irs problem

[orchid55]

We have a problem with our 2020 refund. Our CPA contacted me on Saturday to say that he was having problems e-filing our return as it kept bouncing back. I was surprised as I had checked on the IRS website on Wednesday and the "Where's my refund page" show that the return had been received and was processing. I checked on Saturday while on the phone with my CPA and discovered to my horror that the refund had been approved and would be deposited in my bank by April 1. The big oops is that I did not give the IRS any bank info as I wanted a physical check. I have tried to contact the IRS both today and on Saturday with no luck.

Any suggestions for what to do next? The refund is $18,000 as we paid for an ACA policy upfront and are now getting it all back.

Second problem will be that we qualify for the stimulus money and that will probably go to the same fraudulent account.

 

[wrigley]

Didn't someone once say: "the IRS knows EVERYTHING about EVERYONE"!

 

[braumeister]

This page looks helpful:

Taxpayer Guide to Identity Theft

Look at the "Take action if you are a victim" section.

 

[frank]

Putting it into your account might be a generic term. If they only had your personal and not your bank information, I would assume it would come in the mail. it might not hurt to keep trying to contact the irs and make double sure no one is trying to steal your return.

 

[orchid55]

Braumeister, Thanks for the link. I have seen that page but was hoping I could somehow contact the IRS before the money is actually transferred and stop the fraud in its tracks.

 

[cathy63]

Braumeister, Thanks for the link. I have seen that page but was hoping I could somehow contact the IRS before the money is actually transferred and stop the fraud in its tracks.

I'm assuming your CPA told you that the reason your return is rejected is due to a duplicate social security number.

The info you need is in Pub 5027. https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p5027.pdf

Per this pub, you can call the IRS at 1-800-908-4490. I don't know if they can stop a fraudulent refund, but even if they can't, it won't hurt to ask.

To file your own return, you'll have to send it in on paper. Attach this form when you mail it: https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f14039.pdf

 

[mickeyd]

I received my 2019 electronic refund in about 2 weeks. I later filed a 1099X (adjustment) that could not be sent e-tax and had to mail it to Austin. I have no hope that I will receive anything soon.

 

[RE2Boys]

Your CPA receives a notice concerning the reason for rejection and should be providing guidance regarding recommended courses of action, that should be part of the services you are paying for by using a CPA firm ( I worked in a CPA office for 12 years). Why ask random Internet strangers for guidance?

 

[harley]

We aren't random. We're a somewhat controlled collection of internet strangers.

 

[splitwdw]

I don't do my own taxes BUT since your return was bounced back, $18,000. won't be deposited to a fraudulent account. Does it say on the IRS web site how much the refund is?

 

[pb4uski]

I wonder if the IRS might have your bank information on file from some prior year.... but no matter, it is still worth following up on it.

 

[orchid55]

Thanks for the replies guys. The problem is a bit complicated. The CPA was having the return bounce back when he tried to e-file it, but when I checked the IRS.gov site on Saturday using the "Where's my refund" feature the return was showing as processed and the refund approved and schedule to be deposited into a bank by April 1st. First problem is that we have never used the direct deposit feature so the IRS does not have any bank info for us.

Second, this looks like a crime in progress to me and I would like to stop it before it progresses. I realize that probably isn't possible. I have tried calling the IRS and I can't even get through to being put on hold.

I asked for ideas here to supplement what the CPA and I are doing. I have found a lot of smart business types on this forum with some unique perspectives.

My husband and I will head to the CPAs office today to sign a paper return and submit some fraud paperwork. The CPA will do the certified mailing as we are in our 60s and really don't want to go the the post office now.

 

[SecondCor521]

It's possible someone has filed a return with your SSNs, either by mistake or with intent to defraud via tax identity theft.

However, the thing that puzzles me about that is that when you go to the "Where's my refund?" IRS web page, you're required to put in your SSN, filing status, and exact dollar amount of refund before it gives you a response.

