Interesting finding from the Webb telescope

HFWR said:
I’m more interested in near-Earth exploration, as satellites have allowed us to know more about weather, climate, the history of meteor strikes, etc. I get the urge to know more about the universe, though it is less applicable to everyday life.
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I agree with that. I guess the engineer in me wants a tangible benefit.
 
imjustawarrior said:
Sorry, but I have never understood why there is so much interest in space. I guess there is something in people that cause them to look for more.
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That's fine. Nobody can be interested in everything.

But there are reasons to care about "space." Or more accurately, space science. Scientific exploration and discovery are what made every aspect of our society possible. I, for one, appreciate not having a short and brutal existence, living in a cave.

Beyond that, it's obvious that humans can't stay here forever. We don't really know when the next asteroid will or massive solar flare will hit, but it's inevitable. I don't mind being in the generation which started our slow advance beyond this little rock.

Unless he knows something I don't, I don't think Musk's sense of urgency toward this goal is justified. But in general he's not wrong; we do need to develop this technology at some point.
 
Imagine a world with fusion power and unlimited resources from an asteroid. Might be nice. Might be awful.
 
CaptTom said:
That's fine. Nobody can be interested in everything.

But there are reasons to care about "space." Or more accurately, space science. Scientific exploration and discovery are what made every aspect of our society possible. I, for one, appreciate not having a short and brutal existence, living in a cave.

Beyond that, it's obvious that humans can't stay here forever. We don't really know when the next asteroid will or massive solar flare will hit, but it's inevitable. I don't mind being in the generation which started our slow advance beyond this little rock.

Unless he knows something I don't, I don't think Musk's sense of urgency toward this goal is justified. But in general he's not wrong; we do need to develop this technology at some point.
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Musk’s exuberance will get astronauts killed. Any Mars colonization will take decades. There is zero reason to send anyone to Mars like it’s William Shatner or Katy Perry spending ten minutes in “space”
 
HFWR said:
Musk’s exuberance will get astronauts killed. Any Mars colonization will take decades. There is zero reason to send anyone to Mars like it’s William Shatner or Katy Perry spending ten minutes in “space”
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Mars colonization should start with machines only. Once a habitat with full support and supplies is set up and working, then maybe send a human.

But we didn't go to the moon for resources or another place to live. We went because we could and national pride.
 
corn18 said:
Mars colonization should start with machines only. Once a habitat with full support and supplies is set up and working, then maybe send a human.

But we didn't go to the moon for resources or another place to live. We went because we could and national pride.
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Definitely need multiple successful unmanned cargo missions before thinking about sending humans. Musk’s timetable is more “ambitious”.

Future Moon explorations may well be for resources, and or a base for future explorations. Also unmanned asteroid missions.

Seems easier to take care of this planet than to terraform Mars.
 
imjustawarrior said:
Sorry, but I have never understood why there is so much interest in space. I guess there is something in people that cause them to look for more.

I have parts that I designed in the James Webb telescope. Maybe I should be more interested.
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I think "exploration" is in our genes. Obviously, not every gene is fully expressed in everyone so our various interests are different. But, for whatever reason, I've always been interested in space and astronomy.

Can you imagine being Galileo? I don't know if he realized what he was getting himself into when he pointed his telescope at the heavens. So glad he did.
 
Koolau said:
I think "exploration" is in our genes. Obviously, not every gene is fully expressed in everyone so our various interests are different. But, for whatever reason, I've always been interested in space and astronomy.

Can you imagine being Galileo? I don't know if he realized what he was getting himself into when he pointed his telescope at the heavens. So glad he did.
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Well, we haven’t yet found the firmament… 😉
 
I would love to see an interstellar mission begin before I die. Instead of a single, large probe, send out thousands of microprobes with ion drives. They could accelerate to 0.2 to 0.4 C (speed of light) and instead of slowing down when they get to Alpha Centauri, they just fly right by and each microprobe takes one image or measurement and relays that back. Slowing down takes way too much fuel. We could get to Alpha Centauri in 20 years or less.
 
"In a galactic game of chess, a molecule called DNA is on a mission to beat entropy, and you and I are just pawns." -Sheldon Cooper
 
HFWR said:
Musk’s exuberance will get astronauts killed. Any Mars colonization will take decades. There is zero reason to send anyone to Mars like it’s William Shatner or Katy Perry spending ten minutes in “space”
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Totally agree on all points.

