I may add more red meat to my diet

[athena53]

My iron runs high at the upper edge of the range. My Dr. said start donating blood, but with several bouts of melanoma the Red Cross won’t take it. The plan is if I go above the upper limit I go to a phlebotomist and they trash it.

This happened to DH. In his case he had polycythemia- bone marrow was making too many red blood cells. He also ended up having therapeutic phlebotomies and then medication (Hydroxyurea) and eventually ended up with acute myeloid leukemia. A friend is going through something similar- blood bank loved his blood, till the hemoglobin got out of bounds. He's also got a form of blood cancer and just went through stem cell treatments.

Too bad that they can't do something with this iron-rich blood to make it available to people who need it but I guess it's too much of a risk.

 

[Golden Mean]

I'll go contrarian here. I love red meat, burgers, steaks, chops, sausage, etc. But there's overwhelming evidence that too much red meat isn't great for you. One of the first things you'll hear from an oncologist if you're diagnosed with cancer is to cut out red meat.

See here for the American Cancer Society's dietary recommendations: American Cancer Society Guideline for Diet and Physical Activity

I suspect, anyone telling you to avoid the food we thrived and evolved on for hundreds of thousands of years, is trying to sell you something.

 

[Markola]

I'll go contrarian here. I love red meat, burgers, steaks, chops, sausage, etc. But there's overwhelming evidence that too much red meat isn't great for you. One of the first things you'll hear from an oncologist if you're diagnosed with cancer is to cut out red meat.

See here for the American Cancer Society's dietary recommendations: American Cancer Society Guideline for Diet and Physical Activity

Typical nutritional “science,” it doesn’t give much clear guidance: “It is not known if there is a safe level of consumption for either red or processed meats. In the absence of such knowledge, while recognizing that the amount of increased risk isn’t certain, the ACS recommends choosing protein foods such as fish, poultry, and beans more often than red meat, and for people who eat processed meat products to do so sparingly, if at all.”

 

[easysurfer]

Also, when you say your iron is a bit low, does that mean outside of normal range or just lower than usual for you? All of the blood factors have ranges for reasons (such as normal variability between individuals and within individuals). In general, if you're within normal range, you probably needn't worry too much unless your numbers are continuously falling.

I have at least one blood factor which is always out of range. PCP says that's probably just "normal" for me as I have no indicators of disease which the numbers might otherwise suggest. Is your PCP concerned? If not, I don't think I would be too concerned either.

Did blood work. Numbers so a bit low (compared to average, I suppose). Not horribly low but low. So, plan is to take in more foods with iron and test again in about 3 month.

I cooked some chicken liver today (measured to about 3 ounces -- the weekly dose--as didn't want to over dose). Will make it with some fried rice tonight. I felt like a cave man cooking the liver on a cast iron pan .

 

[easysurfer]

You could take the middle ground if you're worried about too much liver, i.e. add in liver once a week, along with adding in your increase of other red meats.

That's my plan. As the saying goes, "Everything in moderation, including moderation."

 

[ivinsfan]

I'll go contrarian here. I love red meat, burgers, steaks, chops, sausage, etc. But there's overwhelming evidence that too much red meat isn't great for you. One of the first things you'll hear from an oncologist if you're diagnosed with cancer is to cut out red meat.

See here for the American Cancer Society's dietary recommendations: American Cancer Society Guideline for Diet and Physical Activity

Actually the first thing they say is, cut out sugar...

 

[sengsational]

The idea that's there's "overwhelming evidence" from any human epidemiological results runs counter to my understanding of the limits of how the results can be attained. Historical food surveys are fraught with problems, and most meat questions have lumped processed meat in with fresh meat. For epidemiology to tell us anything, the signal has got to be huge for it not to be caught up in confounding variables (i.e. smoking and lung cancer). Fresh meat consumption isn't anywhere close to that level of signal, certainly.

 

[easysurfer]

Those are good recommendations except it just says to limit the amount of red meat but that can be a bit vague. Limit and cutting down is in the eye of the beholder. Would be nice say if they said, limit to one burger a month (or week) to avoid the uncertainty.

 

[audreyh1]

I'll go contrarian here. I love red meat, burgers, steaks, chops, sausage, etc. But there's overwhelming evidence that too much red meat isn't great for you. One of the first things you'll hear from an oncologist if you're diagnosed with cancer is to cut out red meat.

See here for the American Cancer Society's dietary recommendations: American Cancer Society Guideline for Diet and Physical Activity

No, there is not overwhelming evidence. The associations are very weak epidemiological evidence and pushed hard by organizations with a anti-meat agenda.

These days hopefully the first thing the oncologist tells you is to cut out sugar and junk/fast food. Most cancers love sugar. Unfortunately association dogma gets so ingrained it’s hard to change.

The idea that's there's "overwhelming evidence" from any human epidemiological results runs counter to my understanding of the limits of how the results can be attained. Historical food surveys are fraught with problems, and most meat questions have lumped processed meat in with fresh meat. For epidemiology to tell us anything, the signal has got to be huge for it not to be caught up in confounding variables (i.e. smoking and lung cancer). Fresh meat consumption isn't anywhere close to that level of signal, certainly.

Yep. Extremely poorly done “research” with massive confounding factors and often very twisted interpretation.

I suspect, anyone telling you to avoid the food we thrived and evolved on for hundreds of thousands of years, is trying to sell you something.

Exactly!

 

[aja8888]

No, there is not overwhelming evidence. The associations are very weak epidemiological evidence and pushed hard by organizations with a anti-meat agenda.

These days hopefully the first thing the oncologist tells you is to cut out sugar and junk/fast food. Most cancers love sugar. Unfortunately dogma gets so ingrained it’s hard to change.


Yep. Extremely poorly done “research” with massive confounding factors and often very twisted interpretation.


