Space - The Final Frontier

Texas Proud said:
I am not referring to Galilean relativity in my example... relatively the race car diver sees the other car doing zero.... (in reality he sees both his car and the other car going a high rate of speed) but the car is actually moving at a high rate of speed... I was just showing that relative speed has nothing to do with actual speed...
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Speed is always measured with respect to something. Measuring with respect to the Earth is a convenient reference frame for many things that happen here on Earth, but it is far from universal. Nor is it necessarily the most useful reference frame.
 
Out-to-Lunch said:
Speed is always measured with respect to something. Measuring with respect to the Earth is a convenient reference frame for many things that happen here on Earth, but it is far from universal. Nor is it necessarily the most useful reference frame.
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Yes, a reference to a point in 'space'...

The example is the rocket going negative... it does not and everybody knows it... it 'might' go to zero but I doubt that... but you then refer to the speed from the last point in space it occupied...

Think of calculus... you make the space under the curve with smaller and smaller boxes and get an answer that 'approaches' a number... so hey, it IS that number... BTW, I hated that when I took it way back when... the answer is not '2' but it is approaching '2' so we say it is '2' but we cannot say it IS '2'.... I had this argument with my prof a number of times and lost... my brain likes 1+1=2 better...
 
I have never referred to a negative speed. I cannot tell what you mean by "The example is the rocket going negative... it does not and everybody knows it..."
 
Out-to-Lunch said:
I have never referred to a negative speed. I cannot tell what you mean by "The example is the rocket going negative... it does not and everybody knows it..."
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The whole talk about speed was a post awhile back when someone mentioned the speed on the screen... and they brought up a negative speed when the rocket was going back to the launch pad... my thinking of their post is a positive speed going away from the launch pad and a negative speed going back...

You jumped in on a few of my posts that was posting against this...
 
How about this simplification: if the pointy end is going forward, it is positive velocity. If the pointy end is going backward it is negative velocity. Although the velocity itself is still an absolute value: distance traveled / time. Forward or backward is relative to your reference point.
 
I don't think this has been posted here, but just a little update.

If you own, or have access to, any kind of decent telescope, this would be a good time to take a look at Saturn, since next year it will look very different.

For most of 2025, the rings will be edge on to the Sun (happens twice every 29 years) and invisible to all but the most powerful telescopes.

Galileo was the first to notice this, in 1612, and was astonished.
 
braumeister said:
Galileo was the first to notice this, in 1612, and was astonished.
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He said: "The ears disappeared!" or something like that. With the crude telescope he had, he called them "ears".

One of his more humorous quotes was: "Has Saturn swallowed his children?" Hence, going back to the myth. Joking or serious, he was quite surprised as braumeister said.
 
The Parker solar probe is now the fastest human made object at about 40,000 mph.

science.nasa.gov

Parker Solar Probe - NASA Science

On a mission to “touch the Sun,” NASA's Parker Solar Probe became the first spacecraft to fly through the corona – the Sun’s upper atmosphere – in 2021. With every orbit, the probe faces brutal heat and radiation to provide humanity with unprecedented observations of the only star we can study...
science.nasa.gov science.nasa.gov

To perform its unprecedented investigations, the Parker Solar Probe and its instruments are protected from the Sun by a 4.5-inch-thick (11.43 cm) carbon-composite shield, which can withstand temperatures reaching nearly 2,500 degrees Fahrenheit (1,377 Celsius).
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It’s also the anniversary of Apollo 8’s circumnavigation of the Moon way back in 1968.
 
Get ready for Blue Origin's 'New Glenn'.

Blue Origin is expected to launch its 1st New Glenn rocket next week, but when?​

www.space.com

Blue Origin is expected to launch its 1st New Glenn rocket next week, but when?

The first launch of New Glenn could occur between Jan. 6 and Jan. 12, according to the FAA.
www.space.com www.space.com
"According to the FAA, Blue Origin could launch New Glenn's first flight on Jan. 6 between 1 a.m. EST and 4:45 a.m. EST (0600-0945 GMT), a nearly 4-hour launch window, with backup opportunities daily through Jan. 12."

Here's a link to a good summary and comparison of New Glenn with SpaceX Falcon 9:
 
JackJester said:
Get ready for Blue Origin's 'New Glenn'.

Blue Origin is expected to launch its 1st New Glenn rocket next week, but when?​

www.space.com

Blue Origin is expected to launch its 1st New Glenn rocket next week, but when?

