Wine - Discussion, Travel & More

[CosmicDreamer]

I'm not sure if this is the right thread, but I just returned from a walk on the Camino Portuguese. As a general comment, while walking in the smaller towns, it was very hard to spend more than 6 euros on a bottle of really good wine (e.g. Duro region wines). One bottle of Vino Verde would set you back 1.75 Euros. After walking all day by myself, one trick I used was to buy a bottle of wine and put out 6 glasses at my albergue. Pretty soon I had 5+ new friends.

But at the end of the walk I had 2 days in Porto. I can highly recommend, especially for tours of the Port producers (Taylor, Sandeman, etc.) but I visited a place that has been owned by the Portuguese for a long long time.

Wow, that sounds like an amazing experience! I’m impressed by your adventurous spirit and your clever way of making new friends. I agree, the wine prices are incredible. I’ve heard great things about Porto and the Douro regions, they are on my bucket list too. Thanks for sharing your story!

 

[brett]

For the past two years our local liquer stores have had amazing prices on Argentinian Mendoza region Malbecs and Cabs. My preference. They are excellent. But they do vary between label. Not certain if this is because of their monetary challenges.

Also getting some excellent prices on Portugese wines from time to time. Less frequently Spanish and Italian.

If it is good, and the price is right, I will buy two cases.

Canadian, US, and French seem to be comparatively much more expensive in our stores. Cannot remember when I bought a bottle(s).

 

[2017ish]

Currently on a two month exploration of New Zealand. Binging on wine tasting. They have a lot more to offer than what we see on offer in the States (Not just different varieties in addition to sauvignon Blanc and Pinot noir, but entire regions that we were unaware of until planning for this trip.)

Martinborough region, as well as the Pegasus Bay vineyard near Christchurch, have been eye opening in a good way.

 

[2017ish]

...

The episode I watched was on Lanzarote, which is not very green, covered in volcanic ash.

However, they managed to grow all kinds of produce and of course harvest a lot from the sea.

They grow a blanc wine from green grapes which are watered only by condensation at night.

But instead of planting traditional rows of vineyards, they have these circular stone or brick structures around each vine.

https://www.spain.info/en/discover-spain/vineyards-volcanoes-lanzarote/

Yes, those wines were quite good.

Interestingly, the islands as a whole avoided phylloxera, so there are a lot of "new/old" varietals. I should have updated my first post, which dealt only with our first tasting experience.

The Canaries have good and unusual wines and were a fun wine trip! (And as you say, Lanzarote vineyards were mind blowing.)

 

[explanade]

Currently on a two month exploration of New Zealand. Binging on wine tasting. They have a lot more to offer than what we see on offer in the States (Not just different varieties in addition to sauvignon Blanc and Pinot noir, but entire regions that we were unaware of until planning for this trip.)

Martinborough region, as well as the Pegasus Bay vineyard near Christchurch, have been eye opening in a good way.

NZ wines are surprisingly high priced.

I don't think you will fine many NZ wines at Costco or Trader Joe's. Seems like they're not going for the high-volume value market at all.

Do you think they're worth the price?

Oh I thought you wrote Marlborough region, which has the high-priced wines. I don't know Martinborough.

I don't generally visit vineyards but the only one I've been to, a couple of times, is Ripon Vineyards in Wanaka. I went for the view of the vineyards with Lake Wanaka in the background.

I did try to sample their wines, seemed okay but they were around at least $50 a bottle. Not NZD but USD.

 

[audreyh1]

NZ wines are surprisingly high priced.

I don't think you will fine many NZ wines at Costco or Trader Joe's. Seems like they're not going for the high-volume value market at all.

Do you think they're worth the price?

Oh I thought you wrote Marlborough region, which has the high-priced wines. I don't know Martinborough.

I don't generally visit vineyards but the only one I've been to, a couple of times, is Ripon Vineyards in Wanaka. I went for the view of the vineyards with Lake Wanaka in the background.

I did try to sample their wines, seemed okay but they were around at least $50 a bottle. Not NZD but USD.

There is NZ Sauvignon Blanc from Marlborough in our Costco all the time, and it is cheaper than the French Sancerre (also Sauvignon Blanc). The Marlborough is a Kirkland brand so not expensive.

 

[oiseux]

There is NZ Sauvignon Blanc from Marlborough in our Costco all the time, and it is cheaper than the French Sancerre (also Sauvignon Blanc). The Marlborough is a Kirkland brand so not expensive.

