I knew I'd get scammed by an eBay customer eventually...

[Midpack]

After 65 items sold and a perfect record, I finally got scammed. Buyer bought a lightly used Delta tabletop planer from me in like new condition. I sent it to him in the original Delta box with all the original Styrofoam inserts & plastic bags - so I know it was adequately packaged. He received it on 12/17. I sent him two courtesy emails, but he never bothered to reply. After a while I assumed all was well. The listing stated "No returns."

Yesterday I receive a claim from eBay, the buyer wants a full refund (purch price & shipping), the item is damaged He sent pictures and a major cast part is indeed badly broken, so it's ruined. eBay wants me to pay for return shipping - obviously there is no point in sending it back. However, the planer was pristine clean when I packaged it, in the pictures there appears to be some dirt and sawdust on it - but NOT sure what to make of that. So he never bothered to open the package until 45 days after he received it! In his claim, he says 'I would like to think you (me) did not know it was broken when you sent it.'

I emailed stating I would like to arrive at an amicable settlement, even though the listing was 'no return.' I asked why he didn't open it sooner, and did there appear to be any damage to the box? Now he is replying to emails, and promptly. He said it was a Christmas present to himself and he put it in his garage. Said the box didn't appear to be damaged. And he said, 'I didn't realize it was "no return" but I would like a full refund.'

At any rate, I've talked to eBay & UPS, and I know I am going to get $ hosed by a scam here, since it's impossible to prove anything. It is hard to believe it could have been dropped hard enough in the package to break a casting without damaging the box - but draw your own conclusions. His eBay rating is perfect, but then they've made it impossible for a buyer to get a bad rating.

Not asking for advice - just consider it a cautionary tale.

I think I've gotten my use from eBay anyway, so I may fight it even - if I'm banned from eBay, no biggie.

 

[travelover]

My condolences. If you sell on eBay long enough, it will happen. All I can say is charge a little extra when you can and stick in in the "scam fund" to cover these eventualities.

 

[Midpack]

Yeah, I was $4400+ ahead, looks like I'm gonna give back $230. That would be no problem if it was a legit return/claim, I have my doubts about this situation. But I'm not gonna bother to fight other than taking my sweet time responding...

 

[pb4uski]

Can a new part be obtained?

I think you could make a case that he signed for it and should have inspected it either before signing or promptly after receiving it.

OTOH, what motivation would he have to breaking it if it is no longer useable unless he was really using it and was careless and broke it and is trying to put it back to you or he had a similar unit and bought yours for the good part and is trying to pawn the damaged part back to you along with your unit.

No returns means no returns. His recourse is to UPS, not you. Was the item insured? If so, let him work it out with UPS.

 

[Midpack]

Can a new part be obtained?

I think you could make a case that he signed for it and should have inspected it either before signing or promptly after receiving it.

OTOH, what motivation would he have to breaking it if it is no longer useable unless he was really using it and was careless and broke it and is trying to put it back to you or he had a similar unit and bought yours for the good part and is trying to pawn the damaged part back to you along with your unit.

No returns means no returns. His recourse is to UPS, not you. Was the item insured? If so, let him work it out with UPS.

I suspect someone did use it, and dropped it, now they're trying to say it was damaged before they got it. The first thing UPS told me was it was probably a scam, and it happens to them with eBay sales all the time.

From what I read, the seller is responsible for the item through shipping. The buyer only takes responsibility after received, so it's usually up to the seller to initiate a damage claim with UPS - but that's hopeless (and they told me as much).

But again, I am not going to make a bigger deal out of this. There are scammers out there, I am not surprised I've finally run into one...

 

[Walt34]

I suspect someone did use it, and dropped it, now they're trying to say it was damaged before they got it.

Most likely. Those Stanley planes are pretty rugged and the only time I ever managed to break one was by accidentally knocking it off a table onto a concrete floor.

 

[travelover]

Most likely. Those Stanley planes are pretty rugged and the only time I ever managed to break one was by accidentally knocking it off a table onto a concrete floor.

Or the guy broke his own plane, then bought another like it and sent photos of his own, original broken plane to Midpack.

 

[easysurfer]

I never do understand the no returns thing on ebay. They buy can always file a claim against the seller, right or wrong.

 

[DrRoy]

Ebay's policies are very slanted toward the buyers and will over rule things like "no returns". They have changed over the years and you have to study up on them to see what the recent terms are.

