Does solar payoff in a reasonable time, or at all?

[GrayHare]

I, too, have heard from people who report, "Solar is great! My electric bill was only $30 last month!" but who omit they also pay $300 per month to the installers. When the math is done correctly, it takes a high utility rate and/or good sunshine to make solar reasonably pay for itself.

There can be non-financial benefits, of course, such as creating less CO2, and having electricity during a utility outage provided one's system has storage. The latter has its limits, however. During extended utilty outages around here, the communications infrastructure also fails because its battery backups exahust within a few hours. So, I might have plenty of electricity but there's no phone power, no cell service, no internet, etc.

 

[jollystomper]

I live in a part of the country with a bunch of wide open nothingness. Our power plant has a lot of that land around it. I would rather see solar panels installed on the ground out there than on houses. Even if that means we buy into it as consumers. Putting panels on houses here seems crazy to me. It would have to be much more cost effective to do a massive land based install.

Here in the Mid-Atlantic area we are getting less solicitations for solar panel installation and more solicitations for buying into a "community solar grid" as you describe. The panels are being put on farmland. I cannot remember the terms off the top of my head, but they are currently more "interesting" than "compelling" to me.

 

[FIYes]

I have solar panels on my detached garage roof. I’m happy with the decision to purchase solar panels. I wouldn’t encourage anyone to purchase solar panels for purely financial reasons. Other financial products will have a greater return on your money. However, for me the incentive was not purely financial, so I’m happy with the limited returns.

I’m not DIY especially when it comes to electricity. I paid cash for the panels, no financing involved. When I was interviewing companies for the solar installation, the ones who were pushing financing seemed a little shady to me.

I don’t have a battery backup system. I’m interested in a battery backup but can’t justify the cost. My reason is that I would like to have some limited electricity during power outages. Of course, if the outage is during a winter snow storm when the panels are covered, it wouldn’t do me much good. We don’t get a lot of snow, but we do get some.

The past couple of weeks have been very hot and sunny. I’m grateful that my solar panels are helping with some of the air conditioning costs.

 

[Lewis Clark]

I once attended a seminar on solar systems. Don't recall who sponsored it but it was someone in the industry. The speaker mentioned that systems are more likely to pay for themselves if you are charging electric cars.

 

[surfFL]

There are solar collectors on many homes in my neighborhood, we have a solar salesman at the door more than once a month. I have ask on groups and personally for someone that keeps the records and does the math to show whether it is a good investment, or not.
No one, I have quizzed has done that, I suspect they don't want to know the answer. I have a friend that has a neighbor lady in her 70s, this female solar salesman became her best friend with multiple lunches and phones, until she was sold a $48,000 solar system, that does not include backup. The salesladt no longer calls. Her regular electric bill varies around $200 or $2,400 a year. Even a cash deal would seem to be a bad deal. If the $48k was invested at 5% it would pay the electric bill and you still have your $48,000. If it is financed, (which it was) it gets even worse. Clearly this is an outlier in cost (I think) but I still have no good analysis. I will say, several people have told my about their tiny $30 payment they pay to the electric company, but fail to discuss the payment to the finance company for the purchase of equipment. In Florida there are people saying they insurance companies either won't cover their house or there is a surcharge. It is one thing if you want to reduce carbon emissions or other green things, but, I'm not even sure that solar when run through the entire mining to disposal, that solar is really green.
Does anyone have evidence that their solar system was a good investment?

It depends how you compute your ROI:
1/ Just to offset you electrical bill may take several dozen of years

2/ To be energy independent in case of a grid outage; I've provided the my math in this thread: 5 years for me

This is what $15K in batteries looks like (for my solar panels)...

Life is pretty short and what else are you going to spend money on? I am a big fan of doing fun hobbyist stuff even if it really doesn't check the pure financial return box. I just ordered two more of the 200 watt CIGS solar panels you can roll up. Those bad boys are $400 a pop, but I have...

www.early-retirement.org

3/ To be energy independent for your (BEV) car. It depends what mpg your are getting with your (non BEV) vehicle, how many miles you drive per year, trade-in $ towards BEV, car insurance difference (if any, $0 for me), maintenance costs (big factor for me for the non BEV). I never computed this scenario. Only 2/

We have a great roof location for solar, but declined the sales pitches, because our roof was ~8 yrs old, and putting panels on the roof means extra cost when re-roofing to remove panels and then re-install them. Not a tiny effort.

