So, no worries at all about SS right?

[target2019]

I wonder what OP is wondering?

 

[pb4uski]

Did you actually READ my comment because I literally said,I have no idea if any deceased people get SS checks. And I didn't insinuate anything of the sort...if you want to rant,please leave me out of it

You didn't insinuate anything, but Elon Musk did. I was referring to him, not you and if you READ what I wrote it should have been clear... I wrote:

... What I'm complaining about are DOGE seeing very old people on the master record and falsely insinuating that they are all receiving benefits and that fraud is rampant. ...

 

[pb4uski]

You are obviously quoting a source here. Would you mind referring to the source? I'd like to see the entire quote. Cherry picking quotes isn't ideal.

Musk eyes Social Security and benefit programs for cuts while claiming widespread fraud

Elon Musk says Social Security and other federal benefit programs will be targeted in his hunt for fraudulent spending.

apnews.com

 

[Montecfo]

Sounds like they want to root out fraud waste and abuse. I do not see the issue there.

 

[ivinsfan]

You didn't insinuate anything, but Elon Musk did. I was referring to him, not you and if you READ what I wrote it should have been clear... I wrote:

Then please be kind enough to post your thoughts as stand alone posts and not after quoting my posts. And not including the comment "wake up" in a "reply" to my post would be considerate.

 

[Montecfo]

Regarding the "oldsters" still receiving benefits, here is something I have wondered about. People who are here illegally often pay into SS under a fraudulent (not their own) SS number.

Now what stops them or some other party from claiming benefits under that same number?

 

[Gumby]

Regarding the "oldsters" still receiving benefits, here is something I have wondered about. People who are here illegally often pay into SS under a fraudulent (not their own) SS number.

Now what stops them or some other party from claiming benefits under that same number?

You have to prove your citizenship to get social security. When I applied, I had to send them my original certificate in the mail for inspection.

 

[djsander]

Most billionaires don't draw a salary, they get stock awards, which they then borrow against so that they don't have to pay taxes. Occasionally they will sell a few hundred million worth here or there. The way to get the billionaires riled up would be to add SS taxes to capital gains. You'd get the Elons and the Larrys and Jeffs on their soapboxes in a hurry.

Don’t those stock awards have ordinary income tax requirements or is there some exemption. I know the ones I received had tax with holding.

 

[Montecfo]

You have to prove your citizenship to get social security. When I applied, I had to send them my original certificate in the mail for inspection.

But certainly you see my point. Fake credentials are created to get the SS# or to link an existing one to a new person. It seems possible to do the same for benefits.

 

[jollystomper]

Sounds like they want to root out fraud waste and abuse. I do not see the issue there.

Sometimes it is all in the wording, or how one chooses to read words. In my view the AP headline can be misleading, as it implies that what is being cut is benefits, instead of the waste. And even if the program has only 1% waste, that is still a lot for SS - I believer around $70 billion. Now, I am biased as part of my IT work was doing work similar to what DOGE is doing, but when $70 billion is not considered "much", one may not be looking at it as part of an aggregate across multiple entities.

 

[Flieger]

You have to prove your citizenship to get social security. When I applied, I had to send them my original certificate in the mail for inspection.

My DW just started in February. She did not have to send anything in to SS.

Flieger

 

[Montecfo]

Sometimes it is all in the wording, or how one chooses to read words. In my view the AP headline can be misleading, as it implies that what is being cut is benefits, instead of the waste. And even if the program has only 1% waste, that is still a lot for SS - I believer around $70 billion. Now, I am biased as part of my IT work was doing work similar to what DOGE is doing, but when $70 billion is not considered "much", one may not be looking at it as part of an aggregate across multiple entities.

Not having read the audit report from 2015 (as an aside, do they really only do these every decade?), active SS numbers of people who should have died already due to being 112 years old+ (apparently millions of these) are a red flag. It's easy to see the fraud potential there. But harder at 65, 70 75 etc.

 

[ERD50]

My DW just started in February. She did not have to send anything in to SS.

Flieger

Yes, I started end of last year, and don't recall anything other than filling in the form, and my notes confirm that. No 'proof' other than my word.

 

[copyright1997reloaded]

A recent IG audit released in July 2024 (https://oig.ssa.gov/assets/uploads/072401.pdf), looked at the FY2015 to FY2022 period. The investigation revealed a less than 1% amount of improper payments. There are problems for sure, but I don't think it falls in the widespread fraud category.

780 million is still a large number. From the report: "and made approximately$71.8 billion (0.84 percent) in improper payments, most of which were overpayments"

 

[corn18]

Yes, I started end of last year, and don't recall anything other than filling in the form, and my notes confirm that. No 'proof' other than my word.

Don't let facts get in the way of making stuff up.

 

[latexman]

Don’t confuse us with the facts, DOGE, just tell us what you want us to believe!

 

[Aerides]

Sounds like they want to root out fraud waste and abuse. I do not see the issue there.

But you are not so naive to imagine they can go in, declare "oh look here are billions I found in fraud in a few days" and take a chain saw to it.

When others who have been doing this for a living, for years, are telling you otherwise?

Analysis>Test/Validate>Implement>Validate - all major changes in any business have behaved in some version of that for decades. I think many of us here would like to see some careful analysis and data...before arbitrary cuts happen - and the baby gets thrown out with the bathwater.

eta: And yes, they can only be arbitrary if they are undertaken off a hunch or assumption, without facts, and apparently counter to the actual facts we have.

 

[MichaelB]

Thanks for an interesting discussion.