The first launch of New Glenn could occur between Jan. 6 and Jan. 12, according to the FAA.
www.space.com www.space.com
"According to the FAA, Blue Origin could launch New Glenn's first flight on Jan. 6 between 1 a.m. EST and 4:45 a.m. EST (0600-0945 GMT), a nearly 4-hour launch window, with backup opportunities daily through Jan. 12."

Here's a link to a good summary and comparison of New Glenn with SpaceX Falcon 9:
Click to expand...

Jeff Bezos' space company calls off debut launch of massive new rocket in final minutes of countdown​

CAPE CANAVERAL, Fla. (AP) — Blue Origin called off the debut launch of its massive new rocket early Monday because of technical trouble.

The 320-foot (98-meter) New Glenn rocket was supposed to blast off before dawn with a prototype satellite from Florida’s Cape Canaveral Space Force Station. But launch controllers had to deal with an unspecified rocket issue in the final minutes of the countdown and ran out of time. Once the countdown clock was halted, they immediately began draining all the fuel from the rocket.

Jeff Bezos' space company calls off debut launch of massive new rocket in final minutes of countdown
 
It looks like test 7 of the Starship combo had some serious problems. The booster was once again captured successfully by the Chopstix. But, the new version 2 Starship was lost near the shutdown time for its engines. No doubt we will hear more about this in the next few weeks.
 
The videos of the pieces coming in over the Caribbean are impressive. I sure hope no one was injured from this debris. I wonder if SpaceX will be in deep trouble now with the FAA (well, until Musk gets into his quasi office).

Even if they supposedly have the path for these rockets go over mostly ocean areas, eventually (especially with a "Rapid Unscheduled Disassembly" event), debris from these could go over populated areas. That "looks" like that it is going right over top of the Turks and Caicos. I am sort of surprised they haven't killed a few people already, with the propensity to RUD occasionally.
 
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I don't see anything on the news today but apparently the New Glenn rocket second stage and payload successfully went into orbit but the first stage did not land on the recovery ship. Hopefully there will be some competition to Space X since Boeing seemingly has gone into hibernation with their space entry.
 
A couple of screen captures.

The "beautiful" disassembly caught by islanders:
1737116063271.png


A triangular piece of the rocket is flapping in the breeze. Many are speculating this resulted in the subsequent "disassembly"
1737116244356.png
 
Of course, many of the posters on the SpaceX X feed are hoping for failure and continued failures. Say what you will about Musk, at least those posts have not been sanitized. There are there for everyone to see. Musk even reposted a few of the failure videos from the islanders.

I've been busy and just got to see this today and was wondering if it would be scrubbed away. This is just one post speculating. There are other captures people found speculating on the cause in other parts of the rocket video.

As an engineer, I wonder what it would be like if I had a couple of billion people speculating on my failures. It was bad enough having my boss speculate and point at me. :)
 
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Apparently there is an exclusion zone for aircraft along the path of the ascent. One YouTuber (Marcus House, I think) showed a chart with aircraft tracks diverting or circling to stay out of it. He also speculated that maybe they should have let it fall in one piece, rather than self-destruct. His analysis was that's what probably happened when the engines failed.

The failure was due to a fuel and/or Oxygen leak. Whether that was caused by that flapping piece of the hull isn't clear. I can't tell if that's structural steel or some coating. There's one shot where you can actually see flame inside the hinge pin of one of the fins.

As for speculating on failure, Musk seems to thrive on it. Any publicity is good publicity I suppose. And you can't argue that his "move fast and break things" approach hasn't been successful. So far. I'm glad we have Blue Origin as a backup though.
 
From the SpaceX comment on X.

Starship experienced a rapid unscheduled disassembly
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JoeWras said:
Of course, many of the posters on the SpaceX X feed are hoping for failure and continued failures. Say what you will about Musk, at least those posts have not been sanitized. There are there for everyone to see. Musk even reposted a few of the failure videos from the islanders.
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frayne said:
It wasn't a failure; it was a learning experience. People applauding the event just because they dislike Musk are disgusting.
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Anybody who knows how SpaceX works, knows that test to failure is part of their development process.

I have found Teddy Roosevelt’s essay “The Man in the Arena” to be a good thing to read at times like this.

It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds;
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Yeah, they are now focusing on some sort of fire/fuel leak. Musk posted they are focusing on that.
 
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