Electric Vehicles - Models Discussion

audreyh1 said:
So the Honda 0 is a concept car? Oh, well.
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Honda says Prototype.. which I guess is more real than a concept.
The Honda 0 Series redefines mobility through a new approach to development: “Thin, Light, and Wise.” Blending intelligent technology with futuristic design, it challenges the conventional EV. Two exciting new prototype models, the Honda 0 SALOON and Honda 0 SUV, were unveiled at CES 2025, with production models coming in 2026.
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Honda is developing their own platform after using the GM Ultium for the Prologue.

They plan to only use this new EV platform for any new EVs.

There are rumors that they already have a CRV prototype using this new system with their own batteries, battery management, motors, etc.
 
RetMD21 said:
It seems that they're similar in size but the components of the bz3 will be Chinese (vs Japanese Aisin/Denso) It's supposed to have 600 km range, LFP battery and a Chinese self driving system. Also it looks much less ugly :)
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Thanks. I couldn’t find any details, apparently I didn’t look hard enough.
 
explanade said:
Honda is developing their own platform after using the GM Ultium for the Prologue.

They plan to only use this new EV platform for any new EVs.

There are rumors that they already have a CRV prototype using this new system with their own batteries, battery management, motors, etc.
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I think there's a big market for a CRV/Rav4 sized EV especially if built in the US. Tesla isn't competing in that segment and GM is building the Equinox and Blazer in Mexico.
 
BEV adoption, units and per capita, in the US still lags well behind China and Europe (notably Scandanavian countries). I was wondering why Toyota (after actively discouraging EVs), VW, Honda, BMW, Nissan, Audi and other legacy automakers seem to be actively trying to develop profitable EVs despite the relative lack of interest in US buyers - you need only look at their declining ICE and NEV business in China and Europe to see why. The USA is an afterthought for them, for now at least.

HEVs and PHEVs are growing in all markets as well, also at the expense of ICE units - they peaked worldwide in 2017...

Almost 14 million new electric cars1 were registered globally in 2023, bringing their total number on the roads to 40 million.

In 2023, just under 60% of new electric car registrations were in China, just under 25% in Europe, and 10% in the United States – corresponding to nearly 95% of global electric car sales combined. In these countries, electric cars account for a large share of local car markets: more than one in three new car registrations in China was electric in 2023, over one in five in Europe, and one in ten in the United States.
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Snapshot electric vehicle sales in 2024 vs 2023
  • Global: 17.1 million, +25%
  • China: 11 million, +40%
  • EU & EFTA & UK: 3.0 million, -3%
  • USA & Canada: 1.8 million, +9%
  • Rest of World: 1.3 million, +27%
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www.iea.org

Trends in electric cars – Global EV Outlook 2024 – Analysis - IEA

Global EV Outlook 2024 - Analysis and key findings. A report by the International Energy Agency.
www.iea.org www.iea.org
rhomotion.com

Over 17 million EVs sold in 2024 - Record Year

Rho Motion, the leading electric vehicle (EV) research house, today revealed that following the fourth successive global monthly record of passenger car and light-duty EV sales, 17.1 million units were sold in 2024. December 2024 resulted in over 1.9 million EV units sold, a growth of 5% on the...
rhomotion.com rhomotion.com
 

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I debadged my Model Y on Saturday, sad unexpected day. Probably makes no difference but I feel better. I'll leave it at that...
 
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Midpack said:
BEV adoption, units and per capita, in the US still lags well behind China and Europe (notably Scandanavian countries). I was wondering why Toyota (after actively discouraging EVs), VW, Honda, BMW, Nissan, Audi and other legacy automakers seem to be actively trying to develop profitable EVs despite the relative lack of interest in US buyers - you need only look at their declining ICE and NEV business in China and Europe to see why. The USA is an afterthought for them, for now at least.
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Between higher range requirements and larger vehicles, a car or truck for the US market will require about twice as much battery capacity as one for Europe or China. I suspect that, without serious efforts to reduce weight, the typical US market EV will ultimately require over 100 kWh in batteries.

In itself, that will delay adoption by a decade relative to otehr countries.
 
Out of Steam said:
Between higher range requirements and larger vehicles, a car or truck for the US market will require about twice as much battery capacity as one for Europe or China. I suspect that, without serious efforts to reduce weight, the typical US market EV will ultimately require over 100 kWh in batteries.

In itself, that will delay adoption by a decade relative to otehr countries.
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I actually disagree with that statement somewhat. If and when lower priced EV's and faster charging becomes more the standard in the US, there will not be the need to have 100kwh batteries. BYD is now coming out with vehicles that can be charged up in 5-10 minutes. Also, Chevy will be selling the Bolt later this year or early next for upper 20's to low 30's. They already sell the Equinox EV starting at around 35K. At that price, a range of 250-300 miles is usable for many people, especially if the charging eventually becomes faster. It's all a matter of the product availability at lower price points AND faster charging. With faster charging, people won't need larger batteries. Will it suddenly be all available next year, no , but give it 3-5 years and things will start to improve on those fronts. If BYD could sell their entry level lower priced products without outrageous tariffs being slapped on top of the prices in the USA, you'd see many more people driving EV's.
 
