Muhammad Ali

[dixonge]

But I wonder, was Ali's stance purely one of conscience or did he simply believe he could avoid it without paying the consequences?

Did he know that he'd be stripped of his titles and be prevented from fighting for 3-4 years, in his prime?

He certainly wasn't meek when he was expressing his conscience. He talked of his unwillingness to fight "slave masters" in their war against "dark-skinned people."

No need to wonder - it's all just a search away. Here is a quote from a month before his scheduled induction:

No, I am not going ten thousand miles from home to help murder and burn another poor nation simply to continue the domination of white slave masters of the darker people the world over. This is the day when such evils must come to an end. I have been warned that to take such a stand would put my prestige in jeopardy and could cause me to lose millions of dollars which should accrue to me as the champion.



But I have said it once and I will say it again. The real enemy of my people is right here. I will not disgrace my religion, my people or myself by becoming a tool to enslave those who are fighting for their own justice, freedom and equality…

I haven't read biographies so I don't know if he was genuine in expressing his conscientious objector status or he was gambling that he could refuse to serve and get away with it due to his fame.

Because what happened to individuals who refused to serve? How easy or difficult was it to get an exemption due to religious beliefs? Didn't men typically get incarcerated unless they were able to convince the draft board?

He made three separate appeals to be classified as a conscientious objector. All were rejected. He then refused to step forward at his induction and was arrested, then tried and convicted and sentenced. Most of his boxing titles and license were stripped and he was banned. His lawyers appealed and lost, then appealed again. In 1971 the Supreme Court overturned his convictions.

Looking back at the time Muhammad Ali refused the draft in Houston - Houston Chronicle

Certainly Ali inspired many others who objected to the war as well as well as young African-Americans who saw a black star take an heroic political stand.

Ali also was an inspiration to the Civil Rights movement but he doesn't seem to have gone in any marches or make a lot of statements about the movement. Certainly there was overlap between the Civil Rights and anti war movements which might explain why those fighting for Civil Rights in the 60s gravitated to Ali.

He joined the Nation of Islam, which demanded political non-participation (mainly by not voting). His public stance against the Vietnam war came a year before Martin Luther King's. Most of his statements about civil rights were considered a bit too much by most of the existing civil rights organizations. In other words, he was more radical than them.

How Muhammad Ali influenced the Civil Rights Movement - Al Jazeera English

 

[explanade]

Thanks that's good to know.

Regardless of his motivations, he influenced a lot of people who were fighting the good fight.

 

[easysurfer]

Thanks that's good to know.

Regardless of his motivations, he influenced a lot of people who were fighting the good fight.

There's a really good documentary of him in the early years (before Fraizer, Foreman) which goes in detail about his earlier fights and the stance he took vs the draft.

https://www.amazon.com/K-Cassius-Clay/dp/B009511HPC/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

Well worth the included Amazon Prime price . I had stumbled on the documentary one day as I was in the mood of seeing video of him in his prime (no pun intended) fighting days but then was riveting learning about the non-fight political history.

 

[aja8888]

He made three separate appeals to be classified as a conscientious objector. All were rejected. He then refused to step forward at his induction and was arrested, then tried and convicted and sentenced. Most of his boxing titles and license were stripped and he was banned. His lawyers appealed and lost, then appealed again. In 1971 the Supreme Court overturned his convictions.

Except for getting any titles stripped from me back then, I now wonder if the same would have happened to me if I didn't accept the draft, enter the military and fight in the Viet Nam war? (I'd bet I would still be in jail today)

In case some of here you weren't in that arena, there were lots of people of color and others in that action at the time fighting for our principles of freedom.

In my book, he was a gifted athlete but was a coward as a man.

 

[eytonxav]

I am a Vietnam era vet also, but personally, I doubt he dodged the draft out of cowardice or not wanting to give up his luxuries. Initially, I felt that way, but in hindsight probably not.

 

[Idnar7]

Amazing he is still so polarizing even today. Personally I thought he would disappear after he refused to be drafted. Kept from his profession for three years in his prime and he still overcame. Interesting to see how history will see him. I know how I do.

 

[bclover]

In my mind he will always be a draft dodger. Some other American was drafted in his place and he continued to live a life of wealth.

He was still the champ, though.

It's definitely depends on what your positions was at the time. One man's "coward" was another's "hero"

I grew up in Harlem NYC during the 60's while the world had MLK, our heroes where Malcom X and Ali.

Many many blacks felt no love for the war. why should we?? we most certainly were not equal at the time. My father (who I posted on memorial day) fought in Korea, was awarded the silver star and then had to ride in the "colored" car in order to see his parent in La. You think my dad was going to allow his sons be drafted?? not likely and often said he would not.

Ali said what many Black folk felt at the time, "why are we fighting for a country that routinely lynched us and hated us"

not sure if he lived a life of wealth though, I believe he was banned from boxing, was convicted and sentence to jail (though he stayed free while on appeal) and fined.

I was not a boxing fan so for my family his activism on behalf of Blacks were way more important.

He is way more of a hero in our eyes for NOT reporting when drafted. it's easy to fight for "freedom" when you actually have it. it's a tougher sell for others. My dad did not allow any of his sons (my brothers) to join the military. well maybe I should say 'not allow" more like he was very vocal in his opposition.

 

[W2R]

Thanks to all for the very personal and heartfelt reflections and perspectives.