Correct. Good Solar Installers will assess your roof age and upgrades if necessary. Mine was new (1-year) old. During Tesla Energy Site Assessment, they assessed that the S roof needed some reinforcement (to bear the weight for the solar panels), and added $250 (!) to the quote.

In addition, having a solar system on your roof generally does not add to the value of your home when you go to sell. In many cases, it's like a swimming pool as some buyers won't be interested in the house..

Untrue: look at RE data here

Homes With Solar Panels Sell for 4.1% More

Nationally, homes with solar-energy systems sold for 4.1% more on average than comparable homes without solar power. For the median-valued home, that translates to an additional $9,274. Nationally, homes with solar-energy systems sold for 4.1% more on average than comparable homes without solar...

www.zillow.com

There are solar collectors on many homes in my neighborhood, we have a solar salesman at the door more than once a month. I have ask on groups and personally for someone that keeps the records and does the math to show whether it is a good investment, or not.
No one, I have quizzed has done that, I suspect they don't want to know the answer. I have a friend that has a neighbor lady in her 70s, this female solar salesman became her best friend with multiple lunches and phones, until she was sold a $48,000 solar system, that does not include backup. The salesladt no longer calls. Her regular electric bill varies around $200 or $2,400 a year. Even a cash deal would seem to be a bad deal. If the $48k was invested at 5% it would pay the electric bill and you still have your $48,000. If it is financed, (which it was) it gets even worse. Clearly this is an outlier in cost (I think) but I still have no good analysis. I will say, several people have told my about their tiny $30 payment they pay to the electric company, but fail to discuss the payment to the finance company for the purchase of equipment. In Florida there are people saying they insurance companies either won't cover their house or there is a surcharge. It is one thing if you want to reduce carbon emissions or other green things, but, I'm not even sure that solar when run through the entire mining to disposal, that solar is really green.
Does anyone have evidence that their solar system was a good investment?

True: My homeowner insurance was asking for a surreal new premium for the solar panels + batteries, the dwelling for them was $110k more!!!! (As exposed I paid $45k for the solution).
So I did shop around (just Google it)

Florida Peninsula Insurance Company Begins Offering Coverage for Newer Solar Energy Panels - S. Florida Business & Wealth

New and existing policyholders with Florida Peninsula Insurance Company (FPI) can now obtain insurance for solar energy panels that meet its underwriting standards. Coverage applies to homes with panels installed

sfbwmag.com

I went with Florida Peninsula (as the underwriter)
a/ They do cover my solution
b/ Dwelling is + $75k
c/ Premium is exactly the same as the other insurance (w/o the solar panels + batteries)!!!

Other things to consider in Florida:

Florida Solar Incentives in 2025: Tax Credits, Net Metering, and More

Home solar panels and clean solar energy can make more sense in Florida with available tax credits, incentives, and net metering to save money.

palmetto.com

1/ Property Taxes exemption (unlike a Pool, a Fence, etc... addition)
2/ Sales Taxes exemption (Tesla Energy had me signed a doc for this!)

Best of luck with your analysis.

 

[dixonge]

Our landlord installed solar. No batteries, and no selling back to the utility (CFE, state-owned here in Mexico). If the main power goes off, so do the solar panels. Not sure why that compromise was made, but it was.

Having said that, our monthly bill has been between 60 and 65 pesos every two months. That's around $1.66 per month. We have fans for the warmer months, but no A/C. It's nice knowing that all of our daytime usage is free.