I find it highly unlikely that a fraudster or someone else who mistyped their SSN would manage to match your SSN, filing status, and exact dollar amount of refund. Especially since your refund is in the $18K range - it would be hard to hit that number exactly.

While it's also unlikely, I think it is somewhat more likely that your CPA obtained your bank account information (perhaps from your husband) and put it on your return for you. The CPA perhaps didn't explain exactly what they were doing - they're busy people this time of year. (As a volunteer tax preparer, I like to encourage people to do e-file with direct deposit because the refund gets there a lot faster.)

Another thing you could do to investigate is ask your CPA for a copy of the tax return s/he is attempting to file on your behalf and look at the information on line 21. If there is a bank account number and routing number, I would then figure out with the CPAs help how that information made it onto that return and also check to make sure it matches a bank account that you and your husband own. (The routing number can be looked up online and can identify the bank.)

I don't know how possible or likely it is with a CPA, but it's possible someone in their office already transmitted it and two or more people are not on the same page about whether your return was filed, so they're trying to send a duplicate return. Should be unlikely, but if they're disorganized or have a new person I could see it happening.

ETA: Another very unlikely possibility is that your CPA is committing tax identity theft on you. That is, they took your return and put their own bank account information on the return, filed it as a fraudulent return, and then are helping you get your refund. I would hope that the vast, vast majority of tax preparers are honest folks, but this kind of thing has happened before.

 

[orchid55]

SecondCor521 thanks for your comments.

I am also puzzled about how the fraudster would know the exact amount of our refund, but in looking around the internet I did find that one of the newest scams involves intercepting the e-return and changing ( or in our case adding) bank info.

I do all of our tax preparation and interaction with the CPA, so it is unlikely that my husband's info has been used.

I have a copy of the return the CPA tried to file and it does not include any bank info.

I know this CPA uses Intuit and he has been reaching out to them to see if there is a problem on their back end. However most of their employees are furloughed due to the virus.

Thanks for the head-up on the CPA tax identity theft. I hope this is not the case. If so, I am surprised he didn't try it last year when we had an even larger refund (ACA premiums overpaid as well as estimated taxes overpaid).

 

[COcheesehead]

I wonder if the IRS might have your bank information on file from some prior year.... but no matter, it is still worth following up on it.

I thought this too. I do my own taxes and my prior year bank account info stays unless I change it.

 

[SecondCor521]

I suppose intercepting the return is theoretically possible. In the context of fraud, though, I think it is vastly more likely that your CPA or someone in their office or connected with their office would commit a fraud than that some random Internet snooper managed to intercept and change that data.

Of course, if the CPA themselves is trying to commit the fraud, then they could easily create and give you a copy of your return with the bank information removed.

People's situations change. Maybe last year your CPA didn't have a heroin or gambling addiction, or didn't have big medical bills or a bankruptcy or a kid at an expensive college.

Again, fraud is quite unlikely, and I'm not intending to slander or accuse your CPA. But from what I know, it's the most likely scenario in the fraud/theft realm of explanations. I would still put some sort of unintentional double-filing mixup in the CPA's office ahead of any sort of fraud or Intuit issue.

As others have already implied or stated, in the case of fraud, you will eventually get your $18K refund and your stimulus check. You will have to jump through those extra hoops and it will take time and there will be hassle, which is annoying and frustrating and disappointing. If there is fraud, the IRS may be able to get the refund back, but I'd let them deal with that; they know a lot about it and have a lot of experience with it.

Another thing I would suggest is to check all your bank accounts online this week for your refund. If you find it deposited into your account today or tomorrow, at least that would ease your mind about part of the problem, even if it doesn't fully solve the mystery of what actually happened.

Good luck.

 

[f35phixer]

apply for a PIN..... Everyone should have PIN, we had a fraudulent return actually sent to my house ~1300, someone was a big dummy i guess, reported it and now get a pin every year.