EV Models Excluding Tesla models

[Koolau]

My Lyriq goes 0-60 in 4.6 seconds.

Only one place I know to go 60 in my state. Doing it quickly will plant you squarely into someone else's bumper unless you do it at 2:00AM or later.

 

[DallasGuy]

I get a kick out of people bragging that their EV goes 0 to 60 in anything under 5 seconds....like when is that even that practical? Maybe when you're trying to merge onto the freeway? Or passing someone. But most of that extra acceleration power is pretty much not used most of the time....or not really needed. When you look at mid priced gas powered cars, 0 to 60 times of 6 seconds are considered fast but with an EV some people consider it somewhat ho-hum. Kinda funny actually.

 

[Koolau]

I get a kick out of people bragging that their EV goes 0 to 60 in anything under 5 seconds....like when is that even that practical? Maybe when you're trying to merge onto the freeway? Or passing someone. But most of that extra acceleration power is pretty much not used most of the time....or not really needed. When you look at mid priced gas powered cars, 0 to 60 times of 6 seconds are considered fast but with an EV some people consider it somewhat ho-hum. Kinda funny actually.

I like watching Youtube videos of EVs blowing the doors off hot ICE cars in the 0 to 60. I think the C-8 ZO6 will beat the Tesla with Ludicrous, but most ICE can't get the torque and tire hook-up just right to beat 0 to 60 against an EV. BUT some "hot" cars will beat EVs in the 1/4 mile as ICE have a lot more power and high end torque.

As to WHY you would want that capability in an EV? Why wouldn't you?

 

[audreyh1]

I get a kick out of people bragging that their EV goes 0 to 60 in anything under 5 seconds....like when is that even that practical? Maybe when you're trying to merge onto the freeway? Or passing someone. But most of that extra acceleration power is pretty much not used most of the time....or not really needed. When you look at mid priced gas powered cars, 0 to 60 times of 6 seconds are considered fast but with an EV some people consider it somewhat ho-hum. Kinda funny actually.

It’s really handy when you are trying to merge onto the freeway or pass someone.

It’s not like they had to do something special, it’s simply that the full battery power is available immediately, no delays, instant response, and this is very useful even though you don’t use it continuously.

 

[Koolau]

It’s really handy when you are trying to merge onto the freeway or pass someone.

It’s not like they had to do something special, it’s simply that the full battery power is available immediately, no delays, instant response, and this is very useful even though you don’t use it continuously.

I'd love to have that kind of torque available when trying to enter the H-1 Freeway at University Ave. I think I posted a picture of that exchange recently (it's the worst on-ramp in the USA).

 

[Zathras]

Agreed, I use that power rarely, but it is increadibly nice to have it when needed.
And since it is almost free, why not?

 

[explanade]

I did a Honda Prologue lease in December. They are aggressively pushing them.

Not my ideal car.

But there are more coming so by the time I get out of this lease, there should be some more options.

Sales of non-Tesla EVs bear watching these days.

Tesla sales are cratering in just about every region now, talking high double-digit declines. So are other EVs taking up the slack or is the whole category now going to see not only reduced growth but actual year over year sales declines, because tax credits may not last and now a program to build chargers may be revoked.

 

[Alan]

Overtaking tractors on country roads is when I appreciate the acceleration of my EV. We live in a rural area and encountering tractors on the winding hilly windy roads here is just something to expect.

 

[RetiredHappy]

Sales of non-Tesla EVs bear watching these days.

Tesla sales are cratering in just about every region now, talking high double-digit declines. So are other EVs taking up the slack or is the whole category now going to see not only reduced growth but actual year over year sales declines, because tax credits may not last and now a program to build chargers may be revoked.

The sky is not falling down.

 

[MichaelB]

A reminder this thread is about EVs other than Tesla

 

[aja8888]

It’s really handy when you are trying to merge onto the freeway or pass someone.

It’s not like they had to do something special, it’s simply that the full battery power is available immediately, no delays, instant response, and this is very useful even though you don’t use it continuously.

The diesels I drove for years had very high torque and acceleration was quite immediate. I don't see the instant acceleration of an EV (and I have one) as being a "new" thing for vehicles. It's just that 90% of the driving public has never had the experience of it. My old 1965 Corvette would easily slam your head back into the seat with absolutely no problem too.

 

[aja8888]

Agreed, I use that power rarely, but it is increadibly nice to have it when needed.
And since it is almost free, why not?

Nothing is free.

 

[audreyh1]

Nothing is free.

In this case it’s just a characteristic of an EV. Nothing was added to make it available.

 

[aja8888]

In this case it’s just a characteristic of an EV. Nothing was added to make it available.

It's a characteristic of any electric motor that runs on electrical power. Agreed that it's nothing new but its cost is the cost of the amperage required to spin it. The "fuel" is the thing that is not 'Free".

 

[2HOTinPHX]

It's a characteristic of any electric motor that runs on electrical power. Agreed that it's nothing new but its cost is the cost of the amperage required to spin it. The "fuel" is the thing that is not 'Free".

Also with quicker launches comes quicker tire wear which last time I checked tires are not free either.

 

[Chuckanut]

I get a kick out of people bragging that their EV goes 0 to 60 in anything under 5 seconds....like when is that even that practical?

Don’t some insurance companies raise premiums on high performance cars based upon factors like acceleration?

Electric motors have a very nice flat torque curve. And EV manufacturers have taken advantage of it to give us fast acceleration from slow speed. In fact, hybrids take advantage of it also. Using the electric motors torque to start moving from a stop allows the gas engine to be setup for better cruising mileage.

 

[Koolau]

In this case it’s just a characteristic of an EV. Nothing was added to make it available.

