Low	Can cause next-day drowsiness.
Diphenhydramine	Antihistamine (OTC)	Effective but tolerance builds quickly	Moderate to High	~4-9	High	Best for short-term use; grogginess common.
Doxylamine	Antihistamine (OTC)	Stronger and longer-lasting than diphen.	High	~10	High	Grogginess likely; tolerance develops.
Clonidine	Alpha-2 agonist	Lowers blood pressure; sedating effect	Moderate	~12-16	Moderate	Often used for withdrawal symptoms; mild sedative effects.
Guanfacine	Alpha-2 agonist	Similar to clonidine	Low	~17	Moderate	Used off-label for sleep in ADHD and anxiety.
Gabapentin	Anticonvulsant; Neuropathic	Helps sleep disturbances related to nerve pain	Moderate	~5-7	Low	Used off-label for insomnia related to pain.
Pregabalin	Anticonvulsant; Neuropathic	Similar to gabapentin, more potent	Moderate	~6-7	Low	Often used for anxiety and pain-related insomnia.
Quviviq	DORA	Sleep onset and maintenance	Low to Moderate	~8	Very Low	Minimal risk of dependency or next-day drowsiness.
Dayvigo	DORA	Similar to Quviviq, but longer-acting	Low to Moderate	~17-19	Low	May cause next-morning drowsiness.
Seroquel	Antipsychotic	Sedating at low doses	High	~6-7	Low	Side effects limit long-term use; may cause weight gain.
Ramelteon	Melatonin agonist	Regulates sleep-wake cycles	Very Low	~0.3	Very Low	Best for circadian rhythm disturbances.
Clonazepam	Benzodiazepine	Sleep onset, anxiety-related insomnia	Moderate	~18-50	Moderate	Long duration; Anxiety relief; Sleep aid
Ativan	Benzodiazepine	Sleep onset; anxiety-related insomnia	Moderate to High	~10-20	Moderate	Mid duration; Anxiety relief; Sedative at higher dose
Temazepam	Benzodiazepine	Sleep onset and maintenance	Moderate to High	~8-15	Moderate	FDA sleep approved
Xanax	Benzodiazepine	Sleep onset; anxiety-related insomnia	Moderate	~11-16	High	Rapid relief of anxiety; Sleep aid, High dependency risk
Triazolam	Benzodiazepine	Rapid onset; short duration	High	~1.5-5.5	High	Short duration, Rapid onset, High dependency risk
Sonata	Z-drug	Rapid sleep onset, short duration	Low to Moderate	~1	Low	Very short half life; Best for middle-of-night insomnia
Ambien	Z-drug	Sleep onset/maintenance	High	~2.5-3	Moderate	Effective with short half life; sublingual for middle-of-night insomnia
Lunesta	Z-drug	Sleep onset/maintenance	High	~6	Moderate	May cause next-day drowsiness; Higher risk of tolerance among Z-drugs.
Ketamine (micro)	NMDA Receptor Antagonist	Sleep onset/maintenance	Moderate	~2.5-3	Low	Sublingual microdosing

 

[stepford]

12.5 mg is a pretty big dose for Ambien, so I can see tolerance building, but I can see the need for the bigger dose if you are taking it at bedtime hoping it helps all night.

Standard Ambien 5 mg is quite effective at putting me to sleep. The problem is I pop up like toast 4 hours later. The 12.5 mg extended release form is actually a bit more mild in its onset than the standard 5 mg. It just allows for a longer night's sleep.

 

[Sojourner]

I've suffered from middle-of-the-night insomnia for many years now, and have tried several sleep aids with varying degrees of success. The best one I've found so far is zaleplon (generic form of Sonata), but I try not to take it more than twice a week on average. Xanax is by far the best drug for "sleep onset" that I've tried, but I only use it when absolutely necessary because of how it disrupts sleep architecture. I haven't had much success at all with OTC sleep aids. They either don't work well for me (melatonin, diphenhydramine) or I quickly develop tolerance and they become ineffective within a few days (doxylamine).

One of my resolutions for 2025 was to really work at reducing my dependency on pharmaceutical sleep aids, and it's going fairly well. Once I get to the point of having to take zaleplon no more than once a week on average, I'll be a happy camper.

Has anyone tried valerian as a sleep aid or to help with anxiety? I've been meaning to give it a try for some time now, but just haven't gotten around to it.

 

[GaryInCO]

I was having some trouble with sleep -- no problem going to sleep, but waking about 2-3am and couldn't get back to sleep. I found a solution: cannabis. I keep a pen vape by my bed, and if I can't get back to sleep I take a hit or two. Not enough to really feel high, but just enough to relax me. Next thing I know, it's morning.

 

[Gumby]

My cats are quite soporific.

 

[AudiDudi]

I was prescribed Gabapentin for back pain - didn't do much for that but did make me sleepy initially. Didn't take it for long (maeay a year) Now, I go to bed when I get tired and get up when I'm not.

 

[Koolau]

My cats are quite soporific.

Probably the diphenhydramine you take for cat allergies!

 

[Koolau]

I was prescribed Gabapentin for back pain - didn't do much for that but did make me sleepy initially. Didn't take it for long (maeay a year) Now, I go to bed when I get tired and get up when I'm not.

I was taking huge amounts of Gaba for back pain before my neurostimulator install. (2000 to 2400 mg)! VERY mild sleepiness ensued but I timed it so as not to be much of an issue.