Is that the ubiquitous Kim Crawford, which seems to be the only large grower with a big volume push in the US? I occasionally see others, btw (like Matua). The thread makes me want to return back to New Zealand. To be honest, the wineries took a 3rd row seat to the scenery and adventure. Nothing I would seek out consistently, but I'm willing to try more

Like I never tried the North Island for wine

 

[audreyh1]

Is that the ubiquitous Kim Crawford, which seems to be the only large grower with a big volume push in the US? I occasionally see others, btw (like Matua). The thread makes me want to return back to New Zealand. To be honest, the wineries took a 3rd row seat to the scenery and adventure. Nothing I would seek out consistently, but I'm willing to try more

Like I never tried the North Island for wine

Looks like it’s from Ti Point vineyard. https://www.reversewinesnob.com/kirkland-signature-marlborough-sauvignon-blanc

 

[2017ish]

...The thread makes me want to return back to New Zealand. To be honest, the wineries took a 3rd row seat to the scenery and adventure. ...

That's understandable, and is true for us as well. (Currently in Mount Cook national Park!). The only way we would taste 200 wines here (projected number), is by not being in a hurry to leave. ?

We also have a booking at Ripon in Wanaka (I think in a couple of weeks, on our second stay there?). The scenery is indeed a draw for that one.

You mentioned Marlborough, which is renowned for Sauvignon Blanc, and easily obtained in the USA. Unfortunately, not our favorite style, as it tends to be too "in your face" for us. Martinborough is more our style, but comparatively, it is microproduction and difficult to get in USA.

 

[Ginny]

I love dry red wines. A Costco Wine buyer said to purchase them from Italy and not CA, as Italy has less sun so the wine is dryer. I avoid CA wines as DH & I left the state in 2018! ;>)

 

[audreyh1]

The driest red wines to me are from France, particularly the Bordeaux region. Italy and Spain are good too. Think in general the French version of any particular style tends to be drier.

 

[USGrant1962]

We're going to an interesting wine tasting a week from Sunday. It is a Riedel Sensory Workshop at a local winery. It is a little pricey at $120, but you take home 4 Riedel Performance wine glasses that go for ~$89 plus tax for two. I've always liked Riedels and we have a lot of them, but all in the Ouverture or DSG lines. It will be fun to do a tasting and walk out with some even higher end wine glasses at a bargain price.

https://www.riedel.com/en-us/collections/riedel-performance

 

[Winemaker]

I am trying to understand the conversation about dryness above. In winemaking, dryness refers to the amount of residual sugar after fermentation. Good California wines are picked at their peak ripeness, where the sugar content is 25-27 Brix and acids are low (say 3.6-3.8pH). Some wine yeasts, even is super healthy during fermentation, can go as 16% alcohol, but rarely go that far, as the toxic high alcohol kills them off. The higher end Zinfandels are a prime example of this, but in order to have a balanced wine the pH may be 3.4-3.5. (Think homemade lemonade) The higher alcohol may also provide a sweetness, too, in it's flavor profile.

French grapes, OTOH, rarely get as ripe as California, perhaps to 22 or23 brix, and their acids are 3.3-3.5pH. So in order to achieve a mor balanced wine, the winemaker may stop his fermentation early, to leave some residual sugar. Again, think homemade lemonade.

Now. perhaps your "dryness" term refers to the tannins in the wine from the oak barrels. Obviously, a French wine stands a better chance of being aged in a French oak barrel which is much more softer than a wine aged in American oak. American oak barrels tend to be somewhat harsher, but always the case. Silver Oak used Oak from Missouri and it is a fine product. They just started a new line using French Oak called Timeless Napa Valley.

So I guess I'm asking if you are associating dryness with residual sugar, acidity or the tannins?

 

[DrRoy]

So I guess I'm asking if you are associating dryness with residual sugar, acidity or the tannins?

I personally associate it with tannins. I like pinot noirs but not cabs or zins.

 

[Flyfish1]

Ok so not a new experience but...
On a ( you guessed it- fly fishing ) trip to Chile a few years ago I was introduced to Carmenere wines by the lodge host. Not a well known varietal apparently, not easily found in most stores and online sites. But it's out there and I absolutely adore it. Here is a little bit from Wikipedia: Carménère - Wikipedia
Like many varietals it has a very interesting history. Please give it a try.

 

[COcheesehead]

Ok so not a new experience but...
On a ( you guessed it- fly fishing ) trip to Chile a few years ago I was introduced to Carmenere wines by the lodge host. Not a well known varietal apparently, not easily found in most stores and online sites. But it's out there and I absolutely adore it. Here is a little bit from Wikipedia: Carménère - Wikipedia
Like many varietals it has a very interesting history. Please give it a try.