Electric motors produce their maximum torque at zero rpm. IOW their torque peaks when you floor it from a dead stop. The torque gradually drops off. Thus, off the line, they give it everything they have, unlike an ICE.

This is pretty much the opposite of an ICE engine that often peaks in torque somewhere around the mid range of rpm. With the ICE engine, lots of tweaks can change the shape of the torque curve - depending on what the car was designed for (drag racing or just normal driving).

All this to say, the new C-8 E-Ray sounds very interesting. It has an electric motor driving the front wheels and an ICE driving the rear wheels.

To keep this post in the spirit of non-Tesla EVs, the E-Ray has a "stealth mode." Use it if you want to leave your conservative (or sleeping) neighborhood without waking every person and dog. Only the EV portion of the drive train drives the car for up to a couple of miles or so.

 

[Koolau]

Our Consumer Reports just arrived this week. It contains an article on the fastest and slowest charging EVs. The numbers given are based on the availability of a 350 KW DC fast charging station. So it probably has no practical value to those who only charge at home over night. However, when one is on the road and not wanting to spend the bulk of their vacation at charging stations, the article might prove useful.

The charging rates are listed in terms of miles of range added per minute of charging. The rates start at 2.7 for a Nissan Leaf go all the way to 16.1 for a Tesla Model 3.

If I count correctly, 17 different models are listed. YMMV as they say.

 

[Koolau]

Another Consumer Reports article talks about "predicted reliability" for 2025 models. The criteria and caveats are listed in the article. The list contains EVs, hybrids and ICE.

If I count correctly, they list 25 models of EV. I was surprised to see that only one of the EVs made it into the top tier (green) or "well above average" - my words. That model was the BMW I4. Several models were in the "abysmal" range (also, my words).

My take is that the "predicted reliability" of 2025 EVs is dramatically worse than the collective ICE and hybrid population listed. I did not do a statistical analysis but the very lowest of the low scores were all EV with one ICE exception.

My experience over the years would validate (to me) the CR reliability scores as they survey vast numbers of owners every year.

I'm sure members here can find the March 2025 CR at their local library. I'm hoping that in the future CR will have a detailed breakdown (pardon the expression) of the reliability issues that made up the overall scores.

 

[explanade]

Not all EVs though have sub 6-second 0-60 acceleration though.

Some designers are making that choice and marketing the very fast acceleration, which used to be associated with super cars or motorcycles.

Also, now the fastest EVs are dual-motor -- and there's even talk of quad motor -- configurations, meaning you pay more for AWD and very fast acceleration.

It's usually a tradeoff too. With dual motors, you get a heavier vehicle and faster acceleration but you have slightly reduced range compared to the base models with a single motor.

So it's not inherently about electric motors, though they do have greater torque at lower RPMs.

I think the way the market evolved, the early EVs were sold for performance characteristics, to justify high prices -- approaching $100k -- because they couldn't produce in volume and sell more closer to $40-50k.

Now the market is segmenting between performance cars or models of the same range with dual motors and base models with single motors, greater range, lower prices.

There are some exceptions like the Volvo $40k model has very fast acceleration compared to other EVs in its price range.

 

[RunningBum]

Agreed, I use that power rarely, but it is increadibly nice to have it when needed.
And since it is almost free, why not?

Tire wear?

I definitely get how helpful it can be when merging or sometimes getting out of a jam. A couple years ago I was along side a semi in an interstate construction zone at night. We came over a hill and there was a truck stopped dead in the semi's lane. Luckily my Outback with turbo reacted quickly and I was able to accelerate out of the way so the semi could switch lanes in time. Would have been even better with an EV.

 

[warbial]

My take is that the "predicted reliability" of 2025 EVs is dramatically worse than the collective ICE and hybrid population listed.

I agree. The ICE industry has so much more experience in designing and building cars than EV manufacturers. As car manufacturers start rolling out their third and fourth generation cars, I expect the reliability to improve.

 

[Koolau]

I agree. The ICE industry has so much more experience in designing and building cars than EV manufacturers. As car manufacturers start rolling out their third and fourth generation cars, I expect the reliability to improve.

I agree that ICE technology is advanced and all that. Having said that, EVs are so much simpler with fewer internal parts and fewer peripherals to go wrong. So why do they have so many issues? Can it all be explained by the shorter learning curve. Probably, but still...

 

[warbial]

Having said that, EVs are so much simpler with fewer internal parts and fewer peripherals to go wrong. So why do they have so many issues?

They don't have issues with the motors or gears (mostly). They have issues with the battery management systems, which are very tricky hardware and software. Ford had problems with their High Voltage Battery Junction Box (HVBJB) the first few years of the Mach-E. Hyundai Motor Group struggled with battery problems in the Ioniq 5 and EV 6 before finally recalling 150,000 cars for Integrated Charging Control Unit (ICCU) failures. GM has been touting their Ultium batteries for so long, that they were obsolete before the first Ultium battery was sold, and they still can't manufacture them reliably. But the trend seems to be positive for all manufacturers, new and legacy.

 

[DallasGuy]

I was a little surprised to see that MotorWeek selected the 2025 Chevy Equinox EV as it's 2025 Best of the Year winner. After listening to their reasoning on the MotorWeek TV show, it makes sense...it's a very affordable EV, starting at about $35k, that can appeal to the "average" buyer and has a lot of features that make it an easy vehicle to drive without a huge learning curve. Here's an article about the selection. It will be nice when more automakers can produce vehicles with this amount of technology, range, and capabilities as well as appeal in this starting price range. And before people start saying that it's just the base price, Chevy does include a lot of features in their base models.

MotorWeek announces its 2025 Drivers’ Choice Awards Best of the Year: Chevrolet Equinox EV - MotorWeek

motorweek.org