From my perspective, solar is great for small installs. Parking lot roofing, houses, apartment complexes, etc. At larger scales the value diminishes quickly. If I were king I'd set things up like this:

• Nuclear for regional power
• Small nuclear for specific high-powered things like military bases, data centers, etc.
• Solar for small-scale stuff
• Some gas as 'peaker' plants here and there

 

[RetMD21]

I'm producing what was predicted and the calculated payoff was 10 years. Nords link is great but if you don't want to input grid tilt and azimuth this link is a simplified site that will estimate for any US address. Project Sunroof Some door to door sales folks are scammers whether it is solar or something else.

 

[TheWizard]

I once attended a seminar on solar systems. Don't recall who sponsored it but it was someone in the industry. The speaker mentioned that systems are more likely to pay for themselves if you are charging electric cars.

And probably if you are charging batteries during the weekdays so they can charge the cars overnight...

 

[Aerides]

But as someone here used to say... having all these small systems on houses does not make sense... having a large array that is specifically designed for producing power is more efficient....

If you want to feel good about having a smaller footprint then buy 100% renewable... I have done that when it was cheaper than other options.. I have not when they try and up the price to try and sell to the people who want to reduce their footprint...

Right now they are cheaper than plans with less... but when I bought a year ago they were higher enough that I did not go with them.. just looked mine up... 24% renewable...

I am like the first example... no way one would pay for itself... but my house is so much in the shade it would not make sense if it were even cheaper... BTW, current bill is $167 which will be close to the largest bill I will get...

your state might have other options. Mine does not.

 

[Chuckanut]

I looked at solar panels, new windows, and a heat pump a few years ago. I considered them both from a “green” point of view and a financial point of view. Only the heat pump made sense. It added AC to my home. And it boosted my heating ability whenever the outside temp gets below 40 degrees.

None made sense from a purely financial point of view.

 

[Lawrencewendall]

put up 21 panels in 2015, directly southern facing. The company had a sole contract in my county so they offered them at a reduced rate. After the federal credit, the state credit and the county credit, they cost 10k. Based on what my utility company says I save every month and the yearly SRECs for 6Mw annually, they were paid off in 2020. Free money from here on out (until they stop working) Had one panel go out and the solar company replaced it with no questions asked. They've survived a couple of hailstorms. I'm satisfied for now.

 

[badatmath]

In addition, having a solar system on your roof generally does not add to the value of your home when you go to sell. In many cases, it's like a swimming pool as some buyers won't be interested in the house..

I vaguely recall someone I used to know saying it can be a real obstacle to a property sale as the panels are leased since you can't just sell them to the next owner (you don't own them). He wasn't known for bright financial decisions and said he regretted getting them.

 

[Downhillslide]

There are solar collectors on many homes in my neighborhood, we have a solar salesman at the door more than once a month. I have ask on groups and personally for someone that keeps the records and does the math to show whether it is a good investment, or not.
No one, I have quizzed has done that, I suspect they don't want to know the answer. I have a friend that has a neighbor lady in her 70s, this female solar salesman became her best friend with multiple lunches and phones, until she was sold a $48,000 solar system, that does not include backup. The salesladt no longer calls. Her regular electric bill varies around $200 or $2,400 a year. Even a cash deal would seem to be a bad deal. If the $48k was invested at 5% it would pay the electric bill and you still have your $48,000. If it is financed, (which it was) it gets even worse. Clearly this is an outlier in cost (I think) but I still have no good analysis. I will say, several people have told my about their tiny $30 payment they pay to the electric company, but fail to discuss the payment to the finance company for the purchase of equipment. In Florida there are people saying they insurance companies either won't cover their house or there is a surcharge. It is one thing if you want to reduce carbon emissions or other green things, but, I'm not even sure that solar when run through the entire mining to disposal, that solar is really green.
Does anyone have evidence that their solar system was a good investment?

Time2 - we installed a solar system in 2017. Our southern exposure, no trees, and lots of sun in the summer was ideal. I have kept meticulous records. The system generates 5500 kWh and we use $4500 kWh each year. Since 2017, the only electrical expense is $14/month admin fee by PGE. We save at least $900/yr. The $13,000 system cost us $2,000 after $11,000 in federal and state tax credits. We paid cash and own the system outright. We have only used about 50% of the tax credits. Still - we have saved $7200 to date and the system is showing no signs of degradation.