It’s out there. It’s a well known wine of Chile, but most smaller wine stores will only stash a bottle or two in the obscure South American section. Bigger shops should carry more options.
I’ve had some really good ones from the Maipo Valley

Maipo Valley - Chilean Wine Region | Wine-Searcher

Most Popular Maipo Valley wines: the region, the grapes, the producers and the best prices for the wines.

www.wine-searcher.com

 

[Flyfish1]

My little mom and pop wine store will always have 3 or 4 bottles. Lately I found that wine.com carries some. I enjoy the wines from Maipo Valley as well Colchagua Valley. Cheers!

 

[YellowSubmarine]

Shiraz is what got me into wines about 15 years ago. Until then it was Chardonnay on special occasions. I drink good cheap wines. I find the Winking Owl Shiraz at Aldi very good but not excellent. For excellent I must pay 10-fold. But it's not 10x better.
At the Florida State Fair about 10 years ago, there was a huge wine competition. Hilarious (to me) the Oak Leaf brand from Walmart scored two or three top positions. After talking to a few judges (there were many), I concluded that expectation and anticipation plays a big role in wine enjoyment. I know there are rot-gut varieties out there; but the point is cost does not dictate the quality and pleasure of a wine experience.

 

[Winemaker]

Carmenere, is the gem of Chile, as is Malbec from Argentina. For years, it was mistaken as a Merlot offshoot, but when they started doing DNA testing for grapes, they discovered it was Carmenere. Carmenere has a slight green pepper finish, from the pyrazines in the ripe grape. It is part of the grape's flavor profile, but is often considered a fault in other dry reds.

 

[COcheesehead]

Carmenere, is the gem of Chile, as is Malbec from Argentina. For years, it was mistaken as a Merlot offshoot, but when they started doing DNA testing for grapes, they discovered it was Carmenere. Carmenere has a slight green pepper finish, from the pyrazines in the ripe grape. It is part of the grape's flavor profile, but is often considered a fault in other dry reds.

Yes, some can be real ‘green’ while others come across very spiced and savory. I find the cheaper ones have more of the green notes.

 

[brett]

We spent five weeks wondering around Portugal. I was surprised at the quality/price ratio of many wines. Our go to store was the Pingo Doce food chain. They had a great selection from all over Portugal.

More that once I did the same routine as I have done in Italy and other countries to overcome the language barrier.

I hold up 2 different bottles to a local or the wine clerk. Each immediately understands my gesture.. They either point to one of two bottles. Twice I had a customer or clerk shake is his/her head and point to an altogether different bottle on the shelf. And it was invariably a good choice...at least to my taste!

 

[COcheesehead]

We spent five weeks wondering around Portugal. I was surprised at the quality/price ratio of many wines. Our go to store was the Pingo Doce food chain. They had a great selection from all over Portugal.

More that once I did the same routine as I have done in Italy and other countries to overcome the language barrier.

I hold up 2 different bottles to a local or the wine clerk. Each immediately understands my gesture.. They either point to one of two bottles. Twice I had a customer or clerk shake is his/her head and point to an altogether different bottle on the shelf. And it was invariably a good choice...at least to my taste!

That’s awesome!

 

[audreyh1]

We spent five weeks wondering around Portugal. I was surprised at the quality/price ratio of many wines. Our go to store was the Pingo Doce food chain. They had a great selection from all over Portugal.

More that once I did the same routine as I have done in Italy and other countries to overcome the language barrier.

I hold up 2 different bottles to a local or the wine clerk. Each immediately understands my gesture.. They either point to one of two bottles. Twice I had a customer or clerk shake is his/her head and point to an altogether different bottle on the shelf. And it was invariably a good choice...at least to my taste!

Never thought of that. What a great idea!

 

[DrRoy]

Carmenere, is the gem of Chile, as is Malbec from Argentina. For years, it was mistaken as a Merlot offshoot, but when they started doing DNA testing for grapes, they discovered it was Carmenere. Carmenere has a slight green pepper finish, from the pyrazines in the ripe grape. It is part of the grape's flavor profile, but is often considered a fault in other dry reds.

We discovered Carmenere in Chile on a trip there. Have gotten some at home after that, but I still lean toward pinot noir.

 

[Rieslingfan]

Oh gosh...a wine discussion. If it wasn't for my buying problem (!) I would have retired 5 years earlier. Now I have to make sure I live long enough to drink it all, plus what I inherited from my dad's cellar!