Real Life Case of ER at BH Forum

[FIREdToBeExpat]

There is a current treat about importance of ER at BH forum. I think it is worth reading.

"I feel that there is a significant segment of people who post here who, IMHO, are overly obsessed with making money and planning for a future that they cannot control. You can spend your life from age 18 predominantly dedicated to making sure you don't run out of money when you are 100. You can postpone joy indefinitely and just hope you are healthy enough down the road to enjoy your bundle. Or you can live the way you want to live today, staying well within your means, try to save if you can, enjoy your life, just not sweat it....knowing you might run out of money at 95, but on the other hand you might die at 40 or 50 or 60 or tomorrow, and some things just cannot be controlled."

https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=170562&newpost=2571493

 

[Sarah in SC]

I liked his story. Thanks for sharing that with us. Interesting, and always good to remember we don't get a guaranteed ticket!

 

[marko]

+1

We've had a few discussions here about/with 20 year olds who may be missing a good part of "life" in order to RE at 45 or 50.

I"m all for LBYM but at 25, RE (or even R) was not on my radar.

Did lots of stuff that I'll never regret and I always feel a bit of sadness when I read from some 23 y.o. who is planning to skip that trip to Paris with her friends (here we go again!) so that when she's 50 she can go at that point.

IMO, life is for living, not overly preparing for a retirement that--for any number of reasons--may not even become reality.

We have another thread running right now from a Dad who's worried that if his daughter can't land her first job soon, she won't be able to RE. I just see that as focusing on the wrong end of the life journey.

 

[Moemg]

Great Post ! You never know what life holds for you .

 

[MBAustin]

Great Post ! You never know what life holds for you .

+1.

Thanks to the OP for sharing.

 

[Fishingmn]

I always feel a bit of sadness when I read from some 23 y.o. who is planning to skip that trip to Paris with her friends (here we go again!) so that when she's 50 she can go at that point.

To play devil's advocate, too many 23 y.o. take the trip to Paris that can't afford it using the YOLO philosophy and will never retire at 60, much less 50.

 

[Dreamer]

I agree-great post! Even though I have retired, I still keep putting off things I would like to do, for one reason or another. I need to quit doing that, because there are no guarantees.

 

[Options]

Yes, thanks for sharing.

 

[Letj]

He appeared not to have had any risk factors currently. I am just wandering if as a hippie he experimented with drugs. My understanding is that past or current drug use especially cocaine can harden the arteries and carry a high risk for heart attacks. Of course, that may not be the case at all. Just a wondering mind.


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[Mulligan]

I agree-great post! Even though I have retired, I still keep putting off things I would like to do, for one reason or another. I need to quit doing that, because there are no guarantees.

Ah, the joys of delayed gratification. I almost bought an iphone 5 today and upgraded from a dumb phone and tack on an additional $10 monthly fee for the plan. But I reversed course and spent $3 on Amazon for a new phone cover instead.... Maybe this winter......


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[jollystomper]

Health is not the only reason not to put things off. Even your health cannot keep you from accidents. About a month ago DW and I lost a good friend, a great woman, 61 but looked 20 years younger, killer figure (still would wear miniskirts occasionally because, in her words, "it gets hubby hot, and I like that!"). Her husband had retired a couple of years ago, and she planned within a year. Then, driving home on a clear evening, less than a mile from her home, someone under the influence runs a red light and she is gone in an instant.

With things like that, even though I have not yet ER'ed, I have gotten a lot more easier - still LBYM, but not nearly as extreme as before. And I am learning to value time - how I spend it, and whom I spend it with - above all else.

 

[Chuckanut]

Howard Hughes is supposed to have said "Anybody who thinks money is more valuable than time needs to talk to a rich old man."

 

[daylatedollarshort]

I don't find that early retirement, enjoying life and planning in case we do live past 100 are mutually exclusive objectives. I wouldn't enjoy retirement if my spending was too high compared to my income and I had to worry about running out of money.

 

[FreeBear]

DW and I ER'd this year. We LBYM but enjoyed a very comfortable lifestyle before ER since we had good professional-level incomes and no kids. Now our ER is still comfortable, but perhaps a step below my "dream" retirement filled with toys-for-boys and half-year snowbird winter escapes. Still, only 6 months in, I'm loving the freedom of ER and never want to return to my old life. The word "joy" is beginning to enter into my vocabulary!

