Space - The Final Frontier

[Koolau]

Slightly adjusting asteroids on a collision course with earth will be done with high power lasers rather than spacecraft or nuclear bombs. I've worked in this field! It is somewhat laughable in all honesty but there are actual military and NASA programs for "planetary defense"

This asteroid thing is being looked at from many sides. Just two years ago, NASA had a successful mission to deflect an asteroid using kinetic energy. It didn't get much press. They significantly altered the orbit of an asteroid's "moon."

Direct from NASA: NASA Confirms DART Mission Impact Changed Asteroid’s Motion in Space - NASA

Decent TIME article: NASA Tried To Knock an Asteroid Off Course—And Succeeded Wildly Beyond Expectations

I want as many options as possible when it comes to asteroids hurtling toward us. Space-based has lots of options - not just lasers though that might well w*rk in some situations. I'm glad they are "practicing" right now with DART.

 

[SecondAttempt]

This asteroid thing is being looked at from many sides. Just two years ago, NASA had a successful mission to deflect an asteroid using kinetic energy. It didn't get much press. They significantly altered the orbit of an asteroid's "moon."

Direct from NASA: NASA Confirms DART Mission Impact Changed Asteroid’s Motion in Space - NASA

Decent TIME article: NASA Tried To Knock an Asteroid Off Course—And Succeeded Wildly Beyond Expectations

So this is all physics, specifically mass and momentum. So why is there a surprise?

 

[JoeWras]

So this is all physics, specifically mass and momentum. So why is there a surprise?

My take on the "surprise" is that they executed so well on a long robotic mission. Got to hit it in the right place. I think they were also pleased by the way the ejecta interacted with the momentum transfer. But it also adds a wildcard to the process.

More on this:

Early Results from NASA’s DART Mission - NASA

Since NASA’s Double Asteroid Redirection Test (DART) spacecraft intentionally slammed into the asteroid moonlet Dimorphos on Sept. 26 – altering its orbit by

www.nasa.gov

Putting those pieces together, and assuming that Didymos and Dimorphos have the same densities, the team calculates that the momentum transferred when DART hit Dimorphos was roughly 3.6 times greater than if the asteroid had simply absorbed the spacecraft and produced no ejecta at all – indicating the ejecta contributed to moving the asteroid more than the spacecraft did.

 

[Koolau]

So this is all physics, specifically mass and momentum. So why is there a surprise?

I suppose the surprise is that they actually pulled it off. Think of the 3 dimensional billiards game required to bring a space craft into contact with an object orbiting an asteroid - each ball moving at maybe 10 miles per second (and no rails to bank off of.) Oh, and starting the shot from Earth.

Heh, heh, other than that, it's just physics I suppose.

 

[Chuckanut]

Apparently it is official….

Two astronauts parked at the International Space Station since early June will return with SpaceX instead of on the Boeing vehicle that brought them there.

 

[Walt34]

Apparently it is official….

Well, that's going to be awkward. I do hope everybody gets back safely.

 

[Gumby]

I think most people knew that this would be the outcome. It's the most rational choice. There's a chance that they don't have a handle on the thruster issues and the ship burns up on reentry, which would be a tragedy. Yes, if the empty Starliner makes it back safely, some will say they were too cautious. But either way, we learn what we learn from this test flight, with or without astronauts on board. I'm not sure if this is the end of the Boeing program. If the ship is destroyed, I think it is almost certain, but they may press ahead if everything works fine.

 

[Chuckanut]

I think most people knew that this would be the outcome. It's the most rational choice. There's a chance that they don't have a handle on the thruster issues and the ship burns up on reentry, which would be a tragedy. Yes, if the empty Starliner makes it back safely, some will say they were too cautious. But either way, we learn what we learn from this test flight, with or without astronauts on board. I'm not sure if this is the end of the Boeing program. If the ship is destroyed, I think it is almost certain, but they may press ahead if everything works fine.

The Boeing program would probably be most likely to end if the astronauts were killed on the return flight. That’s probably the biggest risk by far. As it is, they can test another unmanned Starliner later on as part of a resupply mission to the ISS. Then if it works, try a crew again. I think NASA really wants two ways to launch astronauts into Space. At some point SpaceX will have a bad flight. Space travel is hard. Very hard.

Of course, if the Starship is successful in the near future, that could be the 2nd way to get humans into LEO. Though how it would dock with the ISS is beyond me. I expect they might have to borrow a shuttle craft from Starfleet to move people and gear to the ISS.

 

[Chuckanut]

Here’s another risk. The Boeing space suits are not compatible with other space craft. Neither are the SpaceX suits

The Dragon of the Crew-8 mission is in space now, but it is the contingency plan for Wilmore and Williams if Starliner isn’t suitable to carry them home, NASA officials said. To complicate matters, there aren't any spare SpaceX suits. Those arrive no earlier than September 24, when the Dragon of Crew-9 launches towards the ISS with two empty seats and two extra spacesuits.

If Starliner flies home uncrewed, and their Dragon Crew-9 rescue vessel hasn’t yet reached the station with its specific spacesuits in tow, Wilmore and Williams would have no choice but to enter the Crew-8 Dragon without spacesuits in an emergency situation.

That is, unless NASA decides Starliner will return with its crew after all. The space agency is expected to make a final decision about Starliner coming back to Earth empty, or with Wilmore and Williams inside, by the end of this month.

 

[Gumby]

Here’s another risk. The Boeing space suits are not compatible with other space craft. Neither are the SpaceX suits

I am reminded of this scene in the movie Apollo 13 and shaking my head just like Ed Harris.