I will look at EV when the range and charging time improves for sure. I also want to see better adoption of repair ability, and insurability. I checked and would be paying a good bit more for insurance. Rationale from my insurance guy was accident repair costs.

I think the relative difference in interest (at this point in time) for Europe vs US (having lived in Europe for a couple of years) is the relative size and distance differences.

Flieger
 
Europe has two things we don’t have that favor EV purchases now versus waiting another decade or so.

1. A denser and closer population with very good public transit systems between many destinations.
2. A lack of the natural resources needed to economically power ICE engines.
 
There haven't been many smaller less expensive BEVs in the US. The Rav4 has been the top selling SUV with a wheelbase of 106 inches width 73 in length in 181 in versus 114, 76, and 187
Cargo capacity with the seats down is 69 vs 76 cubic feet
If Tesla makes the 20% smaller crossover that they have been taking about it will sell well. Especially if they can get it in thee 30-38 k price range of the Rav 4.
 
RetMD21 said:
There haven't been many smaller less expensive BEVs in the US. The Rav4 has been the top selling SUV with a wheelbase of 106 inches width 73 in length in 181 in versus 114, 76, and 187
Cargo capacity with the seats down is 69 vs 76 cubic feet
If Tesla makes the 20% smaller crossover that they have been taking about it will sell well. Especially if they can get it in thee 30-38 k price range of the Rav 4.
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The Chevy Equinox EV is 191 inches long approximately (longer than what you're looking for), but starts at $35k, so it's in the affordable price range that you mentioned.
 
Midpack said:
BEV adoption, units and per capita, in the US still lags well behind China and Europe (notably Scandanavian countries). I was wondering why Toyota (after actively discouraging EVs), VW, Honda, BMW, Nissan, Audi and other legacy automakers seem to be actively trying to develop profitable EVs despite the relative lack of interest in US buyers - you need only look at their declining ICE and NEV business in China and Europe to see why. The USA is an afterthought for them, for now at least.

HEVs and PHEVs are growing in all markets as well, also at the expense of ICE units - they peaked worldwide in 2017...
Click to expand...
I wonder if some of the reluctance to adopt BEVs in the USA is the extensive use by the public of independent repair shops here. I have not taken a car for repair at a dealership for over 40 years. The only reason I did that was for warranty repair w*rk. Are the dealers in OUS countries more "trusted" than dealerships in the USA? Or are independent shops in those countries less numerous?

My understanding is that independent shops are generally not yet set up for BEVs (except for minor things like tires, etc.). That would give me pause in selecting any current BEVs. YMMV
 

California Now Has Nearly 50 Percent More EV Plugs Than Gas Pumps​

And that's just public chargers. Add single-family home chargers to the mix, and EV plugs outnumber gas pumps by more than seven times, the state government boasts.
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I’m sure CA is ahead of other states, but they’ve made a lot more progress towards charging infrastructure than I realized. Yes charging is slower than pumping gas, but finding charging stations has become a non issue in more and more places. I know there have been 2-3X the number of Tesla chargers I needed on road trips I’ve taken in the east - planning a trip is effortless. Tesla chargers have been every 50-75 miles where I’m more than comfortable driving 150-200 miles between chargers if necessary, and my optimal range is 300 miles (no, I’d never push it that far). So “range anxiety” isn’t the issue many people think it is, though that’s by no means universal yet, e.g. large remote areas are definitely more challenging.

Loading…

www.caranddriver.com
 
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I think one of the reasons that EVs sell better outside the US is that gas costs are more so the economics favor an EV over ICE...

If everybody here had to pay 5X to 10X more for gas.... well...
 
The charging time is a total non-issue for us.

And “refueling” i.e. charging at home is so darn awesome. Still can’t get over it sometimes.
 
Texas Proud said:
I think one of the reasons that EVs sell better outside the US is that gas costs are more so the economics favor an EV over ICE...

If everybody here had to pay 5X to 10X more for gas.... well...
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Admittedly not every state has the same rate structure (I average about 7.5 cents per kWh at home 24/7), but if I had to ‘buy gas’ for my EV it would cost more than 5X what home charging costs me. Some states home rates are much higher, but there are other comparable states while others with off peak rates can offer similar savings. And those who can’t charge at home pay considerably more.
 
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Here are our numbers since switching from hybrid to EV in late 2023.
2023 electric $1619 + car gas $459 ; 2024 electric $1385 includes car charging.
We also switched to time of day rate plan for electric in 2024.
We also moved our water heating and clothes drying to the cheapest time rate about .09/kWh
We are driving about the same miles.
 
Midpack said:
I debadged my Model Y on Saturday, sad unexpected day. Probably makes no difference but I feel better. I'll leave it at that...
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Too bad. If it said Elon Musk on the car I’d probably have removed it but not the pretty T symbol. Everyone knows it’s a Tesla anyway by looks. So many around here now.
 
Midpack said:
Admittedly not every state has the same rate structure (I average about 7.5 cents per kWh at home 24/7), but if I had to ‘buy gas’ for my EV it would cost more than 5X what home charging costs me. Some states home rates are much higher, but there are other comparable states while others with off peak rates can offer similar savings. And those who can’t charge at home pay considerably more.
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Our electric rate is almost 5 times yours - highest in the nation. But we do have a lot of electric vehicles in the state. So they must be paying for themselves. Gas is about $4.75.
 
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