Talk me out of buying a condo in Canada

EastWest Gal

EastWest Gal

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Just for fun, I went on Zillow and looked at condos for sale near ski resorts. I ran across a very small condo in Whistler Village-a studio with a small kitchen, one bath. The building has storage for bikes and skis and a small gym in the builidng, as well as dedicated parking. It is in the heart of Whistler Village, not far from the gondolas. I have family in Washington-sister, BIL, niece and her husband, nephew, and they all ski/snowboard. It would have rental possibilities, though it is very small. The list price is $169K Can, which is about $125K USD. It seems too low. What could be wrong? The kitchen does not have an oven, but it has a small fridge, cooktop, small dishwasher, and a microwave. I'm thinking it could be used as a rental as well.

I'm seriously thinking about reaching out to my sister and niece for them to have a look at it, since I can't travel there at this time.

What do you all think?
 
I would probably try to do a bit of research on the pros and cons of Americans owning Condos in Canada.
 
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I'm a Canadian who hasn't been to Whistler in over 30 years. I only know it's damned expensive. My guess is that C$170K might buy a couple of months of AIRBNB (OK, I exaggerate). It may be legit but tread very very carefully.
 
I didn’t find this exact listing, but other similar listings have HOA payments in the mid $300’s per month.
I also saw someone selling a parking spot for $110,000

There are places selling for less than $100k and their days are market are 6 months. Something that makes me wonder why.
 
The HOA fees are $339/month Canadian, and includes water, sewer, front desk/security, and some other things I can't find right now. Also, there are three condos in the building that are for sale-the other two are slightly bigger and significantly better. DS is a snowboard instructor for Vail Resorts in the winter, and my niece and her husband are avid skiers. I think he has duel citizenship.
 
There should be rental data available, but something about days on market and multiple listings at this price point would have me investigating further. Resort towns are notoriously cyclical.
 
Whistler has a summer ski season when snow permits, as well as lots of outdoor activities in the summer. I visited a couple of years ago and DS and several family members stayed there a couple of months ago.

We're kind of in BTD mode, given how much our portfolio has increased since retirement, but something like this could pay for itself as a rental as well. It could also turn into something DS and my niece's family could benefit from. I'll probably spend some time looking into it.
 
Based on the information provided, if I had to wager a guess I'd say there's a "special assessment" for a new roof, structural repairs or some other major expense that's already baked into the prices.
 
CO-guy said:
Based on the information provided, if I had to wager a guess I'd say there's a "special assessment" for a new roof, structural repairs or some other major expense that's already baked into the prices.
Click to expand...
That might be evident in the reserve study.
 
If your intent is to rent make sure to look into any restrictions or license requirements for short term rentals (<30 days).
 
Looks like a beautiful place!!! I would never talk you out of it and if you can have your sister take a look at it that would be great. Like other have said I would use an attorney for the transfer of property in exchange for payment.

I don't believe you would ever lose anything when you go to sell again. Get the details and find the hidden expenses if any and then make your choice. Good Luck and keep us posted, please.
 
I had to look...
I don't really understand what phase II ownership means, but this is what a quick search found:

Phase II ownership in Whistler refers to a restrictive covenant placed on the title of condo-hotel properties, limiting the owner's personal use to 28 days in the winter and 28 days in the summer (56 days total per year).
  • Rental Pool & Revenue: When not personally occupied, the unit is automatically placed in a hotel-managed rental pool. Owners earn a percentage of the gross rental revenue from the entire building, minus operating expenses and an FF&E reserve.
  • Management: Owners must use the hotel’s front desk and management company for all bookings; self-management or platforms like Airbnb are prohibited.
  • Usage Rules: Personal use dates (Personal Allotted Allowance) must typically be reserved six months in advance. Close-in reservations are possible only if the hotel’s occupancy is below 80%.
  • Tax & Classification: These properties are generally taxed at a commercial rate, and rental income is classified as business income rather than passive rental income.
  • Key Properties: Major Phase II complexes include the Four Seasons, Westin Resort Whistler, Pan Pacific (Mountainside and Village Centre), and Delta Whistler Village Suites.
 
fosterscik said:
I had to look...
I don't really understand what phase II ownership means, but this is what a quick search found:

Phase II ownership in Whistler refers to a restrictive covenant placed on the title of condo-hotel properties, limiting the owner's personal use to 28 days in the winter and 28 days in the summer (56 days total per year).
  • Rental Pool & Revenue: When not personally occupied, the unit is automatically placed in a hotel-managed rental pool. Owners earn a percentage of the gross rental revenue from the entire building, minus operating expenses and an FF&E reserve.
  • Management: Owners must use the hotel’s front desk and management company for all bookings; self-management or platforms like Airbnb are prohibited.
  • Usage Rules: Personal use dates (Personal Allotted Allowance) must typically be reserved six months in advance. Close-in reservations are possible only if the hotel’s occupancy is below 80%.
  • Tax & Classification: These properties are generally taxed at a commercial rate, and rental income is classified as business income rather than passive rental income.
  • Key Properties: Major Phase II complexes include the Four Seasons, Westin Resort Whistler, Pan Pacific (Mountainside and Village Centre), and Delta Whistler Village Suites.
Click to expand...
If these are partial ownership condos, the prices begin to make sense.
 
I was thinking when I saw this thread is that OP is better off owning timeshare at Whistler or trade into there. No maintenance headaches of having a rental or second home. I can easily trade into Whistler (Embarc, now re-labelled as Hilton) which gives you full kitchen, 2br/2ba villa, during the summer and some weeks of winter.
 
latexman said:
Does that mean it’s a . . . “timeshare”? 😱
Click to expand...
Timeshare is not for everyone but it can be the best thing for people who know how to use them. I own enough to stay in a nice Westin/Marriott or equivalent, in a 2Bedroom/2Bathroom villa for two to three months, which we usually do in the winter and summer. It takes time to learn how to get the value out of it, through direct booking and exchanging. My annual maintenance fees is around $14K a year, and I get back about $5K because I rent out a couple of weeks, so my true cost is only about $9K a year. You cannot stay in nice 4-star resort with full amenities for 2 to 3 months with $9K. $9K often gets you a week or two if you pay rack rate to Marriott, or through AirBnB/VRBO.
 
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RetiredHappy said:
Timeshare is not for everyone but it can be the best thing for people who know how to use them. I own enough to stay in a nice Westin/Marriott or equivalent, in a 2Bedroom/2Bathroom villa for two to three months, which we usually do in the winter and summer. It takes time to learn how to get the value out of it, through direct booking and exchanging. My annual maintenance fees is around $14K a year, and I get back about $5K because I rent out a couple of weeks, so my true cost is only about $9K a year. You cannot stay in nice 4-star resort with full amenities for 2 to 3 months with $9K. $9K often gets you a week or two if you pay rack rate to Marriott, or through AirBnB/VRBO.
Click to expand...
How do you rent out your timeshare? Every time I've looked into it, there is a scam involved.
fosterscik said:
I had to look...
I don't really understand what phase II ownership means, but this is what a quick search found:

Phase II ownership in Whistler refers to a restrictive covenant placed on the title of condo-hotel properties, limiting the owner's personal use to 28 days in the winter and 28 days in the summer (56 days total per year).
  • Rental Pool & Revenue: When not personally occupied, the unit is automatically placed in a hotel-managed rental pool. Owners earn a percentage of the gross rental revenue from the entire building, minus operating expenses and an FF&E reserve.
  • Management: Owners must use the hotel’s front desk and management company for all bookings; self-management or platforms like Airbnb are prohibited.
  • Usage Rules: Personal use dates (Personal Allotted Allowance) must typically be reserved six months in advance. Close-in reservations are possible only if the hotel’s occupancy is below 80%.
  • Tax & Classification: These properties are generally taxed at a commercial rate, and rental income is classified as business income rather than passive rental income.
  • Key Properties: Major Phase II complexes include the Four Seasons, Westin Resort Whistler, Pan Pacific (Mountainside and Village Centre), and Delta Whistler Village Suites.
Click to expand...
This is great information. The building is a lower tier phase 2 hotel, which is probably why several condos are on the market and the price is so low. Given that we have quite a bit of family in Washington who love skiing, and DS now working for Vail as a snowboard instructor, it might be a decent thing to look into. both Phase I and Phase II properties routinely available on the market. I loved our previous visits to Whistler, and we would all like to go there more.

No rush though.
 
So you would not be buying a condo, but two months in a condo each year? That sounds like far less of a deal.

Still, if your sister is willing to do the recon, I'd ask her to go and inquire and spend the time for a day, and then see.

Worst case, you have trouble selling it after you realize it's not that good for you.

eta, looks like it's 189cad now, and someone nearby is selling a literal parking space for $110?
 
I briefly looked into Whistler condos several years ago. We love to ski and our oldest son and his family are in Seattle, so logistically it made sense. I can’t remember the specifics, but I discovered a pretty significant Canadian tax that was assessed on foreign property owners - something like 25% of the purchase price. Probably pretty easy to research.
 
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