Our roof was 5 years old when they were installed. It is a 50 year architectural shingle roof, so I expect another 20 years before possible replacement. Fortunately, it is possible to replace most of the roof without interferring with the panels (I hope).

The excess 1,000 kWh were going to low income families until this year when we bought at EV. We'll charge the car using the solar credits or the actual power during the day. This will save another $1,000/yr in gasoline.

So, for us, it has been a good investment.

 

[ER2B]

We paid @10k for our solar panels after federal, Virginia state and county credits. My estimate is 10 years to get our money back. We are still paying about $8 per month for utility connection fees. Very satisfied so far with no problems. Our shingled roof was 3 years old when the panels were installed. Previous roof lasted 25 years. Looking forward to at least 20 more trouble free years. We love that we can crank up the AC in the summer, run electric heaters in the winter and charge our EVs when we need to without worrying. I believe there are psychological benefits with having solar. Our modest 12 panel system is turning 1 year old in August and we even have a surplus in power production. We’re over because we travel 4 times a year. Later when we slow down with travel, we won’t have a surplus anymore, but that’s what we want. The utility won’t buy our surplus power dollar for dollar. My advice to all is to get a system that matches as close as possible to your needs.

 

[Surewhitey]

Our landlord installed solar. No batteries, and no selling back to the utility (CFE, state-owned here in Mexico). If the main power goes off, so do the solar panels. Not sure why that compromise was made, but it was.

Having said that, our monthly bill has been between 60 and 65 pesos every two months. That's around $1.66 per month. We have fans for the warmer months, but no A/C. It's nice knowing that all of our daytime usage is free.

From my perspective, solar is great for small installs. Parking lot roofing, houses, apartment complexes, etc. At larger scales the value diminishes quickly. If I were king I'd set things up like this:

• Nuclear for regional power
• Small nuclear for specific high-powered things like military bases, data centers, etc.
• Solar for small-scale stuff
• Some gas as 'peaker' plants here and there

That's awesome. CFE really sticks it to you with their tiered system and locking it for 6 months if you creep into the next one. We had friends who sold their condo in Playa del Carmen (they added solar) & didn't feel they got a premium for this.

We have 2 massive trees that provide us mega shade so it has next to no benefits for us. Plus our rate is locked up for 3 years @ $.119/kwh, including the delivery... I try to hedge with the longer contracts...

 

[surprising]

In addition, having a solar system on your roof generally does not add to the value of your home when you go to sell. In many cases, it's like a swimming pool as some buyers won't be interested in the house..

Not so! The slick solar guy trying to sell us solar said it adds significant value to the house!

 

[Zathras]

I, too, have heard from people who report, "Solar is great! My electric bill was only $30 last month!" but who omit they also pay $300 per month to the installers. When the math is done correctly, it takes a high utility rate and/or good sunshine to make solar reasonably pay for itself.

There can be non-financial benefits, of course, such as creating less CO2, and having electricity during a utility outage provided one's system has storage. The latter has its limits, however. During extended utilty outages around here, the communications infrastructure also fails because its battery backups exahust within a few hours. So, I might have plenty of electricity but there's no phone power, no cell service, no internet, etc.

All in, our system cost $0,12/ kWh (based on expected lifetime production of the panels). Our retail rate at the time was $0.11/kWh.

I am guessing you have heard of airlines locking in the price of fuel by buying many months of fuel at once? That is part of what you are doing, locking in the price for 25-30 years.

Rebates and incentives also play a big role in the payback period.
In my case, we got the federal tax rebate, net-metering agreement with the utility and a production incentive which is about 25% of the original cost.

So a blanket statement of ‘it is a great investment’ or ‘it can’t make financial sense’ are both wrong if you don’t take into account available incentives.

In the last 9 years, electricity costs have increased in my area about 25%-30%. My costs have stayed flat.

I also agree with those that mentioned large solar farms being more efficient than rooftop solar. It definitely is.
However, rooftop does have some advantages.