 

[Amethyst]

It goes the other way, too. I bought a case (6 jars) of English marmalade from a supplier of UK foods (British Delights) and the box arrived with one jar completely smashed and the rest of the marmalade in a strange, syrupy condition with almost no orange peel (there is usually a lot of thick-cut peel). I sent them photos, and all they did was refund the (non-shipping) cost of the one smashed jar. After that, they ignored my letters and phone calls. What am I gonna do, sue them over 5 jars of marmalade?

This was their first time shipping via Amazon instead of direct to the customer, and they advised me to go to Amazon for satisfaction. But I had ordered the item during a one-month trial of Amazon Prime, and Amazon had already deleted the records of my order, since my one-month subscription had expired. So I was hosed in every direction. A truly determined person *might* have been able to track down somebody at Amazon to complain to, but I was dealing with multiple real crises at that time and lacked the energy. So it goes.

Amethyst

 

[braumeister]

Sorry for this unwarranted hassle. If I were you I would simply pay up to avoid the stress of fighting it.

I've bought and sold a lot of items on eBay for over 15 years, but I decided to quit last year. Partly because of this sort of thing, and partly because I hate PayPal so much (owned by eBay). Saving a few bucks on a purchase or making a few bucks on something I no longer need just isn't worth it any more.

 

[6miths]

Amazon deleted the records of your order?! I'm sure that Amazon knows what I had for breakfast 5 years ago Monday...

 

[6miths]

I've bought and sold a lot of items on eBay for over 15 years, but I decided to quit last year. Partly because of this sort of thing, and partly because I hate PayPal so much (owned by eBay). Saving a few bucks on a purchase or making a few bucks on something I no longer need just isn't worth it any more.

+1

Many years ago when eBay was young I really enjoyed using it as it had much more of a garage sale feel - although which much better stuff. That changed over the years with more and more big sellers and much more junk. Buy ultimately it was PayPal that was the final straw for me too.

 

[irishgal]

This will sound nuts, but after having been scammed for about $900 I now do this when I sell:
1. Take picture of item in box.
2. Take picture of box with address sticker, leave box open
3. Ask buyer to confirm (again) the address is correct, and the item is what they ordered
4. At post office, video with iPhone the box, still open with item visible, being handed to clerk, I ask clerk to tape shut. I continue to film until this is done.
5. I email buyer the tracking number, remind them it has to be signed for, and tell them that I have pictures and video of the undamaged (item name) at the post.

Never have the postal clerks even batted an eye, they have heard stories of Ebay sellers being scammed.

Only once did I get a buyer try to say the item she received was a "bag of kids socks", when in reality it was a designer bag. She filed a claim, I sent the pictures and video to Paypal and boom, it was decided in my favor.

 

[travelover]

This will sound nuts, but after having been scammed for about $900 I now do this when I sell:
1. Take picture of item in box.
2. Take picture of box with address sticker, leave box open
3. Ask buyer to confirm (again) the address is correct, and the item is what they ordered
4. At post office, video with iPhone the box, still open with item visible, being handed to clerk, I ask clerk to tape shut. I continue to film until this is done.
5. I email buyer the tracking number, remind them it has to be signed for, and tell them that I have pictures and video of the undamaged (item name) at the post.

Never have the postal clerks even batted an eye, they have heard stories of Ebay sellers being scammed.

Only once did I get a buyer try to say the item she received was a "bag of kids socks", when in reality it was a designer bag. She filed a claim, I sent the pictures and video to Paypal and boom, it was decided in my favor.

Interesting, but this would not have helped Midpack. The guy claims it was damaged in transit.

 

[aja8888]

Sorry to hear of the scam. It happens more frequently with eBay these days. I have been selling on eBay since 1998 when it was a great place to be. I'm done now, like others here. I got scammed on some U.S. Proof sets and someone did a switch return with a fairly rare coin . PayPal is worthless.

If I have a large item to sell now, it's done on local Craigslist with the usual precautions. Cash only, meet somewhere common and with a buddy.

 

[irishgal]

Interesting, but this would not have helped Midpack. The guy claims it was damaged in transit.

Yes, I read that. This was just a go-by for future selling for anyone.
I won't bother next time.

 

[travelover]

Yes, I read that. This was just a go-by for future selling for anyone.
I won't bother next time.

I found your post instructive. It is just sad that there seems to be no real way to avoid the hassle Midpack encountered.