Musk's "exuberance" is a real concern. He's accomplished a lot, and we should all be grateful for that. He literally put the US back on the map, up against some very stiff competition from the Chinese, Europe and others. But there's no room for complacency in space. One spectacular disaster will set us way back. Remember how long it took to recover after the Shuttle accidents? This time we would be left in the dust.

I too scoff at the suborbital or brief orbital flights by celebrities and a few wealthy individuals. But I suppose it has to start somewhere. They're creating the market which will drive innovation.

As for Mars, I'm also conflicted. Sure is a great goal. But we need to learn to walk before we run, and Musk seems to dismiss all the difficult steps in between. He hasn't even gotten one of his Starships to orbit yet, never mind getting dozens of them up there as orbital refueling stations for the trip to Mars. And no-one has transferred fuel in microgravity. Hard to pump something that won't stay in the bottom of the tank! Those and many other have to be solved, along with building the sheer number of ships needed, before we can even talk about leaving orbit toward Mars.
 
Elon has set a goal...realistic or otherwise it's a goal towards which he will endeavor. He may or may not achieve that goal but unless one sets their sight on one progress will flounder.
 
Mark1 said:
OK, you made look. Is this really true? I thought once a star like the sun got on the main sequence it temperature and luminosity didn't change much, i.e., the next 10 billion years in the case of the sun. I can't come up with a good reason why this would be true and the quote from the attached link is not consistent with a hotter past.

astronomy.stackexchange.com

Was the young Sun cooler or hotter than it is today?

Generally, astrophysicists say that the young Sun was only about 70% as warm as today, which leads to the alleged 'Faint young Sun paradox' about how a young Earth could have been as warm as it (ag...
astronomy.stackexchange.com astronomy.stackexchange.com

And you can see from the diagram below that during formation the temperature always increases when approaching the main sequence (the curve always goes towards the left, never towards the right), so the temperature has always been lower in the past than it is now.
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Pretty cool! lol
 
rk911 said:
Elon has set a goal...realistic or otherwise it's a goal towards which he will endeavor. He may or may not achieve that goal but unless one sets their sight on one progress will flounder.
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Indeed. I still recall hearing John F. Kennedy expressing his (our) goal of reaching the moon ("in this decade"). It seemed just about as impossible then as reaching Mars (manned) in Musk's time table.

Not comparing the two men. I'm comparing the goals. Both are what we at Megacorp used to call "Stretch Goals." YMMV
 
Following this thread. Lot of interest comments. Gets you thinking for sure.

I did not realize but according to CHAT there have been 21 successful landings on Mars, mostly by NASA, but a few by other space agencies too. Hopefully someone got the frequent flyer miles.... :facepalm:
Found a very cool 4K video of Mars footage from 2020. 71,235,691 views on YouTube, seems pretty popular. Looks like Mars could be a pretty good vacation destination someday.....;)
 
This video, while perhaps a mix of reality and humor, does a pretty good job of describing the problems of colonizing Mars.
Some language, and an ad you can fast-forward.

I was and am in favor of space exploration, but I think colonizing Mars should be low on the priority list.

 
corn18 said:
Mars colonization should start with machines only. Once a habitat with full support and supplies is set up and working, then maybe send a human.

But we didn't go to the moon for resources or another place to live. We went because we could and national pride.
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I suggested almost this exactly on Reddit and got a bazillion thumbs down lol.
 
IMO a lunar colony is lots more practical than one on Mars primarily because the Moon is much closer. All colonization of other worlds is exceedingly difficult and expensive without new tech (much speedier spacecraft, a matter transporter, etc.). Sadly, I suspect a self-sustaining human colony on another world will not happen before some disaster wipes us from Earth. OTOH, if we don't try, it certainly won't happen.
 
Better to under promise and out perform, as opposed to the opposite.
Short of a catastrophic event, say supervolcano or meteor strike, we probably have a few more years on the good old Earth.
 
HFWR said:
Better to under promise and out perform, as opposed to the opposite.
Short of a catastrophic event, say supervolcano or meteor strike, we probably have a few more years on the good old Earth.
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When the sun quits working, all the planets in its orbit will be in big trouble. Have fun now while you can!
 
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