Like many here, I'm a planner and worrier. Well, this is part of what got me to ER. Still, I realize that at some point my planning drifts into an obsession with the desire to pretend to control the inherently uncontrollable. It's comforting to be able to squeeze out a few percentage points of simulated financial success in Firecalc since this distracts me from that which is know is largely out of my control: tragic accidents, cancer, and death itself.

I'm gradually learning to say "Enough", and continue on living. "Enough" is a mindset as much as a level of assets. The state of "enough" is also a commitment and practice, of which ER is a giant step.

(Credit goes to author Brene Brown for encouraging my thoughts about "Enough")

 

[Koolau]

Excellent BH post. It points out the potential downside of delaying "life" to become ever more financially "secure." I like (someone's here) tag line: Moderation in all things - including moderation. Words to live by, but YMMV.

 

[bmcgonig]

I'm gradually learning to say "Enough", and continue on living. "Enough" is a mindset as much as a level of assets. The state of "enough" is also a commitment and practice, of which ER is a giant step.

(Credit goes to author Brene Brown for encouraging my thoughts about "Enough")

+1. Like the concept of "enough". Thanks for sharing.


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[Sarah in SC]

Love Brene Brown. And the concept of "enough", which I, like many, was first introduced to by Joe Domininguez in Your Money or Your Life.

 

[Mulligan]

Excellent BH post. It points out the potential downside of delaying "life" to become ever more financially "secure." I like (someone's here) tag line: Moderation in all things - including moderation. Words to live by, but YMMV.

And then you have people like my dad. Pushing 80 and wont spend much on himself. I tried last year to get him to spend some stating "its just going to get divvied up and blown by all the kids." His reply was, "I hope you all enjoy spending it as much as I have enjoyed saving it". I haven't brought it up since.


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[marko]

To play devil's advocate, too many 23 y.o. take the trip to Paris that can't afford it using the YOLO philosophy and will never retire at 60, much less 50.

True, but we also all have stories of friends and relatives who died at 45 and never went anywhere.

As we've discussed before, if the difference between retiring at 50 vs never is the $2-3K you recklessly spent 30 or 40 years ago, there's likely a lot more going on.

"...if only I hadn't spent that $2K on X back in 1982 I could retire now..." ummmmmm.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Love Brene Brown. And the concept of "enough", which I, like many, was first introduced to by Joe Domininguez in Your Money or Your Life.

I am also a big fan of Your Money of Your Life. Plus I found the book What Happy People Know helpful, especially this specific quote:

"No matter how much money people have, almost all of us want just a little bit more. But it never makes us happier. This is the failure of success."

I do think many of us have been conditioned by advertising so much that there is a disconnect between what we spend money on and what science shows really makes us happy. After a certain level of financial security, many of the things that make people happy are actually not costly - being out in nature, bonding with a pet, family and social connections, helping others, being a part of the community and having leisure time to pursue hobbies and express creativity.

 

[Jay_Gatsby]

Love Brene Brown. And the concept of "enough", which I, like many, was first introduced to by Joe Domininguez in Your Money or Your Life.

YMOYL is a great book in terms of changing your perspective about money and time. DW and I are pretty much FI at this point, so we're loosening the purse strings and doing some home renovations and replace a car (or two). Once the kids are a little older (two DDs - 5.5 & 2.5), we'll start taking long car trips to explore local landmarks and gradually expand to cross-country trips.

When I bring up becoming truly FIRE, DW isn't inclined to embrace the idea. She hasn't reached the desired pinnacle of her career (and for that matter, neither have I). Yet I don't want a health issue (I'm mid-40s and she just turned 40) to prevent us from enjoying the fruits of 20+ years of hard work, saving and delayed gratification. This is why we both work out intensely, which gives off the appearance that we're still in our 30s.

 

[RetireBy90]

My take, and only my opinion, plan for tomorrow but don't count on it. Save for RE but life is a journey not a destination. There are other things more important than $$ like compassion, wisdom and joy.

 

[scrabbler1]

And then you have people like my dad. Pushing 80 and wont spend much on himself. I tried last year to get him to spend some stating "its just going to get divvied up and blown by all the kids." His reply was, "I hope you all enjoy spending it as much as I have enjoyed saving it". I haven't brought it up since.


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My 84-year-old dad has joked from time to time whenever he spends some money unexpectedly, like when he needed to get a few crowns on his teeth replaced, "There goes some more of your inheritance!" My brother and I, neither of us clamoring in any way for his money, just laugh.

 

[Independent]

My dad said:

"Plan like you'll live to 100. Live like you'll die tomorrow."