Does putting in a backyard alter the grading / slope of the lot? Neighbor claims we are flooding his yard.

[Blanche]

New homeowner, living in a new construction. It came with dirt in the backyard. We installed a nice landscaping - pavers and some dirt at the back & near the fence lines for some plants. New neighbors moved in right next door just recently. Now, they tell us that we are "flooding" their yard.

I called the builder who promptly claimed that "putting in a backyard MAY alter the grading / slope of the lot", so they are not going to even bother to check in on it. We've had rains recently so I turned off the irrigation (Hunter X Core). But even with system turned off, it seems to have watered the plants.

Neighbor has dirt in the yard so far. Plans to install concrete in it. I am worried about liability for his yard being "flooded" with water from my lot. How do I diagnose and - most importantly - fix this? Any advice? Don't want a lawsuit on my hands and want to retain a decent relationship with neighbors (obviously).

 

[bjorn2bwild]

My last new construction home stipulated in the CC&R's that all yard drainage should be directed to the street.
I solved the problem by having the back yard graded to slope in that direction.
Additionally before landscaping, I dug trenches on both sides of the yard to the street and filled them with gravel and drain pipe.
In my case, all of the lots in the subdivision were elevated slightly above street level.

 

[engineernerd]

Well, if their yard is upslope from yours and you added a berm of dirt all along the shared property line that now blocks the path rainwater used to take to get across both your lots, then yes, your berm would be causing water to back up onto their lot. And they would have a legal case against you if that's the case. I'm not a lawyer but that's what I learned in engineering school.

I guess there are other possible situations, too, such as your berm guiding water flow onto their lot that previously flowed in a different direction. Basically, anything you do to change how water flows across your lot that adversely affects your neighbor is a problem.

 

[Blanche]

Looks like a "berm" is a raised bank? Then, I am not even sure if we have a "berm",

 

[Blanche]

My last new construction home stipulated in the CC&R's that all yard drainage should be directed to the street.
I solved the problem by having the back yard graded to slope in that direction.
Additionally before landscaping, I dug trenches on both sides of the yard to the street and filled them with gravel and drain pipe.
In my case, all of the lots in the subdivision were elevated slightly above street level.

How do I know for sure if this is an issue due to our backyard? And if so, how do I fix this now? I just don't want to make a bad situation worse. Also, if our responsibility, want to fix it before they pour concrete on their yard.

 

[Koolau]

How do I know for sure if this is an issue due to our backyard? And if so, how do I fix this now? I just don't want to make a bad situation worse. Also, if our responsibility, want to fix it before they pour concrete on their yard.

Your builder's reaction is typical. "It's not my fault - and I haven't even seen it."

 

[engineernerd]

Not sure what a "berm" is. It was all done by our landscaper. More important, how do I fix this?

A berm is an artificial ridge. Dirt dikes are large berms.

To figure out how to fix it, you have to see where water flows when it rains. Or guess, based on where you added dirt and made the ground higher than it was before.

 

[Blanche]

Well, if their yard is upslope from yours and you added a berm of dirt all along the shared property line that now blocks the path rainwater used to take to get across both your lots, then yes, your berm would be causing water to back up onto their lot. And they would have a legal case against you if that's the case. I'm not a lawyer but that's what I learned in engineering school.

I guess there are other possible situations, too,

A berm is an artificial ridge. Dirt dikes are large berms.

To figure out how to fix it, you have to see where water flows when it rains. Or guess, based on where you added dirt and made the ground higher than it was before.

Could it just be an overwatering the yard issue? I don't think there is a ridge or elevation of any kind.

 

[engineernerd]

Your builder's reaction is typical. "It's not my fault - and I haven't even seen it."

Ha, ha! What has me scratching my head is this is supposedly in high-regulation California yet the builder was allowed to sell the homes with bare-dirt backyards? I could see it in the desert, though.

 

[marko]

Similar situation with new construction. Neighbor was flooding us.

We had a French Drain installed at the property line and it diverts rain/irrigation runoff away and out to the conservation land behind us. Sort of a gutter if you will.

 

[engineernerd]

Could it just be an overwatering the yard issue? I don't think there is a ridge or elevation of any kind.

Your original post mentioned "some dirt at the back & near the fence lines," but if that only means you didn't pave those areas rather than that you spread dirt there that was somewhere else before, then maybe you are not responsible for the neighbor's problems. Hopefully you have before-and-after pictures? There are unfortunately people in this world who can't be pleased, and it is possible your new neighbors are that type.

If you have heavy clay soil or a shallow layer of caliche or something like that, it is possible that your automatic watering system combined with natural rainfall could have made the part of their yard near yours soggy, but it would be a stretch for that to amount to a legal case. Did you have an outsized water bill that month?

I should add that if you paved a large area where previously rainwater had soaked into the soil, that can cause rainwater to flow faster across the paved area, which can cause harm to a downslope neighbor. In my area there are limits on how much of your lot you can cover in "impervious surfaces" such as building roofs and pavement.