 

[Koolau]

I'm of the opinion that in space exploration, we've probably learned more from our mistakes than from our successes. The Apollo 13 example is just one example. I'd bet all current CO2 scrubbers are one-size-fits-all. YMMV

 

[JoeWras]

I'd bet all current CO2 scrubbers are one-size-fits-all. YMMV

Scrubbers yes. Spacesuits, no.

"Hey, you can't drive a Tesla because you are wearing a kilt. Teslas only work with pants or skirts.*"

*-it is a joke. Don't tell me a kilt is a skirt.

 

[Fermion]

Excited about the upcoming private SpaceX mission that will have a spacewalk (and go higher than any human has gone since Apollo.)

Oh! and interesting. Because this mission has two women and no women flew on Apollo, these two will set a world record for altitude for women in space. I wonder if one of them will press up against the farthest part of the hull to declare "I win!"

 

[Koolau]

these two will set a world record for altitude for women in space. I wonder if one of them will press up against the farthest part of the hull to declare "I win!"

Naaaahhhh! That's a guy thing!

 

[Texas Proud]

Even if it burns up on reentry I do not see Boeing dropping the program... there is a lot of sunk costs and the only way to make some of that up is to have a working ship... and I would bet that finding the cause and fixing it would not be that expensive...

I wonder why there are incompatible spacesuits? And why you would have a problem wearing a different one for any ship.. I mean, it covers your body and you sit down... maybe there is a connection for air but someone can make a connector...

 

[SecondAttempt]

I suppose the surprise is that they actually pulled it off. Think of the 3 dimensional billiards game required to bring a space craft into contact with an object orbiting an asteroid - each ball moving at maybe 10 miles per second (and no rails to bank off of.) Oh, and starting the shot from Earth.

Heh, heh, other than that, it's just physics I suppose.

I want to meet the guy with the b@lls to walk into his boss's office and say..."Here's how we are going to land on Mars. We'll get almost to the surface by parachute then eject it, use rockets to slow down a bit more, then deploy a hovering crane to lower the lander to the surface. What could possibly so wrong? But it worked!

 

[SecondAttempt]

I agree that it is fascinating... the one that amazes me the most is the Rover... something that was built for '90 days' sure has gone on a lot longer than planned....

I worked at the University of Arizona that built the Mars rovers, or at least the instrumentation. I am close friends with a few of the principles. I've been to many of their milestone celebrations including landings. It's truly amazing what we humans have done! My friends would protest and say they were just doing a job I'm sure. Their have been so many contributors that I think I can speak for them that this is an achievement for the human race.

 

[Chuckanut]

Eric Berger’s book “Reentry” will soon be published. It’s a history of SpaceX and covers among other things, the development of the reusable landing boosters and the Crew Dragon development.

Some of the information about the competition for the two manned spacecraft contracts is “interesting” from what I have heard.

Another “interesting” book is “The Wrong Stuff” a history of the Soviet space program. It is quite critical of the program and the pressure from the top to beat the USA at any price, including the lives of the cosmonauts.

 

[Fermion]

I want to meet the guy with the b@lls to walk into his boss's office and say..."Here's how we are going to land on Mars. We'll get almost to the surface by parachute then eject it, use rockets to slow down a bit more, then deploy a hovering crane to lower the lander to the surface. What could possibly so wrong? But it worked!

Or what about the meeting where it is suggested to capture an apartment building in the air with a giant pair of chopsticks?

We really do live in amazing times. Hard to believe it has just been a little more than a century since airplanes.

 

[Koolau]

I worked at the University of Arizona that built the Mars rovers, or at least the instrumentation. I am close friends with a few of the principles. I've been to many of their milestone celebrations including landings. It's truly amazing what we humans have done! My friends would protest and say they were just doing a job I'm sure. Their have been so many contributors that I think I can speak for them that this is an achievement for the human race.

Yes, and I easily remember when the first man-made object was put into Earth orbit. We've come a long way, baby!

 

[Fermion]

Yes, and I easily remember when the first man-made object was put into Earth orbit. We've come a long way, baby!

The man hole cover from Operation Plumbbob?

 

[REWahoo]

I wonder why there are incompatible spacesuits? And why you would have a problem wearing a different one for any ship.. I mean, it covers your body and you sit down... maybe there is a connection for air but someone can make a connector...

It is apparently a little more complex than engineering some sort of adapter to connect the Starliner suits to the Dragon capsule:

Like trying to plug an essentially outdated USB A socket into an iPhone's charge port, the suit connectors have different shapes, styles, and functions. The suits themselves have different systems that integrate with their own capsules for purposes like air leak checks during pre-flight testing.

 

[ls99]

In post 1824 I wrote: "Hmmmm, the solution; jettison the starliner to burn up on re-entry, spaceX to bring the troops home."

Assuming the starliner makes it back in one piece, I will have been half right. If it burns up on the way back, I'll call it a valid prediction.

Possible scenarios, The capsule will fail on its own or Boeing will "accidentally" loose control of the capsule, to hide the screwups.

 

[Koolau]

In post 1824 I wrote: "Hmmmm, the solution; jettison the starliner to burn up on re-entry, spaceX to bring the troops home."

Assuming the starliner makes it back in one piece, I will have been half right. If it burns up on the way back, I'll call it a valid prediction.

Possible scenarios, The capsule will fail on its own or Boeing will "accidentally" loose control of the capsule, to hide the screwups.

Sorta like the 2 737 MAXs? Not funny, I know. I hope the return is successful as Boeing needs to know what went wrong and how to fix it. We really need the multiple platforms for getting humans and stuff into space.

 

[CaptTom]

I think that Boeing will bring it home in one piece. They have so much riding on this, that it's got to be a pretty high priority for them. I don't usually root for mega corporations, but having only one launch option doesn't seem like a good situation to be in.