First, it helps protect shingle roofs. At our last house, we had a. Hail storm that damaged many roofs. Ours was mostly untouched and the panels held up great.
Second, it is a great power source for backup power.
My backup will last for a week in the winter, and basically all spring, summer and fall.

To the OP, we installed a 19kW system in 2016. It was predicted to reach payback in 2024. It reached break even in 2023 as we used less electricity than expected.

 

[DallasGuy]

As often as we get hail in the Dallas, TX area, if it cost $10,000 to remove and reinstall the solar panels, I would NEVER get the pay back. Even if it was only $2,000-$5,000 to remove and reinstall the solar panels, I doubt, I'd see a payback in any reasonable time. I've been in my house for about 35 years and I'm on my 3rd or 4th roof (new shingles after hailstorm)....so it happens every 10-12 years on average. On top of the damage to the roof, you might see damage to the solar system as well. fyi. My electrical bill rarely goes over $100/month and in the moderate months is probably $50-80 range.

Is there anyone from the north Texas area that can comment on that? Or has installed solar in this area and has a better experience than my prediction for myself?

 

[Texas Proud]

I just want to point out that people who say that they drive their EV for 'free' are probably not... if you have net metering then you could have sold to the utility... so it is costing you something... probably still very cheap, but not free... plus you did not include the amortization of the system itself... but hey, what do I know..

BUT, my main reason for this post is a question....

Does anybody here with house battery also have an EV? Do you have the ability to use your EV battery as an additional batter for your house battery?

I have seen some battery systems that show you can recharge using grid, solar, generator and your EV... now that can be a really interesting system...

 

[Trailwalker]

Not so! The slick solar guy trying to sell us solar said it adds significant value to the house!

One of the houses that we were considering buying in Tucson had solar on the roof. In addition to the house price, he wanted the buyer to assume the rest of his $30,000 loan for the "owned solar." We passed it by, and it's still for sale. The other thing that worried me about solar was wind and hail damage, along with insurability.

 

[Music Lover]

It might take many years to break even, but if/when we do it, it won't be just for the dollars, as we like the idea of having a smaller footprint and being less dependent on the big energy companies.

Adding another system when the electrical company already has one connected to your house increases your footprint instead of reducing it.

Also, the manufacturing of many solar panels is not environmentally friendly.

We pay $.09 per KW hour so there's no payback for us, plus our grid is extremely reliable. I can understand it though if you're in an unreliable location or have high electricity prices.

 

[RetMD21]

Adding another system when the electrical company already has one connected to your house increases your footprint instead of reducing it.

I don't understand

 

[surprising]

One of the houses that we were considering buying in Tucson had solar on the roof. In addition to the house price, he wanted the buyer to assume the rest of his $30,000 loan for the "owned solar." We passed it by, and it's still for sale. The other thing that worried me about solar was wind and hail damage, along with insurability.

We spent probably an hour with a solar seller. I don't remember most of the details but I believe he said the loan payment moves to the new owner when sold. He also gave us so many assurances that I just didn't buy
- if we get a new roof, it's free for them to come uninstall and reinstall on the new roof
- total payments will be less than what we pay
- significant value add to the house
- solar works on cloudy days too (8 months of the year here) (true, but output is significantly reduced).

For the uninitiated, it sounds like a pretty good deal - get solar for free, pay a 'small' loan payment and get electricity for free. Reality doesn't seem so good to me. I also feel here in cloudy pacific NW we would pay more than regular grid for many months out of the year.

Now, the big issue here is that PGE has been raising rates significantly and will continue to do so. It is a concern, and perhaps solar would alleviate some of that eventually. We moved to their time of use plan that basically gets us to what we used to pay before they started raising rates, so that's a short term band aid.

 

[Golden Mean]

I vaguely recall someone I used to know saying it can be a real obstacle to a property sale as the panels are leased since you can't just sell them to the next owner (you don't own them). He wasn't known for bright financial decisions and said he regretted getting them.

I know when I was shopping for houses, one with a solar lease was on my not interested list very quickly.

 

[Music Lover]

I don't understand

Two sets of infrastructure (yours and the local utility) are required instead of just one. Plus the negative impact of solar panel construction and disposal.