 

[harley]

Amazon deleted the records of your order?! I'm sure that Amazon knows what I had for breakfast 5 years ago Monday...

They may know, but they don't necessarily want to tell you. I've had a number of issues with finding orders that weren't the normal completed orders. Especially cancelled orders, they just disappear. Someone recently posted a method of downloading a CSV file from Amazon that seems to have a lot of information you can't find on their web pages.

Regarding the OP, I do a lot of ordering for my small business, and I'll only order through eBay if I absolutely have to. I find the system difficult to deal with, and I'm with braumeister, I despise Paypal. I've had a few less than satisfactory experiences with Amazon, but they feel very professional to work with compared to eBay.

 

[Moemg]

I sold on ebay for ten years . I had a 14 day return policy . It really kept the scammers at bay because if they decided 30 days after the purchase there was a problem ebay always ruled against them.

 

[Midpack]

Sorry for this unwarranted hassle. If I were you I would simply pay up to avoid the stress of fighting it.

I've bought and sold a lot of items on eBay for over 15 years, but I decided to quit last year. Partly because of this sort of thing, and partly because I hate PayPal so much (owned by eBay). Saving a few bucks on a purchase or making a few bucks on something I no longer need just isn't worth it any more.

+1

Many years ago when eBay was young I really enjoyed using it as it had much more of a garage sale feel - although which much better stuff. That changed over the years with more and more big sellers and much more junk. Buy ultimately it was PayPal that was the final straw for me too.

+2, I'm no longer a fan of eBay/PayPal either, where I used to think it was a great service. I doubt I will ever try to sell on eBay again.

May be petty, but I've told eBay to hold off and I filed a claim with UPS. I will just follow the whole process - since the buyer claims he did not open the box until 45 days after he received it. Obviously he's in no hurry, though his email this afternoon was impatient (funny how responsive he is now...vs during the transaction). If I end up paying in full, I'm no worse off...and I could care less about my 100% perfect reputation on eBay anymore - it doesn't mean much.

 

[sengsational]

I forget what it was, but I sold something that I was concerned about getting scammed on the old switcheroo thing (they take a good part out of what I sold them, then return the thing with the broken part). So I made a tiny etching with my dremel tool in the one I sold and took a picture through my jewelers loup. The etching was barely visible in the auction pictures, but there would be no practical way to replicate the etching precisely. If the buyer wanted to return it, I planned to send the close-up picture and make sure that "the right one" was returned.

 

[Fermion]

What about taking a money order for an item and thus Ebay has no recourse for charging you back? (Might need to change your credit card number before Ebay can put a charge on it though)

 

[Sarah in SC]

The guy DH just sold his paramotor to (don't worry he's keeping the wing and kiting harness, Seng!) out in MN offered to videotape opening the box and taking it out, as protection for both parties. Seemed sensible, though I'd never heard of that kind of thing before.

Oh, and speaking of paramotoring, Sengsational, he's heading over to the UK for the weekend and will be flying (and staying) with Ben while he's there.

 

[bobandsherry]

It goes the other way, too. I bought a case (6 jars) of English marmalade from a supplier of UK foods (British Delights) and the box arrived with one jar completely smashed and the rest of the marmalade in a strange, syrupy condition with almost no orange peel (there is usually a lot of thick-cut peel). I sent them photos, and all they did was refund the (non-shipping) cost of the one smashed jar. After that, they ignored my letters and phone calls. What am I gonna do, sue them over 5 jars of marmalade?

This was their first time shipping via Amazon instead of direct to the customer, and they advised me to go to Amazon for satisfaction. But I had ordered the item during a one-month trial of Amazon Prime, and Amazon had already deleted the records of my order, since my one-month subscription had expired. So I was hosed in every direction. A truly determined person *might* have been able to track down somebody at Amazon to complain to, but I was dealing with multiple real crises at that time and lacked the energy. So it goes.

Amethyst

If this was shipped by Amazon (fulfilment by Amazon) and shipping if the problem then the seller is correct, you need to contact Amazon for resolution.

Now if item wasn't as described then that's sellers problem. Most will work with you rather than risk a negative on their seller account which could be detrimental to their account standing.

As for your records, Amazon keeps that info regardless if you were on a trial Prime subscription, I've never seen or heard they have purged a record of sale or shipment. Perhaps you didn't set the date range appropriate to your purchase period when you searched for your orders?