 

[ut2sua]

Ha, ha! What has me scratching my head is this is supposedly in high-regulation California yet the builder was allowed to sell the homes with bare-dirt backyards? I could see it in the desert, though.

You expect too much. A decently landscape/hardscape small backyard where I live can cost around 6 figure. Builder won't add that cost to already sky high home price.

 

[badatmath]

Ha, ha! What has me scratching my head is this is supposedly in high-regulation California yet the builder was allowed to sell the homes with bare-dirt backyards? I could see it in the desert, though.

AZ does this too. Is it not common everywhere?

 

[Blanche]

Your original post mentioned "some dirt at the back & near the fence lines," but if that only means you didn't pave those areas rather than that you spread dirt there that was somewhere else before, then maybe you are not responsible for the neighbor's problems. Hopefully you have before-and-after pictures? There are unfortunately people in this world who can't be pleased, and it is possible your new neighbors are that type.

If you have heavy clay soil or a shallow layer of caliche or something like that, it is possible that your automatic watering system combined with natural rainfall could have made the part of their yard near yours soggy, but it would be a stretch for that to amount to a legal case. Did you have an outsized water bill that month?

No, I did not have an :"outsized" water bill. However, the bill was higher than for the last two months because the builder's rep came around and increased the irrigation time for the plants in my front yard after I complained that they looked very ill. That could be it.

Can I DM you, please?

 

[Blanche]

Similar situation with new construction. Neighbor was flooding us.

We had a French Drain installed at the property line and it diverts rain/irrigation runoff away and out to the conservation land behind us. Sort of a gutter if you will.

Hi, I realize time and location matters, but how much does it cost? My plan - to keep relations with neighbor good - is to offer to install a French drain for them, if this does turn out to be something we caused.

 

[marko]

Hi, I realize time and location matters, but how much does it cost? My plan - to keep relations with neighbor good - is to offer to install a French drain for them, if this does turn out to be something we caused.

It was part of a larger landscaping/garden project but I'd guess it would run about $800/$1000 (nothing is cheap anymore). It only took them a few hours; dig a shallow, narrow trench the length of the line, fill it with gravel, install a plastic pipe. I'd imagine most landscapers would know how to do this.

 

[Ronstar]

Have a topographical survey done (your backyard and his) to see if existing grades support his claim that you are flooding him out.

 

[Blanche]

Have a topographical survey done (your backyard and his) to see if existing grades support his claim that you are flooding him out.

Hi, what sort of professional should I hire to get this done?

 

[skyking1]

Any professional with an eye for grading can help you with this. It could be a landscaping company that understands your problem. I would not even hazard a guess without a whole bunch of very specific pictures, and diagrams and measurements over the internet.
I'd have to be there.
Without more info any speculation is pointless.

 

[SnowballCamper]

Most building code regulations have a provision that kicks in when so many cubic feet of dirt is moved, and possibly when you increase impermeable surface. If you're in compliance with the building code and environmental regulations, I'm not sure what the problem is. I wouldn't waste money/time.

 

[marko]

Have a topographical survey done (your backyard and his) to see if existing grades support his claim that you are flooding him out.

Or just go over a see if your soil/water is running over the next time. Should be easy to see where/if the runoff is and where it's coming from.

 

[Ronstar]

Hi, what sort of professional should I hire to get this done?

A civil engineering firm

 

[Jerry1]

How do you know that the water didn't drain in that direction naturally - before any building? My guess is that you or the new neighbor don’t know. If the properties are all new, maybe the neighbor needs to do his landscaping before you know exactly where you stand and what you're dealing with.

Personally, I'd get a person from the government to help better understand the situation. In my area, that would be the county that controls water flow. Generally, there's a natural path that water will take and, as a home owner, you're not supposed to interfere or redirect that path. It sounds like you're willing to do some reasonable accommodations so I would engage the neighbor in an effort to first truly understand what's going on and then to see if together you can come to a reasonable solution.

One property I had just held water. It was on clay and there was no where for the water to go. I would have liked to redirect the water, but that was not allowed. Take some time and work with the neighbor expressing to them how critical it is to understand what is actually happening and whether or not something has changed. I seriously doubt that your landscaping changed the natural flow of water unless, as mentioned above, you did something significant like install a berm or a swale.

 

[Sunset]

I'd look to see what is the water doing when it rains heavily, where does it flow.
If it looks like it's not flowing to city drains/road , where is it supposed to flow ?
I'd ask the city to come look to see and give their opinion,

Also you don't mention how much dirt you put along the fence, was it an inch or 2 feet ? A big difference.

Finally both you and neighbor are new, no way neighbor knows from years of experience which way the water flows, maybe it's just water off the neighbors roof going too close to their foundation (no pipes leading it away) that is causing the issue.

 

[Texas Proud]

Hi, what sort of professional should I hire to get this done?

Or make HIM do the survey....

You said he moved in after you had your yard done... so there is no way to know what happened before!!!

My neighbor's backyard floods and eventually will run by their back door... across their driveway and then to my driveway to the street... to me it is their problem...

I have installed a drain for my backyard as mine used to run like a river along the side of the house..