Exactly!

+1000!

 

[brett]

What has surprised me most with regard to diet over the past 13 or so retirement years is how we seem to be eating less and less red meat each year. We live in cattle country. I used to love thick steaks, prime rib, etc. Though I still like a bbque hamburger at home on the grill.

Now I pass them by. Not on purpose. Nor is it a cost issue. I still like them very occasionally. Not certain if it attributable to the ageing process (we do eat less) or attributle to travel experiences. Cannot remember when we have been out to a steakhouse for a meal.

We tend to eat a great deal more chicken,seafood, ethnic, as a preference vs any intentional decision to reduce our intake of red meat.

No significant change in my numbers from when had I them done 15 years ago and again earlier this year. Physician says not to bother with any supplement/vitamins with the exception of D.

 

[fosterscik]

I have low iron levels. In my case it's probably due to the PPI I take for acid reflux (PPIs suppress iron uptake). My doctor recommended a good quality multivitamin with iron. I take a Costco "Kirkland Signature Daily Multi" multivitamin. These pills contain ferrous fumarate (18 mg of iron equivalent = 100% rdv) and they have "cured" me.

 

[TheWizard]

I eat meat.... Well cooked but a lot of meat.

Cows were designed to be eaten...

 

[sdawson]

Well, had my blood test this past week. (Age 62 this past week). Some years ago, I cut out both beef and pork from my diet. It has helped my cholesterol and A1C levels tremendously. Here is the cholesterol trend.

I can survive with chicken and fish if it keeps me off of medicine.

. I am not on any medicine here (and I am overweight, but that is another story).

 

[Koolau]

I'll go contrarian here. I love red meat, burgers, steaks, chops, sausage, etc. But there's overwhelming evidence that too much red meat isn't great for you. One of the first things you'll hear from an oncologist if you're diagnosed with cancer is to cut out red meat.

See here for the American Cancer Society's dietary recommendations: American Cancer Society Guideline for Diet and Physical Activity

My oncologist never mentioned red meat.

 

[Sunset]

My husband eats alot of red meat, at least more so than me, and his red blood cell is low. We added daily iron pills to his regimen for the past 2 years and the numbers have not changed. His PCP thinks it's "normal" to be low in iron because of his alcohol consumption. I also read that as one gets older, red blood cell count can also fall below normal.

He should drink a rusty nail

 

[Sunset]

I remember reading that polar bear liver was very high in Vit A content.

Maybe a killer whale.

Yes polar bear liver is fatal if you eat it all.

Actually getting the liver is usually fatal as well.

 

[grasshopper]

Grasshopper says, "Pick your poison".

 

[Golden Mean]

Well, had my blood test this past week. (Age 62 this past week). Some years ago, I cut out both beef and pork from my diet. It has helped my cholesterol and A1C levels tremendously. Here is the cholesterol trend.

I can survive with chicken and fish if it keeps me off of medicine.
<snipped graph>
. I am not on any medicine here (and I am overweight, but that is another story).

I don't see the A1C numbers. There shouldn't be causal relationship between red meat vs chicken to affect A1C since it's a measure of glycation of blood cells, which is caused by blood sugar, and neither red meat nor chicken/fish have carbohydrates. Lowering or eliminating carbohydrate intake will have a direct effect on A1C.

Total cholesterol is not a particularly useful number, but in general, lower LDL is associated with higher mortality rates.

No medicine, rules. Keep it up!

 

[sdawson]

I don't see the A1C numbers. There shouldn't be causal relationship between red meat vs chicken to affect A1C since it's a measure of glycation of blood cells, which is caused by blood sugar, and neither red meat nor chicken/fish have carbohydrates. Lowering or eliminating carbohydrate intake will have a direct effect on A1C.

Total cholesterol is not a particularly useful number, but in general, lower LDL is associated with higher mortality rates.

No medicine, rules. Keep it up!

Thanks Golden. Didn't want to spam the thread with all the numbers. But as you expressed interest, here they are. I should also mention that my wife finally stopped keeping cookies and other sweets in the house (I am weak), replaced with apricots and plums oranges and apples. so I expect the sugar related carbs have been reduced in that time frame as well.

But here are the other charts with this shift away from beef, pork, and easy access to sugary treats (replaced with carbs from fruit instead). My physical is coming up in a few weeks, so will discuss these with my physician then.

My goal is definitely to try and control my numbers wihout medicine. The dietary change has *not* helped me lose weight though, so need to figure that part out.

 

[Yipper]

I suspect, anyone telling you to avoid the food we thrived and evolved on for hundreds of thousands of years, is trying to sell you something.

Ahh... and we're just fine with things like tobacco, leaded gasoline and lead in paint, etc. Because we "survived" on doesn't mean it's optimal. But you do you.

 

[Yipper]

Actually the first thing they say is, cut out sugar...

One of.

 

[ivinsfan]

One of.

Ok one of the first things. was there something you wanted to add to the first thing?

 

[Gallaher]

I don't see the A1C numbers. There shouldn't be causal relationship between red meat vs chicken to affect A1C since it's a measure of glycation of blood cells, which is caused by blood sugar, and neither red meat nor chicken/fish have carbohydrates. Lowering or eliminating carbohydrate intake will have a direct effect on A1C.

Total cholesterol is not a particularly useful number, but in general, lower LDL is associated with higher mortality rates.

No medicine, rules. Keep it up!

THIS EXACTLY!

 

[brett]

Not a big fan of 'they'.

Not a big fan of my SIL's advice based on the medical experiences of her former next door neighbour's cousin several years ago.

Or the instant facebook school of medicine grads.

And least of all the purveyers of vitamins, health supplements, or miracle cures.

Old fashioned I guess. We simply follow the advice and direction of our respective physicians and specialists.